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Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: ztirffritz
Date: August 13, 2015 04:08PM
[bgr.com]

Quote
BGR
In case you need a reminder, this is what the original Gear S looked like when it launched last year:


And then the Apple Watch came out and it featured a home screen with app icons that looked like this:


And then lo and behold, Samsung’s new smartwatch features a home screen with watch icons that look like this:


What an incredible coincidence.

Soon to be followed by a lawsuit like this:
[www.wired.co.uk]

Quote
Wired
A jury of seven men and two women has just read the Apple v. Samsung verdict to a packed courtroom -- and it was all bad news for Samsung. The Korean electronics giant has been found to infringe all of Apple's utility patents and all but one of the four design patents asserted, and was ordered to pay $1.05 billion (£665 million) in damages to Apple.



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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Article Accelerator
Date: August 13, 2015 04:27PM
Shocking.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Ombligo
Date: August 13, 2015 04:40PM
Frankly the Samsung looks better both in design and ease of use.



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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: pdq
Date: August 13, 2015 04:47PM
Quote
Ombligo
Frankly the Samsung looks better both in design and ease of use.

Meh. I think that little digital-crown thingy on the Apple watch looks like it could be useful.

But they all need a little miniaturization, I think.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: macphanatic
Date: August 13, 2015 04:51PM
Wonder how the lawsuit win will impact Apple stock.

Edit: In reading the article, the release of this watch isn't going to help Samsung. While the watch may be round rather than square, it definitely takes design features from the Apple watch.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/13/2015 04:53PM by macphanatic.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: jdc
Date: August 13, 2015 04:57PM
And now they have Samsung "Pay".

Even the silly "fingerprint" icon looks like iOS.

[www.samsung.com]-



----


Edited 999 time(s). Last edit at 12:08PM by jdc.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: billb
Date: August 13, 2015 05:07PM
I kinda like the Samsung too.
I have no use for either one though.



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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Black
Date: August 13, 2015 05:40PM
Any idea what the new Samsung watch will cost? I don't see it for sale on Amazon etc. I might be in for one at as much as $200 depending on what it does.




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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 13, 2015 05:54PM
This is a "phone" unto itself. It doesn't need to stay with your phone. Standalone. You use your phone to set it up and you can keep it synced. It will have it's own phone number.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: $tevie
Date: August 13, 2015 05:56PM
Eh, forget it. I was just being cranky.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/13/2015 06:05PM by $tevie.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: macphanatic
Date: August 13, 2015 07:14PM
Quote
vision63
This is a "phone" unto itself. It doesn't need to stay with your phone. Standalone. You use your phone to set it up and you can keep it synced. It will have it's own phone number.

And data plan.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 13, 2015 07:30PM
Quote
macphanatic
Quote
vision63
This is a "phone" unto itself. It doesn't need to stay with your phone. Standalone. You use your phone to set it up and you can keep it synced. It will have it's own phone number.

And data plan.

With Sprint, you can add it as a standalone device for $10 per month which includes talk/text/100mb data. Or, you can add it to a Family Data Share Plan for an additional $10 per month. Plus the cost of the device (which you can pay over time).
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Rick-o
Date: August 13, 2015 07:38PM
Gee. I wonder why they didn't stick with last years model? Why did Samsung even bother with that one if the new one was waiting in the wings? dunno smiley



Mr. Lahey: A lot of people, don’t know how to drink. They drink against the grain of the liquor. And when you drink against the grain of the liquor? You lose.

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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 13, 2015 07:51PM
Quote
Rick-o
Gee. I wonder why they didn't stick with last years model? Why did Samsung even bother with that one if the new one was waiting in the wings? dunno smiley

Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it. They're gonna come out with a new stuff every year. They make "multiple" smart watches. Multiple phones, Multiple computers, Multiple televisions, Multiple Refrigerators, Multiple Washers/Dryers, Lighting, Printers, Monitors, DVD players, hard drives, Cameras, every freakin' thing. They don't need to copy anybody to be successful. Everybody that's successful, has to use what they make to work at all.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Rick-o
Date: August 13, 2015 07:52PM
Quote
vision63
Quote
Rick-o
Gee. I wonder why they didn't stick with last years model? Why did Samsung even bother with that one if the new one was waiting in the wings? dunno smiley

Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it. They're gonna come out with a new stuff every year. They make "multiple" smart watches. Multiple phones, Multiple computers, Multiple televisions, Multiple Refrigerators, Multiple Washers/Dryers, Lighting, Printers, Monitors, DVD players, hard drives, Cameras, every freakin' thing. They don't need to copy anybody to be successful. Everybody that's successful, has to use what they make to work at all.

Heh! That didn't take long! smiley-laughing001



Mr. Lahey: A lot of people, don’t know how to drink. They drink against the grain of the liquor. And when you drink against the grain of the liquor? You lose.

Randy: What the @#$%& are you talking about?
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Carnos Jax
Date: August 13, 2015 07:56PM
Quote
vision63
Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it. They're gonna come out with a new stuff every year. They make "multiple" smart watches. Multiple phones, Multiple computers, Multiple televisions, Multiple Refrigerators, Multiple Washers/Dryers, Lighting, Printers, Monitors, DVD players, hard drives, Cameras, every freakin' thing. They don't need to copy anybody to be successful. Everybody that's successful, has to use what they make to work at all.
confused smiley
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 13, 2015 08:37PM
Quote
Carnos Jax
Quote
vision63
Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it. They're gonna come out with a new stuff every year. They make "multiple" smart watches. Multiple phones, Multiple computers, Multiple televisions, Multiple Refrigerators, Multiple Washers/Dryers, Lighting, Printers, Monitors, DVD players, hard drives, Cameras, every freakin' thing. They don't need to copy anybody to be successful. Everybody that's successful, has to use what they make to work at all.
confused smiley

You got try to keep these companies balanced. No good guys, no bad guys. Soviet Union is gone.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: August 13, 2015 09:22PM
Quote
vision63
Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it.

Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.



It is what it is.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: August 13, 2015 09:27PM
Why did Samsung even bother with that one if the new one was waiting in the wings?

Samsung's business model is the Casio/multiple exposure approach- bracket a concept with multiple shapes/sizes, you don't like that one, we got one you might like. Or another. It seems to do ok for them.

I'll get a black Sport but do like a round watch, and hope that Apple will make one, eventually. The shape may involve some compromises, but I'm ok with that.


Frankly the Samsung looks better both in design and ease of use.

I get the subjectivity of the looks, but how do we know it's better in ease of use, the apparent lack of buttons? That may be the case, but I can't see that from looking at that pic. Fewer icons and arranged around the perimeter could be done on the 'Phone as well.




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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 13, 2015 10:01PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
vision63
Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it.

Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.

Icons. Or, you check out the watch. Read about it. Don't do the enemy thing. It's all tech.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 13, 2015 10:04PM
Quote
RAMd®d
Why did Samsung even bother with that one if the new one was waiting in the wings?

Samsung's business model is the Casio/multiple exposure approach- bracket a concept with multiple shapes/sizes, you don't like that one, we got one you might like. Or another. It seems to do ok for them.

I'll get a black Sport but do like a round watch, and hope that Apple will make one, eventually. The shape may involve some compromises, but I'm ok with that.


Frankly the Samsung looks better both in design and ease of use.

I get the subjectivity of the looks, but how do we know it's better in ease of use, the apparent lack of buttons? That may be the case, but I can't see that from looking at that pic. Fewer icons and arranged around the perimeter could be done on the 'Phone as well.

Most of the watches for Android uses Android Wear operating system. This one uses "Tizen" which they created and is exclusive to Samsung. I'm not going to get something that's proprietary. But there are lots of watches. I believe Apple will make other styles. They didn't hire the Burburry exec to sell just one style.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Bimwad
Date: August 13, 2015 10:48PM
Round icons are not unique, and granted, there were already using them in the Tizen refresh they introduced a while ago.

But, one has to consider the source as well.

If it was any other company (well, aside from a couple of the blatant Chinese copiers), one might be able to shrug it off as coincidence.

A serial offender like Samsung...?

The thing that's odd is that Samsung has the resources, has demonstrated that they see the value in good industrial design, and are capable of setting design trends themselves. Their CE division has done it, but the phone division seems to lack the same initiative. If they don't have separate design departments, and only a centralized one, then it falls upon the managers in the phone division.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: RoadToad
Date: August 13, 2015 11:20PM

An oldie but a goodie.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: August 14, 2015 12:06AM
Quote
vision63
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
vision63
Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it.

Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.

Icons. Or, you check out the watch. Read about it. Don't do the enemy thing. It's all tech.

Please. RollingEyesSmiley5

Exactly as it did with its smart phones after Apple released the iPhone, Samsung has copied the Apple Watch interface for its smart watch -- or at least the general gist of it.

I will give Samsung credit for not making its interface an exact copy of Apple's this time, as they did with its smart phone interface. One might infer from this that the company learned a thing or two from its stinging (and expensive) courtroom defeat to Apple on the smart phone interface issue.



It is what it is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/14/2015 12:07AM by N-OS X-tasy!.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 14, 2015 12:12AM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
vision63
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
vision63
Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it.

Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.

Icons. Or, you check out the watch. Read about it. Don't do the enemy thing. It's all tech.

Please. RollingEyesSmiley5

Exactly as it did with its smart phones after Apple released the iPhone, Samsung has copied the Apple Watch interface for its smart watch -- or at least the general gist of it.

I will give Samsung credit for not making its interface an exact copy of Apple's this time, as they did with its smart phone interface. One might infer from this that the company learned a thing or two from its stinging (and expensive) courtroom defeat to Apple on the smart phone interface issue.

Apple had dibs on the rectangle. I agree. That's it. Samsung's interface is called TouchWiz and it's never been "anything" like Apple's. Everybody opened the app drawer and took pictures of the icons and declared it a copy. If you ever used the phone you'd know this. TouchWiz, especially in it's infancy was not a great interface. It was nothing like Apple's.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/14/2015 12:14AM by vision63.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Black
Date: August 14, 2015 12:32AM
Quote
RoadToad

An oldie but a goodie.
This is supposed to be stoopid, right?
1) Technological advances caused larger and better touch screens to come available. Like they'd have stuck with tiny displays if Apple hadn't come along
2) Mass amnesia here that SJ ran around ranting that nobody needed devices larger than pocket-sized....and then with the iPhone 6 we suddenly have Apple chasing after Samsung on the dimensions.




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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: August 14, 2015 12:48AM
Quote
Black
1) Technological advances caused larger and better touch screens to come available. Like they'd have stuck with tiny displays if Apple hadn't come along.

If by "technological advances" you mean "the idea Apple conceived for a revolutionary smart phone interface," then yes, I agree with you.


Quote
Black
2) Mass amnesia here that SJ ran around ranting that nobody needed devices larger than pocket-sized....and then with the iPhone 6 we suddenly have Apple chasing after Samsung on the dimensions.

Steve wasn't able to provide his input during design of the iPhone 6, was he?



It is what it is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/14/2015 12:49AM by N-OS X-tasy!.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Article Accelerator
Date: August 14, 2015 12:54AM
Quote
vision63
Quote
Rick-o
Gee. I wonder why they didn't stick with last years model? Why did Samsung even bother with that one if the new one was waiting in the wings? dunno smiley

Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it.

Not as far as I have been able to determine. Got a citation?
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: August 14, 2015 01:00AM
Quote
Article Accelerator
Quote
vision63
Quote
Rick-o
Gee. I wonder why they didn't stick with last years model? Why did Samsung even bother with that one if the new one was waiting in the wings? dunno smiley

Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it.

Not as far as I have been able to determine. Got a citation?

No mention of Samsung here: [appleinsider.com]



It is what it is.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: 3d
Date: August 14, 2015 05:39AM
Quote
RoadToad

An oldie but a goodie.

Haha. Is there a tablet before/after iPad version of this graphic? smiling smiley
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: Carnos Jax
Date: August 14, 2015 06:54AM
Actually there is. It was hosted on some site that since has been taken down. Too bad, someone really did a good job of comparing Samsung's interface, hardware, and packaging designs for both their smartphones and tablets before and after the iPhone debuted. It was like a night and day change for Damsung and made them look shameless. Too bad someone (Samsung?) removed it.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: August 14, 2015 04:19PM
Another voice chimes in on the issue:
[appleinsider.com]

This segment of the article is particularly damning:

Quote

In sum, Samsung seems to have returned to the strategy it employed during its "crisis of design" in the wake of the iPhone's release.

In a 132-page document uncovered as part of Apple's landmark lawsuit against the South Korean firm, Samsung's design team methodically deconstructed the iPhone's user interface and suggested methods to make Samsung's own smartphone UI more closely align with Apple's. This report helped seal Samsung's fate in a trial that saw it found guilty of copying the iPhone and ordered to pay Apple hundreds of millions of dollars.



It is what it is.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 14, 2015 04:45PM
A couple thoughts. One, Samsung has a plethora of watches that have been released over the years and honestly I haven't noticed any that look like the Apple Watch. Two, the watch posted specifically in this thread doesn't look like an Apple Watch at all. In the hardware department at least, although there are some superficial similarity between the interfaces.

Bonus thought, Apple even threatened Samsung over their Symbian, Bada, and Windows phones back in the day, not just Android so I take everything coming out of Apple with a dump truck of salt.

"In documentation submitted last week by Apple, Cupertino revealed that its licensing rates are $30 per smartphone and $40 per tablet. That includes touch-screen smartphones based on Android, Symbian, Samsung's bada OS, and Windows that utilized Apple-held technology. The $40 per touch-screen tablet, meanwhile, would reduce to $30 over two years, court filings revealed."

Source= [www.pcmag.com]

The Omnia HD didn't look or act like an iPhone beyond having a capacitive touchscreen, yet Apple still wanted licensing fees, so yeah, I take a pretty dim view over IP law abuse. If IP law existed thirty years ago as it does today, Microsoft, Apple, nor Oracle would exist. Yet all three were happy to build their empires on the ideas of others, but still sue their competitors over the same tactics once they became complacent fat cats. They all suck. (Google too, but for other reasons). Samsung is hardly innocent because they've squabbled in the courts over other IP issues (non Apple related, and pretty sure Samsung was the plaintive in at least some of those cases, see their never ending tit for tat with LG).

Samsung Omnia HD


Source for image plus more images. [www.phonearena.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/14/2015 05:19PM by silvarios.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 14, 2015 05:10PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.

Frankly, you haven't been paying attention. That's one watch and none of the other models have the same interface. This is easy to verify via your favorite Internet search engine. I don't expect you to take my word for it. After all, I'm just some @#$%& spouting off on the Interwebs. smiling smiley

Seriously, I think you will find the design of the Samsung watches fascinating, as much for what they got wrong, as for what they got right. You would also see Samsung is mostly "ripping off" other Android Wear products with the round design after years of square design (aka, the design Apple chose for their own smartwatch after Samsung and other companies had shipped a few years of similarly designed products).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/14/2015 05:14PM by silvarios.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 14, 2015 05:13PM
Quote
vision63
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
vision63
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
vision63
Every Apple Watch has a little bit of Samsung built into it.

Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.

Icons. Or, you check out the watch. Read about it. Don't do the enemy thing. It's all tech.

Please. RollingEyesSmiley5

Exactly as it did with its smart phones after Apple released the iPhone, Samsung has copied the Apple Watch interface for its smart watch -- or at least the general gist of it.

I will give Samsung credit for not making its interface an exact copy of Apple's this time, as they did with its smart phone interface. One might infer from this that the company learned a thing or two from its stinging (and expensive) courtroom defeat to Apple on the smart phone interface issue.

Apple had dibs on the rectangle. I agree. That's it. Samsung's interface is called TouchWiz and it's never been "anything" like Apple's. Everybody opened the app drawer and took pictures of the icons and declared it a copy. If you ever used the phone you'd know this. TouchWiz, especially in it's infancy was not a great interface. It was nothing like Apple's.

I respect Dan quite a bit, but I agree with vision, you can tell who has and hasn't used smartphones other than an iPhone by reading the comments in this thread. Samsung's involvement in mobile predates Apple's for years. When Apple was flogging the iPhone, Samsung had a phone that could play MP3s. Samsung also had a well received line of touch screen smartphones (stylus of course, running Palm OS, Kyocera also had a similar line) during the same time frame.

This is all just evolution and Apple can pretend they were the first when they were about the fourth wave of smartphones, but us peon consumers should be wise to such PR puffery. We are all building on the shoulders of Giants, to deny such things is pure hubris, which has worked perfectly for a company like Apple as it mirrors their consistent brand snobbishness, but not all companies are Apple.

I was the biggest Apple fan around, but I lost my faith as years and years of enemies of the moment came and went. I just couldn't follow the mental gymnastics required to ignore 85% of the rest of the world and pretend Apple is the only company doing anything interesting in the tech space. I've always been uncomfortable with the quasi-religious aspects of these debates, but as Apple kept growing and getting more powerful, I couldn't understand the persecution complex presented by its biggest fans.

Every product has pluses and minuses, every product has compromise, and there is always more than a single good product on the market at any given moment. None of these large companies should be considered friends, everything is about PR spin and making dollars. Once Samsung is vanquished, rest assured Apple will have their latest enemy lined up and at the ready.

To recap, if you think TouchWiz is just like iOS, you've never used TouchWiz and that's not really a complement to TouchWiz. Or at most a backhanded one.

P.s. I've only used one Samsung device with TouchWiz and I bought it for all the ways it differed from an iPad, not the ways that were similar, unless you count a capacitive touchscreen and a home button as key points of differentiation.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/14/2015 05:16PM by silvarios.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: August 14, 2015 05:57PM
Quote
silvarios
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.

Frankly, you haven't been paying attention. That's one watch and none of the other models have the same interface. This is easy to verify via your favorite Internet search engine. I don't expect you to take my word for it. After all, I'm just some @#$%& spouting off on the Interwebs. smiling smiley

OK, you got me. My statement above was intended to reference this specific Samsung watch, as well as any others that might utilize the GUI depicted in the photo.



It is what it is.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: sekker
Date: August 14, 2015 06:48PM
Samsung is great at putting LOTS of ideas out into the market.

What all of the Apple naysayers miss is that the most important function for Steve Jobs was to BLOCK the launching of bad products.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 14, 2015 07:58PM
Quote
sekker
Samsung is great at putting LOTS of ideas out into the market.

What all of the Apple naysayers miss is that the most important function for Steve Jobs was to BLOCK the launching of bad products.

You don't have to be a naysayer to understand there are different approaches to product design and marketing. Both have strengths and weaknesses. Because Samsung is never wed to any one design or market, they can switch gears as necessary, but Apple likely has a stronger branding with their limited releases and can retain laser like focus is necessary to keep iterating when they do hit it out of the park.

Minor quibbles aside, you make a great point.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 14, 2015 09:12PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
silvarios
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Every Samsung watch has a lot of Apple built into it, judging by that photo.

Frankly, you haven't been paying attention. That's one watch and none of the other models have the same interface. This is easy to verify via your favorite Internet search engine. I don't expect you to take my word for it. After all, I'm just some @#$%& spouting off on the Interwebs. smiling smiley

OK, you got me. My statement above was intended to reference this specific Samsung watch, as well as any others that might utilize the GUI depicted in the photo.

No problem. Just mixing it up to keep things lighthearted.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: sekker
Date: August 14, 2015 09:42PM
Quote
silvarios
Quote
sekker
Samsung is great at putting LOTS of ideas out into the market.

What all of the Apple naysayers miss is that the most important function for Steve Jobs was to BLOCK the launching of bad products.

You don't have to be a naysayer to understand there are different approaches to product design and marketing. Both have strengths and weaknesses. Because Samsung is never wed to any one design or market, they can switch gears as necessary, but Apple likely has a stronger branding with their limited releases and can retain laser like focus is necessary to keep iterating when they do hit it out of the park.

Minor quibbles aside, you make a great point.

I agree that there ARE different ways to market, etc.

The issue with Samsung is that they basically stopped innovating and just went with 'just focus on the way Apple was doing XX.'

If Samsung did what Blackberry / RIM did - continue to make a device that is clearly different than the Apple iPhone - no one would accuse them of copying, even if ONE of the versions they shipped were Apple clones.

This seems to be the approach they are taking with their smart watches. We will see!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/14/2015 09:43PM by sekker.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 15, 2015 12:02AM
Quote
sekker
Quote
silvarios
Quote
sekker
Samsung is great at putting LOTS of ideas out into the market.

What all of the Apple naysayers miss is that the most important function for Steve Jobs was to BLOCK the launching of bad products.

You don't have to be a naysayer to understand there are different approaches to product design and marketing. Both have strengths and weaknesses. Because Samsung is never wed to any one design or market, they can switch gears as necessary, but Apple likely has a stronger branding with their limited releases and can retain laser like focus is necessary to keep iterating when they do hit it out of the park.

Minor quibbles aside, you make a great point.

I agree that there ARE different ways to market, etc.

The issue with Samsung is that they basically stopped innovating and just went with 'just focus on the way Apple was doing XX.'

If Samsung did what Blackberry / RIM did - continue to make a device that is clearly different than the Apple iPhone - no one would accuse them of copying, even if ONE of the versions they shipped were Apple clones.

This seems to be the approach they are taking with their smart watches. We will see!

They are extremely innovative. Just check out the features on their new products. They are actually "more" innovative than Apple is now on cell phone products.

There is nothing like these products. Go deep. Fast charging. Even the Galaxy Gear S is a standalone phone. Who has that? I think Sony does. You can write on the phone with the S pen when the phone isn't even on and it saves the note. Multi screens on the same phone (which Apple is borrowing). I can go on and on and on. Apple uses NEF for "one" thing. On Android you can use for all sorts of things. Anything you see the NEF icon on, you can just tap to connect to it.

Galaxy Note 4 Edge
Galaxy S6 Edge
Galaxy Note 5
Galaxy S6+ Edge

Now my disclaimer is that I've had 3 different Samsung phones but I much prefer HTC phones over theirs.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/15/2015 12:03AM by vision63.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: sekker
Date: August 15, 2015 11:45AM
Quote
vision63
Quote
sekker
Quote
silvarios
Quote
sekker
Samsung is great at putting LOTS of ideas out into the market.

What all of the Apple naysayers miss is that the most important function for Steve Jobs was to BLOCK the launching of bad products.

You don't have to be a naysayer to understand there are different approaches to product design and marketing. Both have strengths and weaknesses. Because Samsung is never wed to any one design or market, they can switch gears as necessary, but Apple likely has a stronger branding with their limited releases and can retain laser like focus is necessary to keep iterating when they do hit it out of the park.

Minor quibbles aside, you make a great point.

I agree that there ARE different ways to market, etc.

The issue with Samsung is that they basically stopped innovating and just went with 'just focus on the way Apple was doing XX.'

If Samsung did what Blackberry / RIM did - continue to make a device that is clearly different than the Apple iPhone - no one would accuse them of copying, even if ONE of the versions they shipped were Apple clones.

This seems to be the approach they are taking with their smart watches. We will see!

They are extremely innovative. Just check out the features on their new products. They are actually "more" innovative than Apple is now on cell phone products.

There is nothing like these products. Go deep. Fast charging. Even the Galaxy Gear S is a standalone phone. Who has that? I think Sony does. You can write on the phone with the S pen when the phone isn't even on and it saves the note. Multi screens on the same phone (which Apple is borrowing). I can go on and on and on. Apple uses NEF for "one" thing. On Android you can use for all sorts of things. Anything you see the NEF icon on, you can just tap to connect to it.

Galaxy Note 4 Edge
Galaxy S6 Edge
Galaxy Note 5
Galaxy S6+ Edge

Now my disclaimer is that I've had 3 different Samsung phones but I much prefer HTC phones over theirs.

Let me define 'innovative' here for a second: 'innovation' is when you are the first to market with a key product or product accessory/feature that is then found across the board in future products. For example, I find the 'edge' screen on the Samsung phones interesting and new, but it's still unclear whether it's the future of smart phone screens.

In contrast, Apple was the first to include a fingerprint scanner; now Samsung and HTC include one in their flagship phones, and others will be doing so as well.

I am ABSOLUTELY sure Apple tried versions of the edge screen in-house. So far, it's not been deployed.

Apple's deployment of NFC is also a classic Apple model. They did not include NFC because their main use case (payments) needed a full infrastructure to make best use. Now, Samsung Pay and Android Pay (as opposed to Google Wallet) are basically clones. Samsung Pay added tech from a company they recently purchased to allow Samsung phones to mimic magnetic stripes on credit cards (Loop Pay), but it's about to be out of fashion with chip and PIN in the US. I concur that Apple SHOULD have put NFC in the iPhone 5 series or earlier, but I think the market response has largely proven them right to wait.

I give Samsung 100% credit for launching the 5.7" phablet market with their Note. I am a largely happy owner of an iPhone6+, and I am sure the only reason it exists is because of the success of the Note. SJ would never have approved.

In contrast, most of the rest of the key signature features found in the Samsung Galaxy series are largely gone - no microSD card slot, no removable battery, etc. A standard Galaxy S6 looks ALOT like an iPhone 6 (and vice versa). But if you were to take a 2007 Samsung 'smart' phone and make it bigger, it would NOT look like a Galaxy S6. But if you were to make the original 2007 iPhone bigger, it would absolutely look like an iPhone 6.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 15, 2015 01:56PM
Quote
sekker
I agree that there ARE different ways to market, etc.

The issue with Samsung is that they basically stopped innovating and just went with 'just focus on the way Apple was doing XX.'

If Samsung did what Blackberry / RIM did - continue to make a device that is clearly different than the Apple iPhone - no one would accuse them of copying, even if ONE of the versions they shipped were Apple clones.

This seems to be the approach they are taking with their smart watches. We will see!

I'd hold more stock in this point of view if Apple didn't tell Samsung they owed money for Windows Mobile, Symbian, and Bada devices because they were inspired by Apple's iPhone. It's like Apple has never actually used a Samsung device. Superficial similarities aside, the iPhones and iPads and even iOS itself truly didn't function like any of those Samsung devices, for better or worse.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 15, 2015 03:34PM
Quote
sekker
Let me define 'innovative' here for a second: 'innovation' is when you are the first to market with a key product or product accessory/feature that is then found across the board in future products. For example, I find the 'edge' screen on the Samsung phones interesting and new, but it's still unclear whether it's the future of smart phone screens.

In contrast, Apple was the first to include a fingerprint scanner; now Samsung and HTC include one in their flagship phones, and others will be doing so as well.

Uh, Apple was most certainly not the first phone with a fingerprint scanner. You can argue it is best in class, but you can't define innovation as being first and then magic wand over history anyway to make Apple the innovator. Motorola had a fingerprint scanner on a 2011 Atrix model. It worked well enough as from a technical point of view, but didn't seem to be as integrated into the OS as maybe it could have been.

Quote
sekker
I am ABSOLUTELY sure Apple tried versions of the edge screen in-house. So far, it's not been deployed.

And?

Quote
sekker
Apple's deployment of NFC is also a classic Apple model. They did not include NFC because their main use case (payments) needed a full infrastructure to make best use. Now, Samsung Pay and Android Pay (as opposed to Google Wallet) are basically clones. Samsung Pay added tech from a company they recently purchased to allow Samsung phones to mimic magnetic stripes on credit cards (Loop Pay), but it's about to be out of fashion with chip and PIN in the US. I concur that Apple SHOULD have put NFC in the iPhone 5 series or earlier, but I think the market response has largely proven them right to wait.

Then Apple isn't first, hence not innovative by your own definition of the term. Which is weird, but hey, I don't want to split hairs and derail the conversation. How Google can clone a NFC payment system that came after their own NFC payment system, I have no idea. I think you have the copying concept backwards in this case.

Quote
sekker
In contrast, most of the rest of the key signature features found in the Samsung Galaxy series are largely gone - no microSD card slot, no removable battery, etc. A standard Galaxy S6 looks ALOT like an iPhone 6 (and vice versa). But if you were to take a 2007 Samsung 'smart' phone and make it bigger, it would NOT look like a Galaxy S6. But if you were to make the original 2007 iPhone bigger, it would absolutely look like an iPhone 6.

The iPhone 6 looks completely different than the original iPhone and iOS 8 is likewise different than the first version of iPhone OS. The broad strokes are the same, I suppose, touch screen, home button, and grid of apps. However, if you were a user of the Omnia HD from 2009 (a bit newer, but in the same era of device), a new Samsung phone would work pretty similarly given the TouchWiz heritage. And the Omnia HD doesn't look like or really operate like an iPhone from any generation, right? Unless you consider only the broadest definition of similar.

[www.gsmarena.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/15/2015 03:54PM by silvarios.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: sekker
Date: August 15, 2015 05:55PM
Apple was not first with NFC. No. But the merchant payment ecosystem using NFC and onboard encryption is now the norm in the industry. The fact that they were not first (in the strict sense of using NFC) but WERE very innovative was my point. I am trying to agree with you on the facts in this example.

However, and we've had this disagreement before, no normal person confuses a modern Samsung phone with a 2007 Samsung phone. But they do think it's an iPhone.

And trying to compare a 2009 phone as the same era as the iPhone (implying it was not an iPhone copy) is disingenuous.

Let me comment on the Samsung watch they pre-announced. If the Samsung watch playbook works out like it did for the phone, Samsung will only be selling the latest version that has nearly identical look and functionality as the Apple Watch. And they may end up making a lot of $$. But it's not innovative in my book.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: vision63
Date: August 15, 2015 07:05PM
Quote
sekker
Apple was not first with NFC. No. But the merchant payment ecosystem using NFC and onboard encryption is now the norm in the industry. The fact that they were not first (in the strict sense of using NFC) but WERE very innovative was my point. I am trying to agree with you on the facts in this example.

However, and we've had this disagreement before, no normal person confuses a modern Samsung phone with a 2007 Samsung phone. But they do think it's an iPhone.

And trying to compare a 2009 phone as the same era as the iPhone (implying it was not an iPhone copy) is disingenuous.

Let me comment on the Samsung watch they pre-announced. If the Samsung watch playbook works out like it did for the phone, Samsung will only be selling the latest version that has nearly identical look and functionality as the Apple Watch. And they may end up making a lot of $$. But it's not innovative in my book.

I see why you think Apple is the most innovative. NFC payment systems are only valid when Apple does it. Fingerprint scanners are only valid when Apple does it. It simply took no work, effort or thinking to create anything except for when Apple does it. Everybody is just sittingontheirasses waiting for Apple to innovate what they already created.
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Re: Samsung releases gorgeous new Apple Watch
Posted by: silvarios
Date: August 16, 2015 01:39PM
Quote
sekker
And trying to compare a 2009 phone as the same era as the iPhone (implying it was not an iPhone copy) is disingenuous.

Let me comment on the Samsung watch they pre-announced. If the Samsung watch playbook works out like it did for the phone, Samsung will only be selling the latest version that has nearly identical look and functionality as the Apple Watch. And they may end up making a lot of $$. But it's not innovative in my book.

You have clearly never used a TouchWiz device. No sane iPhone user thinks they are the same. smiling smiley

I have actually owned and used both iOS devices and TouchWiz devices and find both are decent enough, even if neither offers my favorite interface. I have provided link after link of that 2009 Samsung Symbian phone, please tell me how it is the same as the iPhone, other than the capacitive touch screen.

Completely different interface and hardware and yes a 2009 Samsung phone user would be more or less fine moving to a newer TouchWiz device, even one with a completely different underlying OS.
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