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Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: pRICE cUBE
Date: June 28, 2017 09:13AM
[www.nbclosangeles.com]

A caught-on-camera road rage incident between a motorcyclist and a driver on a Southern California freeway led to a chain-reaction crash, sending an innocent person to the hospital Wednesday, authorities said.
The crash occurred before 6 a.m. on the southbound 14 Freeway near Newhall in Santa Clarita. The passenger who shot the video said he started recording when a gray sedan inadvertently cut off a passing motorcyclist.

"Words went back and forth," he told NBC4.
The motorcyclist zooms up to the driver's side of the sedan and kicks the side of the vehicle. The sedan veered left, pinching the biker to the center divider before it swerved and crashed into the wall, hitting and flipping a Chevy pickup truck over on its roof. The motorcyclist zooms past the collision.






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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: mattkime
Date: June 28, 2017 09:39AM
I think its somewhat irresponsible for the news report to assign blame.

there's speculation that the car driver was surprised and therefore swerved. i think thats a VERY charitable interpretation - if you're driving a car and you're reaction to being surprised is gripping and turning the wheel, i'm not sure you should be behind the wheel.

In general, I find it fascinating how low...or how quickly its lowered....the standard is for having control over one's vehicle.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 09:41AM by mattkime.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: max
Date: June 28, 2017 09:44AM
The sedan driver should be hanged.....
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: space-time
Date: June 28, 2017 09:44AM
Road rage kills.

Interesting that the small sedan bounce on concrete barrier, then bounces in that truck but the sedan never flips over as far as I can tell. the truck on the other hand...

The motorcyclist doesn't stop?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 09:46AM by space-time.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: pRICE cUBE
Date: June 28, 2017 09:57AM
Quote
space-time
Road rage kills.

Interesting that the small sedan bounce on concrete barrier, then bounces in that truck but the sedan never flips over as far as I can tell. the truck on the other hand...

The motorcyclist doesn't stop?

The sedan appears to get under the trucks wheels and flip the center of gravity. It appears to be a Chevy Avalanche which is a essentially a short bed pickup truck. The sedan picks it up just right.

Police are currently looking for the motorcyclist.



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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: space-time
Date: June 28, 2017 10:04AM
Assuming they find the motorcyclist, how do they assign blame on cases like these? probably (not sure) that both the motorcyclist and sedan driver are guilty. Does it matter who started the argument? does it matter who did the first aggressive act? from what I see in the video, it appears the motorcyclist wants to kick or maybe even kicks the sedan, and the sedan driver notices that intent and tries to maneuver the car, but is not clear if he wants to avoid, injure or scare the motorcyclist.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: June 28, 2017 10:10AM
FWIW.. apparently the person who recorded the incident has come forth. Apparently the sedan had almost run the motorcycle into the wall, and words were being exchanged.

[www.latimes.com]
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: pRICE cUBE
Date: June 28, 2017 10:10AM
Quote
space-time
Assuming they find the motorcyclist, how do they assign blame on cases like these? probably (not sure) that both the motorcyclist and sedan driver are guilty. Does it matter who started the argument? does it matter who did the first aggressive act? from what I see in the video, it appears the motorcyclist wants to kick or maybe even kicks the sedan, and the sedan driver notices that intent and tries to maneuver the car, but is not clear if he wants to avoid, injure or scare the motorcyclist.

I'd imagine the sedan driver could easily say that he/she was startled by the kick and did not intend to swerve. It is debatable whether the sedan driver did it on purpose as payback. I am not sure where the law comes down on fault when a vehicle is attacked by another motorist's appendages while in motion.



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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Carnos Jax
Date: June 28, 2017 10:14AM
Definitely hard to say who caused it. It almost seems to me that the sedan tried to run the motorcycle off the road and lost control of the vehicle as a result (very easy to get into that type of loss in control from jerking the wheel at highway speeds).
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: max
Date: June 28, 2017 10:20AM
Quote
space-time

The motorcyclist doesn't stop?

He just escaped death by a deranged driver trying to kill him. I would not, either....
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: mattkime
Date: June 28, 2017 10:22AM
>I'd imagine the sedan driver could easily say that he/she was startled by the kick and did not intend to swerve.

Low standards.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: pRICE cUBE
Date: June 28, 2017 10:32AM
Quote
mattkime
>I'd imagine the sedan driver could easily say that he/she was startled by the kick and did not intend to swerve.

Low standards.

I am not making a judgement standard at all. I am stating that to police and the courts, the driver could claim this. If this results in criminal charges, some people might say just about anything to blame the other party.

IMO, something must have happened before the recording of this video. The video appears to be shot with a hand held device. People don't normally start recording video for no reason. It appears to me that the sedan driver attempts to scare or hit the motorcyclist after the kick. The sedan driver then loses control. Even startled, I just don;t see a driver jerking the wheel so hard. If you were trying to send a message or hit someone. a hard swerve may be what we see in the video.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 10:37AM by pRICE cUBE.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: billb
Date: June 28, 2017 10:41AM
Two jerks being @#$%& in the street endangering the lives of everyone else trying to use the road as intended.

The driver of the grey car could easily be charged with attempted manslaughter if the biker went down. He could say he was startled but that certainly looks like someone attempting to run a biker off the road. And if you've ever had a car try to run you off the road you know exactly how easy it is to do. Using a car as a lethal weapon is not equal to a foot to a door. No different than if the guy in the grey car drew a gun after getting kicked. Unnecessary escalation. You DO NOT play games in the street. Every one of those vehicles around those two hot heads could potentially have an innocent child on board.
Jerks. Both of 'em.


And the CNN-style judge and jury blame in the article title is foul and manipulatively disgusting.



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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 10:43AM by billb.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: M A V I C
Date: June 28, 2017 10:45AM
Quote
pRICE cUBE
Quote
mattkime
>I'd imagine the sedan driver could easily say that he/she was startled by the kick and did not intend to swerve.

Low standards.

I am not making a judgement standard at all. I am stating that to police and the courts, the driver could claim this. If this results in criminal charges, some people might say just about anything to blame the other party.

IMO, something must have happened before the recording of this video. The video appears to be shot with a hand held device. People don't normally start recording video for no reason. It appears to me that the sedan driver attempts to scare or hit the motorcyclist after the kick. The sedan driver then loses control. Even startled, I just don;t see a driver jerking the wheel so hard. If you were trying to send a message or hit someone. a hard swerve may be what we see in the video.

As your original post states, "The passenger who shot the video said he started recording when a gray sedan inadvertently cut off a passing motorcyclist. "

So it started when the gray car cut off the motorcyclist. There's the initial fault. The biker is also at fault for how he reacted. "Inadvertently" sounds like something the driver of the gray car would say, since they're the only one that would know. They would certainly never say they did that intentionally, unless they were honest.

Though it being "inadvertent" isn't really much better than being intentional. If you inadvertently cut someone off, then get so startled by a thump that you again cut off a motorcyclist, slam your car into the divider, then drive it into the side of a truck and flip it... you probably shouldn't ever be allowed to drive again.




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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 28, 2017 10:56AM
Quote
max
Quote
space-time

The motorcyclist doesn't stop?

He just escaped death by a deranged driver trying to kill him. I would not, either....

And you'd be guilty of leaving the scene of an accident you were directly involved in.
"If you are involved in a collision: You must stop."
"If you must gesture to another driver, do so in a way that will not be interpreted as hostile..."
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Acer
Date: June 28, 2017 11:03AM
There is a chain of stupid here. A motorcycle is dangerously cut off (so we're told). A motorcyclist makes a dangerously aggressive move in response. A car makes an even more dangerous move.

Motorcycle dude should have limited his response to the standard middle finger and backed way off the reckless sedan. There was nothing to be gained by kicking the car, and much to be lost, even if he was initially the wronged party. If the timing on that swerve had been a fraction different, the cyclist would be dead. His family might enjoy a fat settlement, but he'd personally be too dead to enjoy it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 11:04AM by Acer.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: C(-)ris
Date: June 28, 2017 11:12AM
Quote
Acer
There is a chain of stupid here. A motorcycle is dangerously cut off (so we're told). A motorcyclist makes a dangerously aggressive move in response. A car makes an even more dangerous move.

Motorcycle dude should have limited his response to the standard middle finger and backed way off the reckless sedan. There was nothing to be gained by kicking the car, and much to be lost, even if he was initially the wronged party. If the timing on that swerve had been a fraction different, the cyclist would be dead. His family might enjoy a fat settlement, but he'd personally be too dead to enjoy it.

If the motorcycle being cut off was accidental and not done on purpose then him kicking the door was an extremely aggressive move and I would say that everything after that was his own doing. Same as being in a bar and someone accidentally bumping into you spilling your drink, you can't just punch the guy in the face for it. All the actions that happen after that were the direct cause of the punch to the face(or kick to the door, in this case).



C(-)ris
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: mikebw
Date: June 28, 2017 11:26AM
Quote
C(-)ris
If the motorcycle being cut off was accidental and not done on purpose then him kicking the door was an extremely aggressive move and I would say that everything after that was his own doing.

Maybe the grey car did accidentally cut off the motorcycle, but that is the fault of the driver for not paying attention and ensuring a safe lane change. How the rider reacted was also not OK, but the driver chose to swerve back at the rider which is tantamount to vehicular manslaughter, as previously stated. Now perhaps they didn't really intend to hit the rider, but they clearly were not able to control their vehicle with the sort of precision needed to accomplish that and this resulted in the truck getting flipped.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 11:30AM by mikebw.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Kraniac
Date: June 28, 2017 11:29AM
Dummies at work..fault? I read that the little car was messing with the motorcycle guy..cut him off or somesuch..could be dummy #1

but, motorcycles are hard to spot sometimes in 'lane situations'

..dummy 2, motorcyclist being pretty damn stupid with the kick..what the HELL are these people thinking??

dummy 3..car dude reacting by trying to push the motorcycle into the divider

Dummies and @#$%&..doing there thing..sucks.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: jdc
Date: June 28, 2017 11:34AM
Hard to place blame either party without the full story.

When you ride a bike you have to assume you are invisible -- and you need some thick skin -- or at least be able to shrug off "inadvertant" car lane changes, or cars pulling out in front of you, or whatever.

Honestly, if you cant, then you prob shouldnt ride.

Hundreds of videos on utube of motorcycle riders getting cut off, or what not by cars and the aftermath of them honking or cussing or yelling or giving them the bird. Some of them even seemed pretty innocent.



----


Edited 999 time(s). Last edit at 12:08PM by jdc.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 28, 2017 11:35AM
Generally speaking, and not necessarily to this specific incident...

Anyone who has ridden motorcycles AND driven cars in mixed car-motorcycle traffic should know first hand how difficult it can be for car drivers to always see the motorcycles.

Smart motorcyclists (and car drivers) internalize this fact, and ride/drive accordingly.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: pRICE cUBE
Date: June 28, 2017 11:37AM
Quote
jdc
Hard to place blame either party without the full story.

When you ride a bike you have to assume you are invisible -- and you need some thick skin -- or at least be able to shrug off "inadvertant" car lane changes, or cars pulling out in front of you, or whatever.

Honestly, if you cant, then you prob shouldnt ride.

Hundreds of videos on utube of motorcycle riders getting cut off, or what not by cars and the aftermath of them honking or cussing or yelling or giving them the bird. Some of them even seemed pretty innocent.


As a driver, I try to be careful and concientious but sometimes motorcycles are HARD to see. Especially when they can zip quickly in and out of spots in less time and space it would take a car to accomplish. So if I have trouble seeing them and I am trying to be careful, their odds of having a mishap are higher with people talking or texting on phones.



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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: 3d
Date: June 28, 2017 11:49AM
Quote
cbelt3
FWIW.. apparently the person who recorded the incident has come forth. Apparently the sedan had almost run the motorcycle into the wall, and words were being exchanged.

[www.latimes.com]

Dyaaamm....
After getting cut off, the motorcyclist started kicking the passenger door, then swooped behind the sedan, pulled up along the driver side and kicked the car again.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Speedy
Date: June 28, 2017 11:53AM
California. In Florida they would have settled it with 9 mm.'s. Or heavier.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: jdc
Date: June 28, 2017 11:58AM
I think every one try to be careful, but you are right, many motorcycles zip in and out of cars.

Playing armchair QB, Im sure it went down where the car didnt see the bike and almost hit him. So the bike guy got pissed and started yelling, and then they yelled at each other.

When the bike kicked the car, car overreacted and over corrected and the rest was history.



----


Edited 999 time(s). Last edit at 12:08PM by jdc.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Lux Interior
Date: June 28, 2017 12:33PM
Quote
Speedy
California. In Florida they would have settled it with 9 mm.'s. Or heavier.

O'RLY?

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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: mattkime
Date: June 28, 2017 12:43PM
Quote
C(-)ris
Same as being in a bar and someone accidentally bumping into you spilling your drink...

Obviously we don't know what initially happened, so we can't say for certain.

Option A) The car swerved, but within reason, and the motorcyclist simply has a thin skin.

Option B) The car swerved dangerously just as the motorcyclist passed. It needlessly endangered someone else.

If its B, then the motorcyclist has every right to be angry. Simply because he's on a motorcycle doesn't mean that the driver gets a free pass. Actions have consequences even if they lack intention.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: June 28, 2017 01:00PM
Quote
pRICE cUBE
IMO, something must have happened before the recording of this video. The video appears to be shot with a hand held device. People don't normally start recording video for no reason. It appears to me that the sedan driver attempts to scare or hit the motorcyclist after the kick. The sedan driver then loses control. Even startled, I just don;t see a driver jerking the wheel so hard. If you were trying to send a message or hit someone. a hard swerve may be what we see in the video.

It's been stated that the event that served as the catalyst for this occurred prior to the start of the video.

From what I can see (and based on personal experience as a motorcyclist), the sedan illegally crossed the double yellow lines, surprising the motorcyclist and nearly side-swiping him. The motorcyclist swerved to the left to avoid being hit by the sedan, then came up even with the sedan and kicked it (this is where the video begins).

If the motorcyclist had not kicked the car, the driver of the sedan would bear 100% of the blame here. He illegally crossed the double yellows into the SOV lane, impinging upon the right-of-way of the motorcyclist and nearly hitting him. If a LEO had observed this, he would have pulled the sedan over and issued the driver a ticket for illegal entry into the SOV lane and perhaps for reckless driving.

But the motorcyclist DID kick the car, and in doing so immediately became at least equally to blame for what subsequently happened. It was his kick and the subsequent swerve by the driver of the sedan that caused the latter to lose control and cause the accident. If the motorcyclist had not kicked the sedan, it is reasonable to conclude the accident would not have occurred. However, if the sedan had not swerved after the kick, it is likely the accident would not have occurred. For that reason, when all is said and done I believe both parties will be found to be equally at fault here.

The motorcyclist should have known better. One of the topics taught during the MSF riding safety course is DO NOT KICK VEHICLES OR ANIMALS WHILE RIDING A MOTORCYCLE. More often than not, doing so will cause the rider to lose control of his motorcycle and possibly crash, always a losing proposition for the rider. As frustrated as he likely was (and I KNOW he was, as I've been in the same situation more than once), he should have simply ridden away.

EDIT: After reading that L.A. Times article, it appears the sedan was attempting to illegally exit the SOV lane, not enter it. Same difference - everything else I wrote still applies.



It is what it is.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 01:09PM by N-OS X-tasy!.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Gareth
Date: June 28, 2017 01:02PM
Quote
LA Times
About 150 feet ahead was a Nissan sedan driving in the HOV lane, Traber said. Just as the motorcyclist was passing the sedan on the right-hand side, the sedan tried to exit the carpool lane and enter the No. 1 lane. That’s when the car bumped the bike.

“I’m sure he didn’t see the motorcyclist,” Traber said of the driver. “He scared the living daylights out of the motorcyclist. He almost went down. That guy can really handle his bike.”

Traber said that after the motorcyclist regained control, he pulled up to the car’s passenger door and began gesturing at the driver. Traber said he appeared to be saying something too, but Traber couldn’t hear him. He said he figured the biker was “saying something like, hey, you almost hit me! Watch out!”

Traber said it looked as though the driver was yelling something back at the biker, and that it didn’t help matters, because that’s when the motorcyclist started kicking the passenger door.

“I said, ‘Wow, man, something’s going to happen. I gotta get this,’” Traber said. “So I grab my phone and started recording.”

What this article doesn't say, is if the sedan was trying to exit the carpool lane across a double yellow
(which is illegal) or not. And since the motorcyclist was apparently kicking the car before the recording started as well, that makes the sedan's swerving seem very intentional.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: JoeH
Date: June 28, 2017 01:09PM
Quote
From The LA Times article linked by cbelt3
In an interview with The Times on Friday, Chris Traber, 47, of Santa Clarita, said both men appeared to play a role in the harrowing incident.

It was about 5:45 a.m. Wednesday when Traber was in the passenger seat of his coworker’s car as they drove to work at a utility company in Burbank. They were headed southbound on the 14 Freeway, and driving in the No. 1 lane, when the man on a Harley Davidson-type motorcycle passed them on the left, riding close to the double-yellow lines that separate the general traffic lanes from the HOV lanes.

About 150 feet ahead was a Nissan sedan driving in the HOV lane, Traber said. Just as the motorcyclist was passing the sedan on the right-hand side, the sedan tried to exit the carpool lane and enter the No. 1 lane. That’s when the car bumped the bike.

“I’m sure he didn’t see the motorcyclist,” Traber said of the driver. “He scared the living daylights out of the motorcyclist. He almost went down. That guy can really handle his bike.”

The article goes on from there about the rest of the actions before the recorded ones. But unless there are different rules in CA, you don't cross double yellow lines. HOV lanes have their own exits. There is mention of the car actually contacting the bike at that point. So the driver of the Nissan wasn't just unobservant, he was apparently trying to do an illegal lane change as well.

P.S. Also, what is single occupant car doing in an HOV lane?
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: 3d
Date: June 28, 2017 01:14PM
Quote
JoeH
P.S. Also, what is single occupant car doing in an HOV lane?

It was 5:45am. What time are the HOV lane restrictions in effect? In NYC I think HOV starts at 6am.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 01:17PM by 3d.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 28, 2017 01:21PM
Quote
JoeH
The article goes on from there about the rest of the actions before the recorded ones. But unless there are different rules in CA, you don't cross double yellow lines. HOV lanes have their own exits. There is mention of the car actually contacting the bike at that point. So the driver of the Nissan wasn't just unobservant, he was apparently trying to do an illegal lane change as well.

The video does not establish if there was or wasn't an HOV lane entry/exit section prior to the recorded image; when the Nissan moved right and the described initial "bump" occurred.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: JoeH
Date: June 28, 2017 01:34PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
JoeH
The article goes on from there about the rest of the actions before the recorded ones. But unless there are different rules in CA, you don't cross double yellow lines. HOV lanes have their own exits. There is mention of the car actually contacting the bike at that point. So the driver of the Nissan wasn't just unobservant, he was apparently trying to do an illegal lane change as well.

The video does not establish if there was or wasn't an HOV lane entry/exit section prior to the recorded image; when the Nissan moved right and the described initial "bump" occurred.

Unless CA does it differently, I have never seen an HOV that exited by changing lanes. The closest thing I have seen is where the HOV lanes ends by merging, and those had long sections of warnings and other signage to make people aware of the merging traffic. It could be interesting to look at that section of road in Google's overhead view.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 28, 2017 01:36PM
Quote
JoeH
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
JoeH
The article goes on from there about the rest of the actions before the recorded ones. But unless there are different rules in CA, you don't cross double yellow lines. HOV lanes have their own exits. There is mention of the car actually contacting the bike at that point. So the driver of the Nissan wasn't just unobservant, he was apparently trying to do an illegal lane change as well.

The video does not establish if there was or wasn't an HOV lane entry/exit section prior to the recorded image; when the Nissan moved right and the described initial "bump" occurred.

Unless CA does it differently, I have never seen an HOV that exited by changing lanes. The closest thing I have seen is where the HOV lanes ends by merging, and those had long sections of warnings and other signage to make people aware of the merging traffic. It could be interesting to look at that section of road in Google's overhead view.

Nope, there ARE designated entry/exit sections as the HOV continues along on the left; quite common.

You can see a section in the westbound side of the 405 (moving from right to left); dashed changes to solid, and the HOV (diamond) lane has been there for many, many miles prior to this section.





Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 01:46PM by DeusxMac.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Bill in NC
Date: June 28, 2017 02:12PM
blind spot issue?
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: max
Date: June 28, 2017 02:51PM
Quote
Gareth
Quote
LA Times
About 150 feet ahead was a Nissan sedan driving in the HOV lane, Traber said. Just as the motorcyclist was passing the sedan on the right-hand side, the sedan tried to exit the carpool lane and enter the No. 1 lane. That’s when the car bumped the bike.

“I’m sure he didn’t see the motorcyclist,” Traber said of the driver. “He scared the living daylights out of the motorcyclist. He almost went down. That guy can really handle his bike.”

Traber said that after the motorcyclist regained control, he pulled up to the car’s passenger door and began gesturing at the driver. Traber said he appeared to be saying something too, but Traber couldn’t hear him. He said he figured the biker was “saying something like, hey, you almost hit me! Watch out!”

Traber said it looked as though the driver was yelling something back at the biker, and that it didn’t help matters, because that’s when the motorcyclist started kicking the passenger door.

“I said, ‘Wow, man, something’s going to happen. I gotta get this,’” Traber said. “So I grab my phone and started recording.”

What this article doesn't say, is if the sedan was trying to exit the carpool lane across a double yellow
(which is illegal) or not. And since the motorcyclist was apparently kicking the car before the recording started as well, that makes the sedan's swerving seem very intentional.


As a motorcycle rider I fully understand the Harley guy, the sedan driver should still hang....
Just as the motorcyclist was passing the sedan on the right-hand side, the sedan tried to exit the carpool lane and enter the No. 1 lane. That’s when the car bumped the bike.
It is totally different ballgame when a car "bumps" another car, hitting a bike in motion usually ends up with the rider in the emergency room.....
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: June 28, 2017 03:00PM
Quote
3d
Quote
JoeH
P.S. Also, what is single occupant car doing in an HOV lane?

It was 5:45am. What time are the HOV lane restrictions in effect? In NYC I think HOV starts at 6am.

They are in effect 24/7 in the area of CA where this occurred.



It is what it is.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: 3d
Date: June 28, 2017 03:44PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
3d
Quote
JoeH
P.S. Also, what is single occupant car doing in an HOV lane?

It was 5:45am. What time are the HOV lane restrictions in effect? In NYC I think HOV starts at 6am.

They are in effect 24/7 in the area of CA where this occurred.

24/7 HOV?
Strange, this link states otherwise:
[www.city-data.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 03:48PM by 3d.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: JoeH
Date: June 28, 2017 03:54PM
Quote
3d
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
3d
Quote
JoeH
P.S. Also, what is single occupant car doing in an HOV lane?

It was 5:45am. What time are the HOV lane restrictions in effect? In NYC I think HOV starts at 6am.

They are in effect 24/7 in the area of CA where this occurred.

24/7 HOV?
Strange, this link states otherwise:
[www.city-data.com]

Even if not 24/7, the person who posted in 2009 quoted signage that listed that they were in effect from 5 to 9 AM to on the southbound lane. Being 8 years out of date, that may have changed since then.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 04:01PM by JoeH.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: 3d
Date: June 28, 2017 03:58PM
I had to read this carefully to picture it in my head:

"It was about 5:45 a.m. Wednesday when Traber (person who shot the video) was in the passenger seat of his coworker’s car as they drove to work at a utility company in Burbank. They were headed southbound on the 14 Freeway, and driving in the No. 1 lane, when the man on a Harley Davidson-type motorcycle passed them on the left, riding close to the double-yellow lines that separate the general traffic lanes from the HOV lanes.

About 150 feet ahead was a Nissan sedan driving in the HOV lane, Traber said. Just as the motorcyclist was passing the sedan on the right-hand side, the sedan tried to exit the carpool lane and enter the No. 1 lane. That’s when the car bumped the bike."


Shouts were exchanged. Motorcyclist starts kicking the passenger side door. Then motorcyclist goes behind and pulls up on the driver side of the sedan and kicks again. (then video starts).
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: artie67
Date: June 28, 2017 04:24PM
I've driven the stretch many times. Over the hill in the distance is where the freeway fun begins. It's also the area where overpasses collapsed in the 1992 earthquake.
The diamond lane does have entry and exit openings at major roads, but not too many. I don't believe the freeway entry road on the right has a break and they are well past the last one at Newhall Ave.
Plenty of witnesses for what went on.
L.A. is famous for lots of things, but in the north San Fernando Valley we have designer freeways. You will see where the freeway fun is located and the attempts to add the fun by the one and only Wavy Gravy!
Then, just slide north to where the lanes cross Sierra Highway. Here is where the designers from nearby Magic Mountain show their stuff. Zoom in for more fun. Give me a shout if I didn't get the link or just google maps Sylmar CA and go left and up.
[www.google.com]
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: June 28, 2017 04:40PM
Quote
DeusxMac
You can see a section in the westbound side of the 405 (moving from right to left); dashed changes to solid, and the HOV (diamond) lane has been there for many, many miles prior to this section.


405 runs N/S, not E/W. Where on the freeway is that photo taken?



It is what it is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/28/2017 04:41PM by N-OS X-tasy!.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: June 28, 2017 04:44PM
Quote
3d
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
3d
Quote
JoeH
P.S. Also, what is single occupant car doing in an HOV lane?

It was 5:45am. What time are the HOV lane restrictions in effect? In NYC I think HOV starts at 6am.

They are in effect 24/7 in the area of CA where this occurred.

24/7 HOV?
Strange, this link states otherwise:
[www.city-data.com]

That may be correct. However, lane restrictions only apply to minimum number of occupants required in a vehicle to use the HOV - they do not NOT give drivers authority to cross double yellow lines (actually, DOUBLE double yellow lines in this case) to enter/exit the HOV.



It is what it is.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: Gareth
Date: June 28, 2017 04:50PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
405 runs N/S, not E/W. Where on the freeway is that photo taken?

405 runs N/S, but in has sections of E/W around Long Beach.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: jdc
Date: June 28, 2017 05:01PM
"the" 405 is a big giant curve.





----


Edited 999 time(s). Last edit at 12:08PM by jdc.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: June 28, 2017 05:08PM
Quote
Gareth
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
405 runs N/S, not E/W. Where on the freeway is that photo taken?

405 runs N/S, but in has sections of E/W around Long Beach.

Indeed it does, but those sections are still referred to as 405 N/S.



It is what it is.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: M A V I C
Date: June 28, 2017 05:11PM
Quote
jdc
"the" 405 is a big giant curve.

The fact Californians say "the" before highway names has always seemed odd to me. But with 405, it's even more odd because there is more than one [en.wikipedia.org]

With I-5 at least, there is only one so it makes a little more sense.




Help MacInTouch: Buy from Amazon? use this link [amazon.com]
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: hal
Date: June 28, 2017 05:32PM
Quote
M A V I C
Quote
jdc
"the" 405 is a big giant curve.

The fact Californians say "the" before highway names has always seemed odd to me. But with 405, it's even more odd because there is more than one [en.wikipedia.org]

With I-5 at least, there is only one so it makes a little more sense.

Watch it buddy... SoCal says 'the' - we in the north use proper language.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 28, 2017 05:45PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
405 runs N/S, not E/W. Where on the freeway is that photo taken?

It's actually more NW/SE*, but there are sections that run E/W, and my HOV lane sample shot is from one of those. Here's a stretch with compass (thanks Google):




*from end to end.
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Re: Motorcyclist kicks car resulting in multi-vehicle collision
Posted by: C(-)ris
Date: June 28, 2017 06:09PM
Quote
Bill in NC
blind spot issue?

I will bet it was. This is why passing on the right is illegal in most states. There is room for a small SUV in most cars blind spots on the passenger side of the car. A motorcycle wouldn't be visible for an extended period of time if it was passing slowly on the right. If the vehicle on the left is moving faster than the vehicles on the right the one on the left passes and and are aware of the vehicle on the right and can keep an eye on it to see when they can move over. If the person on the right is passing the person on the left they may not be seen at all, especially if they were hanging out in the blind spot for an extended period of time. I do not believe that the car set out to hit the biker when changing lanes.

The sedan would likely be at fault in an accident as it crossed a double yellow and didn't check the blind spot well enough. However, the motorcyclist should be charged with some type of property damage. No matter what happened he has no right to kick a vehicle. The car driver should be cited for multiple infractions.



C(-)ris
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