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Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: lost in space
Date: September 13, 2017 03:48PM
No politics here, just sadness. Small town in eastern WA, bout 500 people. When will this end.

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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: September 13, 2017 04:00PM
Damn. Just... damn.
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: billb
Date: September 13, 2017 04:10PM
Quote
lost in space
When will this end.



probably never

Quote

some evidence has suggested that mental illness or mental health symptoms are nearly universal among school shooters
[en.wikipedia.org]



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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: Speedy
Date: September 13, 2017 04:21PM
Quote
billb
Quote
lost in space
When will this end.



probably never

Quote

some evidence has suggested that mental illness or mental health symptoms are nearly universal among school shooters
[en.wikipedia.org]

I agree with billb, mental illness drives most of these. And not easy to know who may break. Too bad this 15 y.o. had access to a weapon.



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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: kj
Date: September 13, 2017 04:48PM
Weird that the school allegedly had a bit of bullying problem. I guess we'll see if that might have been a factor.
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: DP
Date: September 13, 2017 05:39PM
Weird that the school allegedly had a bit of bullying problem

That never ends either, no matter all the programs and info out there especially on social media.



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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: Filliam H. Muffman
Date: September 13, 2017 05:50PM
Mass shootings are a nearly daily occurrence. How do you think we can end that?



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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: kj
Date: September 13, 2017 05:55PM
I'm not sure programs, counselors giving talks, etc. help much, but I will say a school's leadership (especially principal) makes a huge difference in the culture of a school.

I'm not sure about the mental illness point. Consider that doing something like this would probably qualify you for a diagnosis. That is a tautology (he did something mentally ill because he's mentally ill).
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: lost in space
Date: September 13, 2017 06:27PM
Quote
kj
I'm not sure programs, counselors giving talks, etc. help much, but I will say a school's leadership (especially principal) makes a huge difference in the culture of a school.

ship

Most program don't work, but my son's high school doesn't have a bullying problem, and its students come from all social levels, rich and poor, about 1600 students. It has a high percentage of graduation and college acceptance. The principal is always in the halls, eats in the cafeteria, talking to students and teachers, all the kids know him by name, and he knows a lot of the kids by name. There aren't any programs. I don't know how he does it, but he's got something good going on there. True, the principal can make a or break a school.



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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: DP
Date: September 13, 2017 06:39PM
How do you think we can end that?

Well, already fellow students are saying the shooter was a bit off his nut. People always come out of the woodwork after an incident saying that the perp or perps was/were not right in the head. They need to be identified and gotten help before they go over the edge.

Also, we know most of these shootings are done with illegally obtained weapons, whether they are stolen, or obtained from an insecure location, or whether the weapon was in illegal possession of, for example, a convicted felon.

We know there are kids in their early teens in Chicago, Los Angeles, Miami; yes, even Detroit, and many other large cities, many of them in gangs, who are using automatic-not "assault style rifles"-but fully automatic weapons. How do they acquire them? Keeping illegal weapons off of the streets should be a priority of law enforcement and the tools given to them be effective at interdiction. We need to get to all stages of illegal weapon smuggling and sales to make a difference.



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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: M A V I C
Date: September 13, 2017 07:31PM
Sad. An old boss grew up not too far from there. Years ago a school shooting occurred and we talked about it. He said at his school it would have never happened because nearly all kids had guns in their lockers. So if one kid started to shoot, he wouldn't make it very long. Knowing people could easily defend themselves kept other kids in check. No way to know if that prevented any shootings or not. There wasn't any.

I'm not sure what this kid's problem was. Mostly in middle school and some in elementary, I was beat up or at least bullied on a near daily basis because I was white. One time a girl liked me. She wasn't white. Other kids didn't think it was okay for her to like me, so they broke a few of my bones to make sure I didn't pursue anything. Of course, the schools had policies that if you were involved in any conflict, you all got the same punishment. It gave me a strong distaste for school officials. If getting beaten up wasn't bad enough, being punished for being beaten up makes it a lot worse. Now when I hear of kids who are treated like crap and lash out, I can partially identify with them. I never thought of shooting any of them, however. We did have guns at home and I had practice with them.




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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: davester
Date: September 13, 2017 10:28PM
Quote
lost in space
No politics here, just sadness. Small town in eastern WA, bout 500 people. When will this end.

Spokesman Review

When the US becomes like the civilized nations and makes access to firearms subject to reasonable regulation (you know, as in "a well regulated militia").



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: Racer X
Date: September 13, 2017 10:46PM
They need to enforce 100% the laws already on the books. That would go a LONG way.

I recall an arrest in the 90s where a convicted felon transported 5 stolen handguns across state borders, and sold them. The combined max sentences for his 22 felonies (4 different ones per pistol) plus 2 others, should have been 422 years. He got less than 10, and out in 6. That's a HUGE part of the problem.
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: pdq
Date: September 14, 2017 12:30AM
Quote
Racer X

I recall an arrest in the 90s where a convicted felon transported 5 stolen handguns across state borders, and sold them...He got less than 10, and out in 6.

Heh. He should have brought them to a gun show. He'd probably still be free.
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: max
Date: September 14, 2017 05:28AM
9 years for a nonviolent crime is still quite a sentence.
By European standards it would be seen as quite barbaric....
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: September 14, 2017 07:18AM
Michael Harper, a 15-year-old sophomore, said the suspect had brought notes in the beginning of the school year, saying he was going to do “something stupid” and might get killed or jailed. Some students alerted counselors, the teen told AP, but it wasn’t clear what school officials did in response.

A call to the school was not immediately returned.

Harper said the shooter had many friends and was not bullied, calling him “nice and funny and weird” and a huge fan of the TV show “Breaking Bad.” He also said the suspect was obsessed with other school shootings.

“He watched a lot of school shooting documentaries,” Harper said.
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: deckeda
Date: September 14, 2017 08:09AM
Quote
Racer X
They need to enforce 100% the laws already on the books. ...

Getting arrested, tried, and convicted while still only doing a little time is by definition enforcing the laws."

Judges sometimes have some leeway in sentencing some things, but going outside of the law ain't one of them, right?

So if what someone wants is to limit a judge's interpretation of law, there's a simple way to do that.
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: kj
Date: September 14, 2017 01:30PM
Quote
Steve G.
Michael Harper, a 15-year-old sophomore, said the suspect had brought notes in the beginning of the school year, saying he was going to do “something stupid” and might get killed or jailed. Some students alerted counselors, the teen told AP, but it wasn’t clear what school officials did in response.

A call to the school was not immediately returned.

Harper said the shooter had many friends and was not bullied, calling him “nice and funny and weird” and a huge fan of the TV show “Breaking Bad.” He also said the suspect was obsessed with other school shootings.

“He watched a lot of school shooting documentaries,” Harper said.

Still a tough one. Schools Psychs here spend a lot of time on threat assessments. How do you really know which are serious? And "weird" is not mentally ill. Sounds like he might just be a bad dude.
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Re: Student dead at a high school near here.
Posted by: Racer X
Date: September 14, 2017 11:43PM
Quote
pdq
Quote
Racer X

I recall an arrest in the 90s where a convicted felon transported 5 stolen handguns across state borders, and sold them...He got less than 10, and out in 6.

Heh. He should have brought them to a gun show. He'd probably still be free.

Depends. In WA State, ALL sales, even private are required to go through a Federal Firearms Licensed holder for a background check. And Every gun show here going back decades has required background checks as well.

Just enforce the laws already on the books.
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