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How would you attach legs
Posted by: rgG
Date: January 12, 2018 04:14PM
If I have a butcher block countertop and want to put two legs on one end, how would be the best way to attach them?
The legs are pine and are square cut across the top and do not have a threaded bolt coming out. There won't be a skirt on the countertop, so I can't mount them into a corner bracket.
What would you guys suggest for a secure but invisible way to attach the legs to the top. I don't want to drill through the top of the countertop. The countertop is 1.5" thick.
the other end will be supported by a cabinet.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: artie67
Date: January 12, 2018 04:37PM
You need some leg attachment plates. Usually come in fours with hardware.
Here's a google of some
[duckduckgo.com]
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Mr Downtown
Date: January 12, 2018 04:38PM
I'd put hardwood 1x2s underneath, transverse to the countertop, with the legs squeezed in between. That way, multiple wood screws through the 1x2s and into the legs would hold them pretty tightly and securely.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Paul F.
Date: January 12, 2018 04:43PM
Mr. Downtowns plan is definitely "Plan A".

I would use my most-favoritist-ever woodbuilding-stuff tool; the Kreg Pocket Drill and screws.

[www.amazon.com]

This, a drill, a bag of the Kreg screws (sold seperately) and a good clamp or two, and you can make pockets on the unobtrusive sides of the legs, and run screws into the top.

I would definitely build the hardwood 1x2 "box" to frame around it for added strength, and attach THAT with pocket screws!



Paul F.
-----
A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand. - Lucius Annaeus Seneca c. 5 BC - 65 AD
----
Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.

--

--

--
Eureka, CA
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: BernDog
Date: January 12, 2018 05:25PM
Quote
artie67
You need some leg attachment plates. Usually come in fours with hardware.
Here's a google of some
[duckduckgo.com]

Seconded
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: January 12, 2018 05:36PM

call the guy on the left
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: January 12, 2018 05:44PM
....she's got legs.....she knows how to use them.....



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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: artie67
Date: January 12, 2018 06:02PM
rgR, here's a "how to do". I only recommend the plates and not the T-nuts method.
PM me if you have questions.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: GuyGene
Date: January 12, 2018 06:02PM
I love that you said "goog" but used duckduckgo!! That's the ticket, artie.

Anyway, I can tell you from floppy table experience, unless you attach something like 2x4s under the table edges indented a bit back from edges, it will not be secure. Check out about any table, you will see boards running along the underside a few inches back from the edge.



That old man - he don't think like no old man...
Now I wouldn't want to be within 400 - 500 yards of one of them nuclear bombs when it goes off! WW1 Vet Old Man
"He's pinned under an outcropping of rock. Lucky for him, the rock kept the dirt from burying him alive."
If idiots could fly, this place would be an airport. And I'd be a TSA agent.
A bonified member of The Mystic Knights of The Sea, George P. Stevens, President. Andy Brown, Treasurer, Algonquin J. Calhoun, Legal Consultant.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: billb
Date: January 12, 2018 06:05PM
Maybe ask an expert at Lowes.



The Phorum Wall keeps us safe from illegal characters and words
The doorstep to the temple of wisdom is the knowledge of one's own ignorance. -Benjamin Franklin
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: rgG
Date: January 12, 2018 06:15PM
Quote
billb
Maybe ask an expert at Lowes.

Lol.

Thanks for all the suggestions. Adding some 1x2s to the underside would be pretty easy and probably the most secure, too. I can glue and screw them on and they shouldn't be going anywhere.

I am afraid I won't be able drill the hole super straight to be able to use the bolts and plates, since I don't have a drill press, just a drill.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: GuyGene
Date: January 12, 2018 06:28PM
A drill and maybe that kregg thingamajig mentioned above. It'll work. Oh, the "experts" at Lowe's, that's a good one ROTFL



That old man - he don't think like no old man...
Now I wouldn't want to be within 400 - 500 yards of one of them nuclear bombs when it goes off! WW1 Vet Old Man
"He's pinned under an outcropping of rock. Lucky for him, the rock kept the dirt from burying him alive."
If idiots could fly, this place would be an airport. And I'd be a TSA agent.
A bonified member of The Mystic Knights of The Sea, George P. Stevens, President. Andy Brown, Treasurer, Algonquin J. Calhoun, Legal Consultant.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: rgG
Date: January 12, 2018 07:08PM
Quote
GuyGene
A drill and maybe that kregg thingamajig mentioned above. It'll work. Oh, the "experts" at Lowe's, that's a good one ROTFL

Yeah, that Kregg thing is cool. I have seen them use those on this old house.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Paul F.
Date: January 12, 2018 07:14PM
Quote
rgG
Quote
GuyGene
A drill and maybe that kregg thingamajig mentioned above. It'll work. Oh, the "experts" at Lowe's, that's a good one ROTFL

Yeah, that Kregg thing is cool. I have seen them use those on this old house.

It’s freakin awesome... seriously. If you need to join a couple pieces of wood together and not have the screws glaringly obvious, just buy the $62 set.



Paul F.
-----
A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand. - Lucius Annaeus Seneca c. 5 BC - 65 AD
----
Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.

--

--

--
Eureka, CA
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Cary
Date: January 12, 2018 07:55PM
I would drill a hole in the top of the leg, thread in a double ended lag screw, drill a hole (shallower than the table top), and thread in the leg. Another option is to use one that is threaded on one end, drill a counter bore in the side of the leg, and use that to place a washer and nut to tighten the leg to the top.

I don't think I'd use pocket screws - they are thin, and won't have much shear strength.

How thick are the legs? Are they square at the top? Round?
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: GuyGene
Date: January 12, 2018 07:56PM
Kregg Thingamajig® is on my wish list for a present from Ethyl.

Cary, believe me, that method won't be strong. Must have wood supports between the legs and table top that make a complete connection around the table edges.



That old man - he don't think like no old man...
Now I wouldn't want to be within 400 - 500 yards of one of them nuclear bombs when it goes off! WW1 Vet Old Man
"He's pinned under an outcropping of rock. Lucky for him, the rock kept the dirt from burying him alive."
If idiots could fly, this place would be an airport. And I'd be a TSA agent.
A bonified member of The Mystic Knights of The Sea, George P. Stevens, President. Andy Brown, Treasurer, Algonquin J. Calhoun, Legal Consultant.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/12/2018 07:57PM by GuyGene.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: rgG
Date: January 12, 2018 08:01PM
I am now thinking I might use threaded pipe for the legs and then I could get the flanges to mount to the top. It would also give me that industrial look. Plus, I should be able to get someone at the HD to cut and thread it for me to my exact length. grinning smiley





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: GuyGene
Date: January 12, 2018 08:03PM
That'll work rg, but won't be so strong. Fine as long as you don't need lateral strength.



That old man - he don't think like no old man...
Now I wouldn't want to be within 400 - 500 yards of one of them nuclear bombs when it goes off! WW1 Vet Old Man
"He's pinned under an outcropping of rock. Lucky for him, the rock kept the dirt from burying him alive."
If idiots could fly, this place would be an airport. And I'd be a TSA agent.
A bonified member of The Mystic Knights of The Sea, George P. Stevens, President. Andy Brown, Treasurer, Algonquin J. Calhoun, Legal Consultant.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: rgG
Date: January 12, 2018 08:32PM
Quote
GuyGene
That'll work rg, but won't be so strong. Fine as long as you don't need lateral strength.

Good point. I might need to put in a cross bar piece of pipe about mid way up, to give it more lateral stability.
These legs will only be on one end of the countertop. The other end will be supported by a base cabinet.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: davester
Date: January 12, 2018 09:10PM
Quote
rgG
Quote
billb
Maybe ask an expert at Lowes.

Lol.

Thanks for all the suggestions. Adding some 1x2s to the underside would be pretty easy and probably the most secure, too. I can glue and screw them on and they shouldn't be going anywhere.

I am afraid I won't be able drill the hole super straight to be able to use the bolts and plates, since I don't have a drill press, just a drill.

Just get one of these: [www.amazon.com]




"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Buzz
Date: January 12, 2018 10:48PM
I'm w/ Cary on this one... they're called hanger bolts, and if properly installed, that's the way to go... unless the legs are real puny, skinny things, in which case you'll need a supportive leg holder. And by puny, skinny in square pine, that means less than about 1.75"..., anything bigger, you're golden. Good luck.
==
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Racer X
Date: January 13, 2018 12:11AM
Quote
billb
Maybe ask an expert at Lowes.
smiley-score010
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: artie67
Date: January 13, 2018 01:38AM
Opps!! Left off the link. [www.wikihow.com]

Please do not use pipe. You need to do a drawing and find the true height of based on the cabinet and then how you are going to attach to the cabinet. Leg length is based on this. I can help you with this and my wife can do a working drawing for you to work with.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Michael
Date: January 13, 2018 06:42AM
Quote
rgG
Quote
GuyGene
That'll work rg, but won't be so strong. Fine as long as you don't need lateral strength.

Good point. I might need to put in a cross bar piece of pipe about mid way up, to give it more lateral stability.
These legs will only be on one end of the countertop. The other end will be supported by a base cabinet.

If the end supported by counter is attached to the counter you shouldn't have to worry about lateral stability. The counter will take care of that. But, a cross piece would look good and give you a place to put a foot if standing at the counter.

If you use the wood legs (that don't already have a screw, as you noted), I'd use double-ended screws that first went into the top of the leg and then into the top. If you don't get the screw into the top of the leg in exactly the center you can accommodate for that when you drill the hole on the underside of the top. One those were screwed in, I'd put a skirt around the counter top and in contact with the legs. I'd screw the skirt to the underside of the top and then to the legs. Done. Here's a link to the double-ended screws: [www.homedepot.com]
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Cary
Date: January 13, 2018 07:57AM
Quote
Buzz
I'm w/ Cary on this one... they're called hanger bolts, and if properly installed, that's the way to go... unless the legs are real puny, skinny things, in which case you'll need a supportive leg holder. And by puny, skinny in square pine, that means less than about 1.75"..., anything bigger, you're golden. Good luck.
==

Thanks - I couldn't remember the name...
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Cary
Date: January 13, 2018 08:06AM
Quote
GuyGene
Kregg Thingamajig® is on my wish list for a present from Ethyl.

Cary, believe me, that method won't be strong. Must have wood supports between the legs and table top that make a complete connection around the table edges.

Gene - It really depends on the cross section size of the legs at the top. As Buzz said, anything => 1.75" is exactly what they are made for.

The only way to make the pocket screws strong would be to put them on opposing sides, which will make the holes (or plugs) apparent from the viewable sides.

I think pocket screws are great - for fastening adjacent face material (frames, for instance). I don't think this is the correct application.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: rgG
Date: January 13, 2018 09:10AM
Another easier option might be to buy adjustable legs from IKEA. They have mounting plates and then I can adjust to get the top perfectly level. The cabinet on the other end is a small counter height drawer and door combo. There will also be a small beverage fridge under the end with the legs. I didn’t want it to support that end of the top by itself, but it will be there, just in case there was a problem with the legs.

Thanks again for all the good advice. Now I just have to decide exactly how to proceed. Maybe I will post a pic, if I ever get it done. smiling smiley





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: Carm
Date: January 13, 2018 09:29AM
Treat it like a table build and mount side pieces (apron,skirt,frame) to hold the legs stable and add a couple of metal brackets to hold that to the counter top from underneath with small screws. Google for how to build a table( image search)
FWIW most of the counters I’ve seen how you describe with two legs have a frame of some kind for stability. Except for my wife’s grandpas counter. It has a single pole underneath and that is mounted to the floor (that thing isn’t moving)

It can cost you a little or a lot, depends on how custom you want it.

Edit: the fridge addition changes things. I’d go with the hanger bolts Cary suggested, that would be the cleanest look. Second option would be the adjustable legs from IKEA, if there wasn’t room for a frame.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2018 09:36AM by Carm.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: tenders
Date: January 13, 2018 10:41AM
I agree that the Kreg pocket screws are, as we used to say in the Navy, "slicker than warm snot on a brass doorknob," but the huge leverage of legs in this application will overwhelm their strength.

If the legs are square, the problem with Cary's hanger bolt concept is that it's impossible to tighten the legs against the countertop such that the edges of the legs are aligned with the edge of the countertop. (This is one reason why round legs were invented.)

With butcher block, why not countersink a lag bolt into the leg from the top of the counter, and just cover it with a little piece of wood sanded flush? Own the contrast! Maybe even make it a feature by covering it with a piece of contrasting tile!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2018 10:45AM by tenders.
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: rgG
Date: January 13, 2018 10:44AM
Quote
Carm
Treat it like a table build and mount side pieces (apron,skirt,frame) to hold the legs stable and add a couple of metal brackets to hold that to the counter top from underneath with small screws. Google for how to build a table( image search)
FWIW most of the counters I’ve seen how you describe with two legs have a frame of some kind for stability. Except for my wife’s grandpas counter. It has a single pole underneath and that is mounted to the floor (that thing isn’t moving)

It can cost you a little or a lot, depends on how custom you want it.

Edit: the fridge addition changes things. I’d go with the hanger bolts Cary suggested, that would be the cleanest look. Second option would be the adjustable legs from IKEA, if there wasn’t room for a frame.

There isn't room for a frame because of the cabinet on the other end. The top needs to sit flush on the cabinet. I guess I could put a frame up to the cabinet, but I was hoping to avoid that.
I may just go with the adjustable legs, from IKEA or somewhere.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: How would you attach legs
Posted by: billb
Date: January 13, 2018 12:21PM
Kreg a 1x4 between the legs and kreg the 1x4 to the top.
Make a 1x4 box frame to attach to the base cabinet if you like that look more better.
Pin the legs to the floor with a dowel or metal pin so they don't get kicked out.
Screw the base cabinet to the floor and top the same way.

It meanss you'll likely have to remove the top, legs and base cabinet on the other end any time you want to replace the flooring but you'd likely be doing that anyway.



The Phorum Wall keeps us safe from illegal characters and words
The doorstep to the temple of wisdom is the knowledge of one's own ignorance. -Benjamin Franklin
BOYCOTT YOPLAIT [www.noyoplait.com]
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