advertisement
Forums

The Forum is sponsored by 
 

AAPL stock: Click Here

You are currently viewing the Tips and Deals forum
forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: December 28, 2018 07:49AM
....deadline......


Sears may be down to its last 24 hours. Iconic retailer likely liquidates if no bid comes in Friday

•The company's last shot at survival is a $4.6 billion proposal, put forward by Chairman Eddie Lampert.
•The bid, largely composed of outside capital, has faced challenges from the start.
•The 125-year-old company has more than 68,000 employees.

.....The employer of more than 68,000 filed for bankruptcy in October. Its last shot at survival is a $4.6 billion proposal put forward by its chairman, Eddie Lampert, to buy the company out of bankruptcy through his hedge fund, ESL Investments. ESL is the only party offering to buy Sears as a whole, people familiar with the situation tell CNBC. Without that bid or another like it, liquidators will break the company up into pieces.

But as Lampert stares down a deadline of Dec. 28 to submit his offer, he is quickly running out of time. As of Thursday afternoon, Lampert had neither submitted his bid, nor rounded up financing, the people familiar said. Should Lampert submit a bid, Sears' advisors would have until Jan. 4 to decide whether he is a "qualified bidder." Only then, could ESL take part in an auction against liquidation bids on Jan. 14.

It is possible Lampert, Sears' largest investor, secures financing in time to meet the deadline, these people said. The hedge fund manager turned retailer has managed last-minute feats before. Due to requirements by the Securities and Exchange Commission, Lampert will be required to make his bid public. That stipulation that could sway him to prolong the filing until its exact deadline of 4:00 p.m. ET Friday.

Nonetheless, the quickly approaching cutoff puts Sears the closest to death it has ever been. Should Lampert miss the deadline, it would put Sears and Kmart on the path to liquidation. That process would take weeks, according to the guidelines laid out by the bankruptcy court. But the process has also already slowly begun, with the retailer weighing the closure of 50 to 80 more stores, CNBC has reported.

The people familiar with these developments requested anonymity because the talks are confidential.

Sears filed for bankruptcy on Oct. 15 with a little under 700 stores. At that time, it said it would close 142 unprofitable stores. In November it announced the closure of 40 additional stores.

Sears in bankruptcy has, therefore, continued a trend that far preceded its chapter 11 filing, a slow-paced liquidation.

Once the nation's biggest retailer, it was also its first "everything store," stocking everything from jewelry to clothing, from hardware to prefabricated homes. But the department store industry has struggled over the past half-decade, as the mall has become less convenient and apparel more casual. Rival J.C. Penney is also feeling the pressure of this trend, on Wednesday its shares dipped below a $1 for the first time.

Lampert had a plan to save Sears by combining it with Kmart, which ESL bought out of bankruptcy after the discount store's 2002 bankruptcy filing. But the cultures of Sears and Kmart employees were different, as were its shoppers — cross-selling Sears' appliances and Kmart's apparel proved less successful than originally planned.

In his five-year reign as CEO and even longer term as chairman, Lampert has largely run the company like the hedge-fund manager he once was, say former executives, employees and people familiar with his thinking. That meant investing less in its stores and advertising, believing such investments were optional.

It also meant keeping Sears alive through complex investments from ESL. Lampert poured millions of dollars through ESL into Sears, which struggled for years with losses and debt. Those investments came amid Lampert's strong belief in his ability to turn Sears around, in part through its loyalty program, "Shop Your Way," say people familiar with Lampert's thinking. But Sears finally hit a cliff, when it had a $134 million payment it could not meet.

Financing an issue

Keeping Sears afloat was easier for Lampert before it filed for bankruptcy. ESL's loans, while ample, had been largely protected by Sears' assets, like its prime real estate. Once it filed for bankruptcy, Sears has had far less to offer its lenders and Lampert has had less control.

ESL was in talks to help finance a junior portion of Sears' bankruptcy loan. Those talks fell apart after he asked lenders to improve the terms of the loan and offer him more protections.

His $4.6 billion offer to buy Sears, meantime, is comprised of various tranches of financing, and little of his own cash. The outside lenders he is asking to support his bid lack the same apparent drive that Lampert had to turning Sears around.

The asset-based loan he is seeking has faced scrutiny from investment banks, weary of lending to a business that hasn't turned a profit since 2010.

Some creditors he asked to support his offer have called his efforts to keep Sears alive a "foolhardy gamble with other people's money," according to court filings. They have also taken aim at his efforts to fund $1.8 billion of his bid by forgiving Sears debt owed to him, through a so-called credit bid.

Those creditors last week said they believe there may be claims against Sears for transactions under Lampert's leadership. Those deals include Sears' spinoff of Lands' End and transactions with Seritage Growth Properties, a real estate investment trust Lampert created through select Sears' properties. As such, they have said they will object to the credit bid.

Lampert could use his own cash to backstop the $1.8 billion credit bid, but it remains unclear whether he is willing to do so.

Meantime, Lampert has also asked as part of ESL's bid that Sears' creditors agree to a release from potential lawsuits over his past transactions. With the threat of litigation looming large, that ask is far from trivial.

Without financing in place, ESL missed its chance earlier this month to be named a so-called stalking horse bidder in an auction for Sears. The miss was an early sign of the challenges Lampert faced. Being named the stalking horse in a bankruptcy sale typically affords a number of perks, like a role in setting bidding procedures and a break-up fee should that bid be topped.............



it probably ends............today...........?!



____________________________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: Ombligo
Date: December 28, 2018 07:55AM
Sears could have been what Amazon became..

Instead it blew it, and ruined iconic names like Kenmore, Diehard, and Craftsman along the way. Those used to be respected brands backed by a great warranty - now they are last choice regardless of who is selling them (I'm looking at you Lowes - you should have stuck with Kobalt or made a naming deal with a comparable manufacturer like Porter Cable)



“No persons are more frequently wrong, than those who will not admit they are wrong.”
-- François de La Rochefoucauld

"WE CALL BS!" -- Emma Gonzalez
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: DP
Date: December 28, 2018 08:18AM
Hell-they were the original Amazon! What a crazy idea; mailing consumer goods across the whole country. Latest fashions from New York can be had in Laramie or Amarillo! Wow!





Disclaimer: This post is checked for correct spelling, punctuation, and grammar. Any attempts at humor are solely the responsibility of the author and bear no claim that any and all readers will approve or appreciate said attempt at humor.
My name is DP, and I approve this message.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: lost in space
Date: December 28, 2018 08:57AM
Amazon they were. They could send you anything from shoes to houses.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: 3d
Date: December 28, 2018 09:31AM
$8.4 million in bonuses to 19 executives and $16.9 million in bonuses for 315 senior employees.

Laid-off Sears and Kmart employees have reported they stopped receiving their severance checks soon after the company filed for bankruptcy protection.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: JoeH
Date: December 28, 2018 10:34AM
Sears management forgot their roots staring over 25 years ago, Eddie Lampert however was probably worse for the company. He has made certain he and his investors have made money off the company at the cost of it ever being able to become a successful operation.

It has been a few years since I bought anything from Sears in a store. The one part of it that I hope survives is the Sears Parts service, That has been useful for finding parts for all kinds of appliances and tools, not just ones sold by Sears.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: vision63
Date: December 28, 2018 11:11AM
Why is Dec 28 the "deadline?" That sounds made up.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: Will Collier
Date: December 28, 2018 12:06PM
Quote
Ombligo
Sears could have been what Amazon became..

Instead it blew it, and ruined iconic names like Kenmore, Diehard, and Craftsman along the way. Those used to be respected brands backed by a great warranty - now they are last choice regardless of who is selling them (I'm looking at you Lowes - you should have stuck with Kobalt or made a naming deal with a comparable manufacturer like Porter Cable)

Absolutely. They already had the distribution infrastructure in place, all they needed to do was commit to e-sales. Instead they doubled down on protecting B&M, and the rest is history.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: vision63
Date: December 28, 2018 12:24PM
Quote
Will Collier
Quote
Ombligo
Sears could have been what Amazon became..

Instead it blew it, and ruined iconic names like Kenmore, Diehard, and Craftsman along the way. Those used to be respected brands backed by a great warranty - now they are last choice regardless of who is selling them (I'm looking at you Lowes - you should have stuck with Kobalt or made a naming deal with a comparable manufacturer like Porter Cable)

Absolutely. They already had the distribution infrastructure in place, all they needed to do was commit to e-sales. Instead they doubled down on protecting B&M, and the rest is history.

Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

I just bought a lot of equipment from B and H which I would have bought locally were it not for the $250 in taxes I would have been forced to pay. How is a local camera store supposed to compete with that? Once Amazon had the heft to offer free shipping on orders over $25 and eventually Prime, it was over for Sears, K-Mart etc which had already been damaged by Wal-Mart.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: December 28, 2018 12:33PM
Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

That and it seems AMZ had the backing to run at a loss for a long time, whereas Sears couldn't have operated that way, as we can see.




When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men
except by believing all possible evil
of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

Perfection is the enemy of progress. -Winston Churchill

-An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

Mister, that's a ten-gallon hat on a twenty-gallon head.

I *love* Sigs. It's Glocks I hate.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: JoeH
Date: December 28, 2018 12:38PM
Quote
vision63
Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

You keep repeating this assertion, it basically is not true. Amazon has been collecting sales tax where required for years just like any other retailer selling through mail order. It has been in business for barely 24 years, the first several of which it sold books that are not taxed in many states anyways.

I do know they have been collecting sale tax on my purchases for over a decade, they started once they had a physical presence in the state. They have been doing so in most other states for at least that length of time. They did use some ploys by claiming some divisions were separate entities that did not equal a physical presence in a state, but that has been ended.

As for its impact on Sears, It might have been a minor contributor to loss of sales. But the damage to Sears was for the most part self inflicted. They exited the catalog business before Amazon was even in existence. Then they were late in the game at creating an online sales presence, doing so after many other retailers had already done so.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: vision63
Date: December 28, 2018 01:00PM
Quote
JoeH
Quote
vision63
Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

You keep repeating this assertion, it basically is not true. Amazon has been collecting sales tax where required for years just like any other retailer selling through mail order. It has been in business for barely 24 years, the first several of which it sold books that are not taxed in many states anyways.

I do know they have been collecting sale tax on my purchases for over a decade, they started once they had a physical presence in the state. They have been doing so in most other states for at least that length of time. They did use some ploys by claiming some divisions were separate entities that did not equal a physical presence in a state, but that has been ended.

As for its impact on Sears, It might have been a minor contributor to loss of sales. But the damage to Sears was for the most part self inflicted. They exited the catalog business before Amazon was even in existence. Then they were late in the game at creating an online sales presence, doing so after many other retailers had already done so.

Yes, they've been collecting taxes for a time now. But not for the majority of it's existence. By the time they started charging, CompUSA, Circuit City, Sears etc was on the ropes. Sears made mistakes, but the TAX situation is what is killing them. Let's also not ignore the B&H example I mentioned. This is ongoing and continuing.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: JoeH
Date: December 28, 2018 01:51PM
Quote
vision63
Quote
JoeH
Quote
vision63
Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

You keep repeating this assertion, it basically is not true. Amazon has been collecting sales tax where required for years just like any other retailer selling through mail order. It has been in business for barely 24 years, the first several of which it sold books that are not taxed in many states anyways.

I do know they have been collecting sale tax on my purchases for over a decade, they started once they had a physical presence in the state. They have been doing so in most other states for at least that length of time. They did use some ploys by claiming some divisions were separate entities that did not equal a physical presence in a state, but that has been ended.

As for its impact on Sears, It might have been a minor contributor to loss of sales. But the damage to Sears was for the most part self inflicted. They exited the catalog business before Amazon was even in existence. Then they were late in the game at creating an online sales presence, doing so after many other retailers had already done so.

Yes, they've been collecting taxes for a time now. But not for the majority of it's existence. By the time they started charging, CompUSA, Circuit City, Sears etc was on the ropes. Sears made mistakes, but the TAX situation is what is killing them. Let's also not ignore the B&H example I mentioned. This is ongoing and continuing.

No, for over half its existence Amazon has been collecting taxes. B&H is not a valid comparison, they are essentially located in a couple states, NY & NJ. As for being on the ropes, when Sears was acquired by Kmart in 2004 for $11 billion, Amazon's gross sales was about $8 billion. The only reason they were on the ropes was competition by another B&M company - Walmart and their own management failures. Quite frankly the sales tax not being collected wasn't that much of a factor in their loss of sales.

By the way, your math skills need a lot of improvement. The vast majority of Amazon's sales have had sales tax collected, both in terms of time and especially in terms of total sales over that time. Basically in the last 5-6 years Amazon has sold more than it did in the entire time before that since making its first sale about 23 years ago.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: vision63
Date: December 28, 2018 02:07PM
Quote
JoeH
Quote
vision63
Quote
JoeH
Quote
vision63
Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

You keep repeating this assertion, it basically is not true. Amazon has been collecting sales tax where required for years just like any other retailer selling through mail order. It has been in business for barely 24 years, the first several of which it sold books that are not taxed in many states anyways.

I do know they have been collecting sale tax on my purchases for over a decade, they started once they had a physical presence in the state. They have been doing so in most other states for at least that length of time. They did use some ploys by claiming some divisions were separate entities that did not equal a physical presence in a state, but that has been ended.

As for its impact on Sears, It might have been a minor contributor to loss of sales. But the damage to Sears was for the most part self inflicted. They exited the catalog business before Amazon was even in existence. Then they were late in the game at creating an online sales presence, doing so after many other retailers had already done so.

Yes, they've been collecting taxes for a time now. But not for the majority of it's existence. By the time they started charging, CompUSA, Circuit City, Sears etc was on the ropes. Sears made mistakes, but the TAX situation is what is killing them. Let's also not ignore the B&H example I mentioned. This is ongoing and continuing.

No, for over half its existence Amazon has been collecting taxes. B&H is not a valid comparison, they are essentially located in a couple states, NY & NJ. As for being on the ropes, when Sears was acquired by Kmart in 2004 for $11 billion, Amazon's gross sales was about $8 billion. The only reason they were on the ropes was competition by another B&M company - Walmart and their own management failures. Quite frankly the sales tax not being collected wasn't that much of a factor in their loss of sales.

By the way, your math skills need a lot of improvement. The vast majority of Amazon's sales have had sales tax collected, both in terms of time and especially in terms of total sales over that time. Basically in the last 5-6 years Amazon has sold more than it did in the entire time before that since making its first sale about 23 years ago.

Right from it's wiki.

"Amazon.com originally collected sales tax only from five states as of 2011" You did a whole lot of unnecessary typing as if this is some sort of math test.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: dk62
Date: December 28, 2018 04:46PM
Quote
vision63
Quote
Will Collier
Quote
Ombligo
Sears could have been what Amazon became..

Instead it blew it, and ruined iconic names like Kenmore, Diehard, and Craftsman along the way. Those used to be respected brands backed by a great warranty - now they are last choice regardless of who is selling them (I'm looking at you Lowes - you should have stuck with Kobalt or made a naming deal with a comparable manufacturer like Porter Cable)

Absolutely. They already had the distribution infrastructure in place, all they needed to do was commit to e-sales. Instead they doubled down on protecting B&M, and the rest is history.

Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

I just bought a lot of equipment from B and H which I would have bought locally were it not for the $250 in taxes I would have been forced to pay. How is a local camera store supposed to compete with that? Once Amazon had the heft to offer free shipping on orders over $25 and eventually Prime, it was over for Sears, K-Mart etc which had already been damaged by Wal-Mart.

That's $250 that your state can pursue you for if not reported and paid as use tax. People honestly paying taxes they actually owe would make this argument moot.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: vision63
Date: December 28, 2018 05:11PM
Quote
dk62
Quote
vision63
Quote
Will Collier
Quote
Ombligo
Sears could have been what Amazon became..

Instead it blew it, and ruined iconic names like Kenmore, Diehard, and Craftsman along the way. Those used to be respected brands backed by a great warranty - now they are last choice regardless of who is selling them (I'm looking at you Lowes - you should have stuck with Kobalt or made a naming deal with a comparable manufacturer like Porter Cable)

Absolutely. They already had the distribution infrastructure in place, all they needed to do was commit to e-sales. Instead they doubled down on protecting B&M, and the rest is history.

Sears would have had to collect taxes on everything they sold wheras Amazon spent 20 years not having to do so while destroying Brick and Mortar. How do you compete against that?

I just bought a lot of equipment from B and H which I would have bought locally were it not for the $250 in taxes I would have been forced to pay. How is a local camera store supposed to compete with that? Once Amazon had the heft to offer free shipping on orders over $25 and eventually Prime, it was over for Sears, K-Mart etc which had already been damaged by Wal-Mart.

That's $250 that your state can pursue you for if not reported and paid as use tax. People honestly paying taxes they actually owe would make this argument moot.

It's way easier for them to collect it, like Apple has all along. People are inclined to save their money and do not want to pay excessive taxes. I understand why. Taxes are something you're not going to escape. They could make sales taxes 90% if they wanted to. I pay tolls on bridges that were supposed to be free by now and on some roads were free but they've since decided to start charging for. I don't see how that's fair either. To avoid that would be just as dishonest. Amazon only collects taxes now because they were basically forced to.

On the other hand, I do admire Jeff Bezos. His persistence, ingenuity and focus is on point.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/28/2018 05:14PM by vision63.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: forever seared in your brain?!.....last chance for Sears may be approaching.....
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: December 28, 2018 11:56PM
Amazon has only collected state tax in Massachusetts since 2013, and it was a big deal to start paying tax, although I was all for it. I'm not entirely certain that was the overriding factor in Sears' spiral, but there was a huge advantage (and still is) to those online retailers who still skirt this law in 2018.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login

Online Users

Guests: 292
Record Number of Users: 52 on November 20, 2014
Record Number of Guests: 2330 on October 25, 2018