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Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: space-time
Date: July 13, 2017 05:45PM
various news outlets reported this yesterday. Basically VISA is giving small retailers such as restaurants $10k to upgrade their payment systems and they must stop accepting cash.

Not sure if these links will work or not

[fortune.com]

[www.nbcnews.com]

EDIT: it bothers me a lot. I see a lot of tourists (for example my family) with cash, $100 bills, they do not want to use their plastic cards here. If the number is stolen, they have a hard time working out details with the bank back home if they are here several months. I also hate that you basically pay 2-3% more since you use plastic.

Cash is King.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/13/2017 05:47PM by space-time.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: bik
Date: July 13, 2017 05:57PM
On the one hand, it just feels wrong to me. Cash says right on it, "legal tender for all debts, public and private." Not sure what methods of enforcement Visa would use. Is the new processing equipment going to have spy cameras so that they can sue for their equipment back when a restaurant takes cash?

On the other hand, my wife (who's from Sweden and visits frequently) constantly tells me how behind-the-times we are here, and how there are so many places in Sweden/Stockholm where you can't use cash – you'll be screwed if you don't have a good card. And her concern is that some cards issued by smaller American banks won't work everywhere there, despite the Visa/MC logos.

I guess the US and I are both just behind the times.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: July 13, 2017 06:42PM
Sweetgreen is already hurting poor customers with a cashless policy. The message seems to be: "Don't have a checking account or credit card? We don't need your business..." Jerks.



rj
AKA
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: space-time
Date: July 13, 2017 06:50PM
Costco gas pumps also do not take cash. But they do take any cards, whereas in store they take only VISA
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: srf1957
Date: July 13, 2017 06:55PM
It is legal tender . Doesn't mean they have to accept it .
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: bik
Date: July 13, 2017 07:22PM
Quote
srf1957
It is legal tender . Doesn't mean they have to accept it .

So someone goes into one of these restaurants, eats a $100 meal, and then realizes the no cash policy.
They don't have a credit card, but offer cash.
The restaurant refuses and calls the police.

What's going to happen there?
The police are going to see a person offering "legal tender" to cover a debt.
The restaurant doesn't have to accept the cash, but can they really still claim a debt if they've refused cash payment?
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: ka jowct
Date: July 13, 2017 07:23PM
Any store that goes along with that will not get any money from me. I can't see how they'd get away with that here in NYC, so I probably don't have to worry about ever encountering that situation.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: space-time
Date: July 13, 2017 07:30PM
Quote
bik
Quote
srf1957
It is legal tender . Doesn't mean they have to accept it .

So someone goes into one of these restaurants, eats a $100 meal, and then realizes the no cash policy.
They don't have a credit card, but offer cash.
The restaurant refuses and calls the police.

What's going to happen there?
The police are going to see a person offering "legal tender" to cover a debt.
The restaurant doesn't have to accept the cash, but can they really still claim a debt if they've refused cash payment?

Maybe they ask for the credit card and open a tab before they serve meals and drinks?
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: bik
Date: July 13, 2017 07:36PM
Quote
space-time
Quote
bik
Quote
srf1957
It is legal tender . Doesn't mean they have to accept it .

So someone goes into one of these restaurants, eats a $100 meal, and then realizes the no cash policy.
They don't have a credit card, but offer cash.
The restaurant refuses and calls the police.

What's going to happen there?
The police are going to see a person offering "legal tender" to cover a debt.
The restaurant doesn't have to accept the cash, but can they really still claim a debt if they've refused cash payment?

Maybe they ask for the credit card and open a tab before they serve meals and drinks?

Well, sure.
In reality, I'd find it highly unlikely that this kind of situation would EVER end up with the police.

But I'm asking the theoretical question: What happens to a debt if you refuse payment in legal tender?

Is it still a legal debt after you've refused legal payment?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/13/2017 07:38PM by bik.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: GuyGene
Date: July 13, 2017 07:42PM
This is getting the world ready for cashless. Totally. It absolutely will come.



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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: Rick-o
Date: July 13, 2017 07:47PM
But, they said cash is KING!!

I do pay for groceries with cash. I didn't care for the stores collecting data from my purchases. Next thing you know, they'll make me put back the mac and cheese, as well as microwave popcorn!



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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: billb
Date: July 13, 2017 08:09PM
Quote
rjmacs
Sweetgreen is already hurting poor customers with a cashless policy. The message seems to be: "Don't have a checking account or credit card? We don't need your business..." Jerks.

Given some of Chipotle's recent contaminated food problems I really don't think cashiers handling filthy money also handling salads is such a healthy idea.
How many poor and unbanked eat at any fast food place let alone sweetgreen and also don't know how to read and comprehend all the CASH ONLY signs ?

Sweetgreen was going to have cash for cashcard machines, dunno what if anything happened with that.



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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/13/2017 08:12PM by billb.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: Bernie
Date: July 13, 2017 08:21PM
Rock-o-fellers.
Get it both ways.




Staunton, Virginia
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: GGD
Date: July 13, 2017 09:00PM
I would expect push-back from small businesses that do a lot of cash transactions. It would mean that there is a paper trail of all transactions and they can't skim some "tax free" cash off the top.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: ka jowct
Date: July 13, 2017 09:29PM
There are plenty of service jobs that pay cash almost exclusively: in NYC, house cleaning or baby sitting or dog walking or bar security are generally cash businesses.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: Wags
Date: July 13, 2017 11:08PM
All those tinfoil wearing conspiracy theorists have been right all along. They want a cashless society where the banks, i.e., the oligarch rulers, get a cut of every transaction. As a big bonus they get detailed info on everything you do. Essential for authoritarianism. Baa...
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: max
Date: July 14, 2017 04:20AM
Quote
space-time
Costco gas pumps also do not take cash. But they do take any cards, whereas in store they take only VISA
Costco is members only, so it has a different legal status, but you can purchase gas for cash.
It just requires an extra step of purchasing Costco cash card to use at the pump.
Very similar experience to buying gas in some old Communist countries, where you needed to purchase gas coupons in a gas store, then driving, often miles away, to the the gas station to get your gas....
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: dk62
Date: July 14, 2017 09:04AM
Cash has to be legally accepted for settling a debt, but not up front (before debt has occurred). The restaurant situation is interesting, but I assume a situation like at many airports - tablet and card swipe at every table for ordering and payment - no option to order without a card swipe.

I seldom use cash and couldn't care less if this situation occurs. I also travel a lot, and it is much more of a pain to encounter situations where cards are not accepted than the other way around. I already have hundreds of dollars in at least 20 different currencies from leftovers.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: dk62
Date: July 14, 2017 09:08AM
There is a number of cards that do not charge currency conversion fees for purchases abroad. Also, if somebody steals your card or you lose it you are out of nothing and should just go back to the hotel and get another card that you wisely left there. Not so with cash.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: Mike Johnson
Date: July 14, 2017 12:54PM
The government would love to end cash, so there's no way they would get in the way of this. They'd love to use card transactions to track our every move, our every encounter.

For financial institutions, it's not so much the data that appeals to them, it's charging a fee every time money changes hands. Nearly 10 million US employees are paid in the form of a payroll card, which, like a prepaid debit card, typically charges a fee every time you use it, or don't use it, or check your balance. There's a debate over whether employers should be able to offer only payroll cards; the biggest opponent of payroll cards is the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. So, uh, given how things are going, it's probably a safe bet payroll cards will become more common over the next couple years.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: July 14, 2017 02:05PM
....mob run businesses will always take cash......



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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: Bill in NC
Date: July 14, 2017 02:30PM
cash is also a pita for businesses to handle.

card-only will be seen more and more.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: macphanatic
Date: July 14, 2017 03:13PM
There is no Federal law that requires them to accept cash. There may be state laws that do.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: Buzz
Date: July 15, 2017 03:44AM
Our favorite Italian deli and a convenient, oft eaten at Mexican restaurant are now cash only, and they have generic ATM's for plasticers on premises for their having gone all green.

OTOH, this thread has given me a multi-billion dollar idea. Thanks!
Free MBP's for everyone here if it works, and I'm able to monetize it.
==
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: space-time
Date: July 15, 2017 07:10AM
Quote
Buzz
Our favorite Italian deli and a convenient, oft eaten at Mexican restaurant are now cash only, and they have generic ATM's for plasticers on premises for their having gone all green.

OTOH, this thread has given me a multi-billion dollar idea. Thanks!
Free MBP's for everyone here if it works, and I'm able to monetize it.
==

I hope you give a larger share of MBPs to the original poster, whoever he or she may be.
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Re: Is this even LEGAL? Visa To Pay Businesses To Stop Accepting Cash
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 16, 2017 05:49AM
Anything can be hacked because any person can be corrupted. I don't like handing my card to fast food drive thru clerks. I can't see what they're doing.

With cash, you can only be scammed out of the amount of money you have on hand.

Remember when Apple reversed it's "no-cash" policy at its stores?

Apple reverses its no-cash payment policy for iPads
[abc7news.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2017 05:55AM by vision63.
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