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Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Bimwad
Date: November 08, 2014 01:48AM
[www.panic.com]

Slowly, but surely all of the Mac clients have, or will die.

I can't think of any readers left in development, not counting the specialized toolz.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: eustacetilley
Date: November 08, 2014 03:15AM
" The market for a Usenet client in 2014 isn’t exactly huge."

Usenet was never supposed to be a commercial "market". Very much the opposite. There are still ways around these jerks.
Let's hear it for the "specialized toolz".

I wonder if any here made it all the way from comp.sys.mac, to dealmac, and then to MRF unscathed.

Does anybody else here remember Chuq?

¬Eustace
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Stavs
Date: November 08, 2014 08:09AM
Well that sucks.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: JoeH
Date: November 08, 2014 10:08AM
Don't recall the name Chuq, but read and posted in the Usenet groups including the various Mac ones for years before finding the original dealmac site. Kept up with them until the usenet feed was shut off here at the university about 10 years ago. Tried keeping up with a few groups through google, but their interface was unwieldy and has not gotten any better in the years since.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Chakravartin
Date: November 08, 2014 10:28AM
'Felt like borderline abandonware for quite awhile.

It hasn't seen a significant update in years. Just a bug fix here and there. Never got back the missing features from the original Unison after the jump to v2...

Still, the best Usenet client for the Mac by a mile. Gonna struggle to find a replacement when it stops working.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: freeradical
Date: November 08, 2014 10:32AM
What are the system requirements for this version?
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: davemchine
Date: November 08, 2014 10:39AM
When I was in college I read various usenet groups every day. I remember the outcry when AOL granted access to usenet. Over time people migrated from usenet to web forums. Are there any active discussions happening on usenet? I thought it had become a place for downloading porn, movies and pirated software.

Does anybody remember using tin?
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Speedy
Date: November 08, 2014 10:43AM
[www.usenet-mac.com]

I still like MT Newswatcher.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: freeradical
Date: November 08, 2014 10:49AM
Quote
Speedy
[www.usenet-mac.com]

I still like MT Newswatcher.

I like it too. It has extraordinarily powerful filtering capabilities. You can even use regular expressions in your filters. Nothing else comes close to MT-Newswatcher when it comes to filtering. Unfortunately, I don't think you can use NZBs with it, and you can't do batch uploads with it.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: deckeda
Date: November 08, 2014 11:05AM
Never could get Unison to upload, and Tim there didn't have a solution. Many of the others are either download only it have weaker upload features. One of the few times I needed Windows.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Article Accelerator
Date: November 08, 2014 11:22AM
Quote
eustacetilley
I wonder if any here made it all the way from comp.sys.mac, to dealmac, and then to MRF unscathed.

I'm the one. I used to love comp.sys.mac.advocacy.

Quote

Does anybody else here remember Chuq?

I do.

[www.linkedin.com]
[www.chuqui.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2014 11:23AM by Article Accelerator.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: TheCaber
Date: November 08, 2014 01:46PM
I have been using Thunderbird as a news reader. It works, but.
* it has a wonky, undocumented keyboard interface
* it balances the lack of key UI with 2- and 3-level menu picks
* there does not appear to be a way to bind keys to frequently used menu action items
* message saving is bizarre at best.
* every saved message ends in .eml (WTF? whatever happened to .txt?).
* each message in a thread of discussion is saved as a separate file..concatenation is not an option.

Gravity, for Windows something-or-other, is unsupported, but has an interface that is closest to the news readers of old (late 70's, early 80's), and does not sport Mozilla's 'we do it all for you in our inimitable fashion, whether you like it or not, so there' attitude.

The apps discussed above are centered more on downloading from the bin.* binaries hierarchy rather than participating in topic discussions.

There are some active corners of the Usenet even now, 40+ years on, but there are also a lot of moribund newsgroups still listed with no one, not even crickets, chirping. The active ones I like to follow are

alt.os.development
alt.os.linux
alt.sysadmin.recovery
rec.games.corewar
comp.arch
comp.lang.c
comp.lang.javascript
comp.misc
comp.unix.programmer
comp.unix.shell
rec.audio.tech
rec.audio.tubes
sci.crypt
(there are others, but they are moribund)

Free signup Usenet servers at nntp.aioe.org and news.eternal-september.org have the full forest of news trees, reasonably fast download, and seem to be always available.

I think the reason I like to hang out here at MRF is that it is as stunningly broad in the range of topics discussed (and in the generally high quality of the information presented) as any subset of the Usenet, then or now.

Thank you, everone!



=TC
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: IronMac
Date: November 08, 2014 02:17PM
Quote
eustacetilley
" The market for a Usenet client in 2014 isn’t exactly huge."

Usenet was never supposed to be a commercial "market". Very much the opposite. There are still ways around these jerks.
Let's hear it for the "specialized toolz".

I wonder if any here made it all the way from comp.sys.mac, to dealmac, and then to MRF unscathed.

Does anybody else here remember Chuq?

¬Eustace

A. What specialized tools?
B. Wouldn't that reveal your age?

hahaha
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Bimwad
Date: November 08, 2014 03:50PM
I remember Chuq, the Apple listserv overlord.

Though they had their fair share of clowns, the higher barrier of entry of Usenet and listervs kept the level of discussion higher, and the noise lower (especially lists), compared to web forums.

DejaNews did a good job of indexing the whole mess, but I'm still not sure if Google's rescue of it was a good or bad thing. Never got used to using their style of UI.

Time, and people move on. I think the spammers have even gotten tired of Usenet.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: eustacetilley
Date: November 08, 2014 04:50PM
Quote
IronMac
Quote
eustacetilley
" The market for a Usenet client in 2014 isn’t exactly huge."

Usenet was never supposed to be a commercial "market". Very much the opposite. There are still ways around these jerks.
Let's hear it for the "specialized toolz".

I wonder if any here made it all the way from comp.sys.mac, to dealmac, and then to MRF unscathed.

Does anybody else here remember Chuq?

¬Eustace

A. What specialized tools?
B. Wouldn't that reveal your age?

hahaha

Some are specialized indeed, and need quite a toolshop.
If you have access to a Remote Shell account on a system that provides Netnews, you just need Telnet, available stock in the OSX Terminal, or one of the various third party Desktop versions.
That's what I did for many years.

You can download and compile tin, an open-source threaded Newsreader, in the Terminal, and access direct Netnews feeds that way.

Two feeds mentioned above, news.eternal-september.org, and nntp.aioe.org, appear to be down.

Google Groups is pretty bad, but it does provide some access, if you know your way around. I see that comp.sys.apollo hasn't had a relevant post since last year.


Astound killed their nntp server a couple of years ago; some ISPs still have them, but they may not necessarily publicize the fact. Do a traceroute on nntp.yourisp.com, and see what happens.

I will not, out of principle, pay a dime extra for USENET access. I didn't get a dime for all that I contributed early on, and rarely did anybody else. (I wrote some User Guides and worked on a couple of commitees. I can't remember exact dates, 1981-1991 is still fuzzy, (Owlshift...), but I was using a Sun 2/50 at the time.)
(I also pushed hard for rec.humor.objectivism, but some people had no sense of humor.)

¬Eustace
(Edited- I forgot to mention that I was never interested in the Binaries Newsgroups. Some people are, and perhaps for them the Commercial alternatives are appropriate.)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/08/2014 05:00PM by eustacetilley.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: rz
Date: November 08, 2014 06:54PM
Quote
Speedy
[www.usenet-mac.com]

I still like MT Newswatcher.

It's the only reason I bought Parallels... so I could run a VM of Snow Leopard so I can still run MT-Newswatcher. I really wish Simon Fraser wouldn't have abandoned it. The only problem I have with it is the ridiculous limit of 100,000 headers at a time. Some groups get over a million headers a day, and if you don't keep up with it, it can take hours just to go through the headers.

I have been using a trial version of Unison for NZBs. Guess I can get a non-trial version now. I've also used Pan running under X11. I haven't been able to get it to work under Mavericks yet though. It's decent, and can do NZBs.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: fauch
Date: November 08, 2014 07:15PM
The best pr0n and warez is still on Usenet!!! Go UUencode!!!!
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Bimwad
Date: November 08, 2014 07:50PM
Quote
rz
It's the only reason I bought Parallels... so I could run a VM of Snow Leopard so I can still run MT-Newswatcher. I really wish Simon Fraser wouldn't have abandoned it. The only problem I have with it is the ridiculous limit of 100,000 headers at a time. Some groups get over a million headers a day, and if you don't keep up with it, it can take hours just to go through the headers.

Thoth can handle hundreds of thousands of headers. It also springs from Norstad's Newswatcher tree, so the capability is there.

The only problem is that the developer can be described as, at best, eccentric, at worst, psychotic, often wavering between the two.

But it, too, has ceased development (at least for now), and there's no way to obtain new licenses.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: rz
Date: November 09, 2014 10:46AM
Quote
Bimwad
Quote
rz
It's the only reason I bought Parallels... so I could run a VM of Snow Leopard so I can still run MT-Newswatcher. I really wish Simon Fraser wouldn't have abandoned it. The only problem I have with it is the ridiculous limit of 100,000 headers at a time. Some groups get over a million headers a day, and if you don't keep up with it, it can take hours just to go through the headers.

Thoth can handle hundreds of thousands of headers. It also springs from Norstad's Newswatcher tree, so the capability is there.

The only problem is that the developer can be described as, at best, eccentric, at worst, psychotic, often wavering between the two.

But it, too, has ceased development (at least for now), and there's no way to obtain new licenses.

I tried Thoth. Basically a blatent ripoff of MT-Newswatcher. The guy took free code, made some changes, then charged for it. And yes, the "developer" Brian is/was a bit of a nut case. I tried to buy a license once and encountered outright hostility from him. He was upset that his software, which many were using to download "warez" was having its serial number put out there. This was during one of his many periods where he was refusing to sell it anymore. After that, I basically said eff him, even when he relented and started selling it again.

Unison really tried to make usenet "user friendly". But it was a hopeless task. What programs like MT-Newswatcher and Thoth lack in user friendliness, they more than make up for in power and flexibility. If Unison would run into missing parts, many times it would throw an error, and you're SOL. Using MT-Newswatcher on the same site (I use Astraweb, BTW), I can almost always manually resurrect the files.

I figure some day, it just won't be workable to run these programs anymore. I've run Pan on Ubuntu, so that's always an option. Or I'll have to spring for a copy of Windows and run Forte' in a VM. PC users swear by that program.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: Bimwad
Date: November 09, 2014 12:48PM
For binaries, there's no real need for a reader anymore, between the indexing sites and nzb clients. Even the free ones are pretty powerful, can handle multiple servers, and make it a seamless process.
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Re: Usenet users (I know you exist) - Unison EOL'ed and made free
Posted by: BobC
Date: November 13, 2014 09:32PM
Quote
JoeH
Don't recall the name Chuq, but read and posted in the Usenet groups including the various Mac ones for years before finding the original dealmac site. Kept up with them until the usenet feed was shut off here at the university about 10 years ago. Tried keeping up with a few groups through google, but their interface was unwieldy and has not gotten any better in the years since.

Me to- I mean, I agree with this pretty much word-for-word. I learned a lot of useful stuff in the comp.sys.mac.* groups, and some stuff I wish I could unlearn in the alt.* groups. In 1998, I went to a Chicago alt.folklore.urban Halloween party and met a bunch of people I'd only known from their typing. It was pretty much my apotheosis of nerd-dom, and a terrific time.

Bob "I went as Richard Gere" Cradock
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