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Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: 3d
Date: March 30, 2012 09:39AM
I'm in the process of remodeling a kitchen.

Is placing a toaster oven on the counter with upper cabinets 18" above ok? Do i need a heat shield of some sort on the underside of the upper cabinets to protect it from rising heat? For the 2 minute toast it's no biggie. But sometimes my wife heats up frozen food in there using convection feature. It gets quite hot. Should i plan to raise the upper cabinets to 24inches instead of standard 18?

I don't have the manual for it.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: davester
Date: March 30, 2012 09:39AM
No heat shield needed.




"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: 3d
Date: March 30, 2012 09:45AM
Quote
davester
No heat shield needed.

At both 18" and 24" height for upper cabinets?
The toaster oven is about 12" high.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: mattkime
Date: March 30, 2012 09:49AM
If you've turned it up enough to need shielding, its probably going to destroy itself.





VTPKL it!
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: Robert M
Date: March 30, 2012 09:55AM
Davester,

My family has used a toaster oven/broiler or countertop convection oven (that doubles as a toaster oven/broiler) of some kind for as long as I can remember. So, we're talking several makes and models for at least 30+ years. They absolutely _can_ produce a significant amount of heat and I'd be concerned about possible long-term damage to the cabinets, undercabinet lighting and spoilage of food stored in said cabinetry.

A bare cabinet may not suffer much. The underside will get hot and can even transfer through to the contents of jars, boxes, bags and such stored in the cabinet. No doubt because I've seen it happen more times than I can count. However, it's not going to catch fire. That has never happened in my kitchen or my family's kitchen. I'd definitely be extra concerned if you have undercabinet lighting. The plastics used on the covers of the lighting may not hold up as well as bare wood.

My method:

The depth of the countertop is greater than the depth of the wall cabinets. So, pull the toaster oven/broiler/convection oven to the edge of the counter. As the heat rises, most will rise in front of the cabinets. The cabinetry will still get warm/hot but not as warm/hot as they would if the toaster over/broiler/convection oven was directly beneath them.

Other suggestions... Always unplug toaster over/broiler/convection oven when you're not using it and clean the crumb tray regularly. Cleaning the tray is important because crumbs can burn up and/or attract pets over time.

Robert
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: 3d
Date: March 30, 2012 10:11AM
Thanks for the insight Robert.
Damn, so my wife was right angry smiley

Lower cabinet is 24" deep.
Upper cabinets are 12" deep.
Microwave shelf in upper cabinets is 20" deep.

My original plan was to put the 12" high toaster oven on the counter under the 20" deep microwave shelf, which is 18" above the counter. I thought aesthetically it was a good spot to put both appliances there.

She says that because the microwave shelf in the upper cabinet comes out so much from the wall, putting the toaster oven in that spot would not be good because the rising heat is blocked by the protruding MW shelf.

I thought maybe if i put a simple heat shield like a sheet of stainless steel screwed to the underside of the MW shelf it'll be ok.

I just use it for toast. She uses it for cooking and reheating for longer cooking times and higher temps. I guess I'll listen to the wife and find another spot for the toaster oven.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: 3d
Date: March 30, 2012 10:18AM
Ohh.. i forgot to mention, we were planning to get white painted cabinets. So that's why I sound concerned. I don't want scorch marks or anything on the brand new cabs if i can help it!
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: March 30, 2012 10:20AM
no fire possibility from typicla woods, but I suppose it could melt some adhesives if they are nearby.

mine is on my counter (granite) and cabinets above (cherry) and near a painted surface and an elec outlet. It does get quite hot when I use it for broiling but I'd be more concerned about the wiring in the wall heating up in an old house (mine) than I would about combustion from the actual unit.



“When I was 5 years old, my mother always told me that happiness was the key to life. When I went to school, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up. I wrote down ‘happy.’ They told me I didn’t understand the assignment, and I told them they didn’t understand life.”
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: davester
Date: March 30, 2012 10:31AM
Unless specifically noted on the instructions, toaster ovens are zero clearance devices, and many of them have the option of being installed as built-ins in wooden cabinets. That said, perishable foodstuffs above are going to suffer, and removing plastic light fixtures above is just a no brainier. They do get hot to the touch, and might affect the wood finish, but shouldn't be a hazard.

That said, if you want to install a heat shield, thermodynamic properties of materials say that it should be a piece of aluminum, not steel, and have an air gap both above and below to be effective. A piece of stainless screwed flush to the cabinets is not going to stop any heat transmission.




"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/30/2012 10:33AM by davester.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: March 30, 2012 10:32AM
A nice little white ceramic tile backsplash moving up under the cabinets would work, and look cute besides.

It's important to note that only kids, dogs, and drunks usually ever see the underside of your cabinets.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: GGD
Date: March 30, 2012 11:09AM
Quote
3d
Damn, so my wife was right angry smiley

That's always the correct response, doesn't matter what the question or answer is.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: Robert M
Date: March 30, 2012 11:09AM
Davester,

I don't know about the toaster ovens you have but they aren't necessarily zero clearance items. A quick glance at some of the manuals provided by Black and Decker for their toaster ovens dictates allowing a clearance of X amount of space.

Some of the newer models are designed so that you must allow clearance. For example, the Black and Decker Convection oven my wife and I have has a doojigger on the back of it that sticks out at least two or so inches. So, you have no choice but to allow clearance.

I'd absolutely allow for clearance even if the manual doesn't suggest it in the safety precautions. It's common sense.

Robert
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: 3d
Date: March 30, 2012 11:48AM
Interesting discussion. Thanks guys!

Found this online in the automotive department. Never knew it existed. Maybe adhere some of this on the underside of the upper cabinet above the toaster oven.

[www.amazon.com]
$18.75

Aluminized Heat Barrier is made up of woven silica with a flexible aluminized finish; the highly reflective surface of the material is capable of withstanding radiant temperatures in excess of 2000 degrees Fahrenheit

The adhesive backed composite construction material can easily be applied to any surface or wrapped around a hose or wire to make a clean professional appearance

Some Typical uses include: firewall, hoods, hoses, doors and anywhere you want to control radiant heat





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/30/2012 11:49AM by 3d.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: Z
Date: March 30, 2012 11:49AM
We've got ours enclosed in a small space, and have yet to burn down the kitchen (though we've tried, I promise.) That said, I would make sure that you aren't going to inadvertently melt the electrical cord if the outlet is directly behind the toaster oven. I saw that happening at work one day, and quickly used a safety sticky to alert the office. Cord wasn't melted through to the wires, but the sheathing was certainly deformed.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: davester
Date: March 30, 2012 11:49AM
Quote
Robert M

Some of the newer models are designed so that you must allow clearance. For example, the Black and Decker Convection oven my wife and I have has a doojigger on the back of it that sticks out at least two or so inches. So, you have no choice but to allow clearance.

I'd absolutely allow for clearance even if the manual doesn't suggest it in the safety precautions. It's common sense.

Robert, I think we're talking semantics. The doojigger is part of the toaster oven and makes it unnecessary to allow further clearance, hence it is a zero clearance appliance (at least in that direction). If the instruction manual says to allow clearance to the top and/or sides, then you are correct that it is not a zero clearance oven. However, allowing clearance in addition to that required by the manual is not necessary.

I agree with your common sense recommendation, though assuming that the 6" clearance specified in the OP is within the bounds of the owners manual installation instructions I don't think there's anything to worry about other than warming up the foods in the upper cabinet.




"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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No.
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: March 30, 2012 01:45PM
Not for the circumstances you describe.

As mentioned, I'd keep plastic clear, but that's about it. I've used a toaster and toaster oven (just not for toast) under a cabinet for years, and haven't even discolored the bottom of the cabinet. Not that anybody would see that anyway.

The clearance between my toaster and the cabinets is almost exactly the same as yours.

You could probably get a toaster oven (probably not a toaster) hot enough, long enough to damage the bottom of a cabinet, but I wouldn't bother eating whatever you were cooking.

This presupposes you already took the battery out of your smoke alarm.



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Re: No.
Posted by: mikebw
Date: March 30, 2012 03:34PM
Only thing I've melted with my toaster oven was a plastic bag that got left on top. It said SAFEWAY for a few years until I finally got it cleaned off.
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: Robert M
Date: March 31, 2012 10:25AM
Davester,

Definitely not talking semantics. I've enough experience with these small kitchen appliances to say without a doubt people should allow more clearance than the manual dictates. If this means going beyond the manufacturer's recommendations, so be it.

Consider... Why would Black and Decker build the doojigger onto the back of my convection oven? Clearly, they felt clearance was necessary and that it was the only way to ensure people allowed for it. For me, it's not an issue since I have a tile backsplash. That's not necessarily the case with everyone's kitchen.

Robert
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Re: Do you have a toaster oven on the kitchen counter? Heat shield needed?
Posted by: srekstad
Date: October 15, 2013 09:31PM
My cabinet was so heat blistered I started this product line just for that. Please take a look: Thanks.

ToasterShield
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