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Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 01:07PM
Mitt Romney released his 2010 returns, but a key document is missing. It's called the FBAR - Foreign Bank and Financial Accounts.

Highly unlikely that he didn't file it, because not doing so would result in hefty fines. But it was withheld from the public release.

Why? What is Romney's Swiss account for?

"For individuals seeking to game the U.S. tax code, Swiss bank accounts are only useful when used illegally. Swiss accounts are prized by global elites for their extreme levels of secrecy. That secrecy has allowed thousands of American taxpayers to stash income from offshore companies in a Swiss account, shielding it from the IRS.

Romney, however, disclosed his Swiss bank account to the IRS in 2010, meaning that at least for 2010, the account was of no use to avoid paying taxes."

[www.huffingtonpost.com]
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 01:47PM
OK, I'm a finance nerd. But this is the clearest indication so far that Mitt Romney may well be hiding recent criminal behavior in his undisclosed tax returns.


"The IRS mounted a series of three special programs, the first in 2009, as a high-profile crackdown unfolded for evaders who rely on Swiss and other offshore accounts. UBS AG (UBS), HSBC Holding PLC (HBC), Credit Suisse Group (CS) and other banks were involved.

As the crackdown continued, thousands came forward to report accounts at Swiss banking giant UBS AG (UBS) under an IRS program that offered special amnesty. Penalties were capped for taxpayers who confessed to accounts.

When the IRS announced the latest program in January, it said it has collected more than $4.4 billion so far from the two previous efforts."

[financialadviserblog.dowjones.com]
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: swampy
Date: July 18, 2012 02:06PM
What are Debbie Wasserman Shultz, Valerie Jarrett, Nancy Pelosi's foreign investments all about?

I think Romney should demand that Holder / Obama release the Fast and Furious Documents in exchange for his FBAR.





If you don't stand for something, you'll probably fall for anything.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: August West
Date: July 18, 2012 02:08PM
Quote

What are Debbie Wasserman Shultz, Valerie Jarrett, Nancy Pelosi's foreign investments all about?

Quick, look over there, it's a squirrel !

Quote

I think Romney should demand that Holder / Obama release the Fast and Furious Documents in exchange for his FBAR.

More nonsensical ranting. Apple, meet orange.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Avenger
Date: July 18, 2012 02:20PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
OK, I'm a finance nerd.

You are? You threw in the towel after a few short exchanges with me a few lines down.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Avenger
Date: July 18, 2012 02:21PM
Quote
August West


Quick, look over there, it's a squirrel tax returns !
.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 02:24PM
Quote
Avenger
Quote
Lemon Drop
OK, I'm a finance nerd.

You are? You threw in the towel after a few short exchanges with me a few lines down.


Any comments about Swiss Mitt?
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 02:30PM
Quote
swampy
What are Debbie Wasserman Shultz, Valerie Jarrett, Nancy Pelosi's foreign investments all about?

.

Can you provide a link to tax forms or disclosures belonging to any of those individuals which would suggest they participated in the IRS amnesty program for people illegally using Swiss accounts to shield income from the IRS? Or suggesting that they have illegal foreign accounts of any type? Or that they may have hidden money overseas to avoid paying taxes? Anything?

The issue here is not "foreign investments." It's using secretive Swiss accounts to hide money from the IRS. Mitt's partially disclosed 2010 suggests that he may have done just that, then participated in the amnesty program of 2009. That would certainly explain why he doesn't want his '09 returns released.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Avenger
Date: July 18, 2012 02:35PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
Avenger
Quote
Lemon Drop
OK, I'm a finance nerd.

You are? You threw in the towel after a few short exchanges with me a few lines down.


Any comments about Swiss Mitt?

You know why everybody is scratching their heads? Because however they look at it, there is no way for Romney to have cheated by having a Swiss bank account. That is the "mystery".
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 02:43PM
Quote
Avenger
You know why everybody is scratching their heads? Because however they look at it, there is no way for Romney to have cheated by having a Swiss bank account. That is the "mystery".


You could only come to taht conclusion if you didn't read the article.
In which case, why comment?
Yes, there is very much a way for him to have cheated.

Why does he have this account? There is no financial benefit in terms of investment, and no LEGAL benefit in terms of taxes.

The benefit is secrecy. And illegal tax avoidance.
Until and unless Romney releases his FULL 2010 return, and his returns for at least 2003-2009, there is no way to know if he participated in the IRS amnesty program for crooks.
But it sure looks as though he may have.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: swampy
Date: July 18, 2012 02:44PM
Only the smart rich people have Swiss Bank accounts. Obama doesn't.





If you don't stand for something, you'll probably fall for anything.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 02:46PM
"I am not a crook."

Mitt, it's not too early to start using that.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 02:54PM
"WASHINGTON -- Mitt Romney has been determined to resist releasing his tax returns at least since his bid for Massachusetts governor in 2002 and has been confident that he will never be forced to do so, several current and former Bain executives tell The Huffington Post. Had he thought otherwise, say the sources based on their longtime understanding of Romney, he never would have gone forward with his run for president."


Might still be time for that brokered convention Sarah Palin wants.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: swampy
Date: July 18, 2012 03:31PM
I don't think there is anything in the Constitution calling for a candidate to release tax returns. It is usually done more as a courtesy than anything.

Why are you folks so upset? He realeased his 2010 taxes earlier and said he would release more information later. Who is Huffington to demand that he do so right now? Was there some kind of deadline?

Manufactured crisis.





If you don't stand for something, you'll probably fall for anything.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: August West
Date: July 18, 2012 03:36PM
I agree swampy, there is not a constitutional requirement and it is a courtesy. If Romney chooses to be discourteous towards the electorate, well, let the chips fall where they may. As a voter, I expect him to disclose, and I think many others do also. If I recall, the conservative National Review editorialized that Romney needs to disclose the tax forms.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: mick e
Date: July 18, 2012 03:40PM
But swampy - you are so interested in dissecting the minutia of Obama's life - why are you not so inspred by Mitt Romney?




Unpaid Social Liaison
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: $tevie
Date: July 18, 2012 03:43PM
Quote
mick e
But swampy - you are so interested in dissecting the minutia of Obama's life - why are you not so inspred by Mitt Romney?

Honest to God, that is the truth. People expect Obama to tell them every teeny detail of his life -- but ask Romney to simply do this one pretty common thing and OH MY GOD IT'S SO WRONG!



"Stop thinking about art works as objects, and start thinking about them as triggers for experiences." ~ Brian Eno
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 03:49PM
Quote
swampy
It is usually done more as a courtesy than anything.

.

Absolutely not. We have strict laws requiring that candidates disclose information about their finances. Those disclosures sometimes raise questions about the ethics or legality of the person's activities. In the interest of being above reproach, candidates also release their tax returns. For the past 40 years, nearly every person running for President has released his returns.
No previous candidate for President in the US had a Swiss bank account.

Refusing to further answer those questions leaves the candidate open to suspicion, something to which his party would object. GOP primary voters took a huge risk on this guy, even though the potentially explosive problems were pointed out by his opponents.
You chose him, he's all yours.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: michaelb
Date: July 18, 2012 04:22PM
Of all the feigned controversies over the years, criminal tax evasion certainly seems relevant and important to the question of a candidate's fitness. That has be very unlikely here, but at the same time, it seems hard to see these questions going away, or the election occurring without full disclosure.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: (vikm)
Date: July 18, 2012 04:22PM
Quote
swampy
Why are you folks so upset?

Better question is, why isn't everyone upset? People are so fixated on our team vs. their team, win at all costs mentality, that common sense is completely ignored. If this was the other way around, Republicans would be frothing (see: birth certificate). Anyone not wanting to know what's up with the returns is an idiot regardless of party affiliation (if any).
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: swampy
Date: July 18, 2012 04:37PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
swampy
It is usually done more as a courtesy than anything.

.

Absolutely not. We have strict laws requiring that candidates disclose information about their finances. Those disclosures sometimes raise questions about the ethics or legality of the person's activities. In the interest of being above reproach, candidates also release their tax returns. For the past 40 years, nearly every person running for President has released his returns.

Financial disclosures, yes, but tax form is a different thing. Please point me to the federal law that says a presidental candidate must release a tax return. States may require one to be on the ballot, but I don't recall a federal law.


No previous candidate for President in the US had a Swiss bank account.

So what? Having a Swiss bank account is NOT a crime. You do know that Romney's assets have long been in a blind trust and he doesn't control where the money goes.

Refusing to further answer those questions leaves the candidate open to suspicion, something to which his party would object. GOP primary voters took a huge risk on this guy, even though the potentially explosive problems were pointed out by his opponents.
You chose him, he's all yours.

Hey, we all know Romney is super rich. So it looks suspicious, so does the fact that Obama's never released school records or Selective Service records and his passport /visa records have been sealed. What's Obama hiding?





If you don't stand for something, you'll probably fall for anything.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2012 04:39PM by swampy.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: swampy
Date: July 18, 2012 04:42PM
Quote
michaelb
Of all the feigned controversies over the years, criminal tax evasion certainly seems relevant and important to the question of a candidate's fitness. That has be very unlikely here, but at the same time, it seems hard to see these questions going away, or the election occurring without full disclosure.

Romney hasn't complied with the oppositions demands or timeline ergo the uproar. He will release the information in his own good time and then the Dems will pour over it and pick it apart and find fault whether it's there to be found or not. Why don't you wait for the reveal before you condem him? Oh, I forgot, it's not the Chicago Way.





If you don't stand for something, you'll probably fall for anything.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: john dough
Date: July 18, 2012 05:39PM
Quote
mick e
But swampy - you are so interested in dissecting the minutia of Obama's life - why are you not so inspred by Mitt Romney?

Answer the damn question, Swampy.

If Romney has nothing to hide, why is he so adamant about not releasing his records? Having someone "pick apart" your finances is a cowards excuse for not doing it. He should have bigger stones than that, unless there are some nasty skeletons in there. If Democrats combing over his records frighten him, he really should not be running for ANY office.

He is running for the office of the President for hecks sake; you blast Obama here daily with all sorts of made up crises, yet there is a LOT of smoke with Romney that you are giving him a pass on - why is that?

Do you think it is ok for a candidate to hide business dealings (on one hand) yet broadcast that they were a good businessperson on the other?



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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: swampy
Date: July 18, 2012 05:55PM
Maybe he's not READY to have his stuff picked apart. All you have are suspitions and allegations. Why don't you wait till the stuff is released?????? He doesn't have to work on the oppositions time table. Patience grasshopper.

I don't have to answer your damn questioin, JD, but I will. I have not been a Romney fan even through the primaries because I can't see how he can defend himself on the healthcare issue. *I* didn't pick him. I'm registered "No Party" and could not vote in the primary election. I would have been happy with anybody else except Romney. I'm going to be voting what I believe is the lesser of two evils.

Now shut your mouth and go away.





If you don't stand for something, you'll probably fall for anything.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: john dough
Date: July 18, 2012 06:16PM
He is running for president and is not ready????? REALLY??? The majority of Americans want to know what is behind Mitt, yet he and his supporters are running away from this as they are obviously hiding something.

Funny that you did not give the same benefit of the doubt to Obama when the birthers (including you) were/are up in arms.

I would bet $35 that you are not registered as "no party". You have been in the far right camp from day one.

No one is shutting up or going away here. If anything, they are exposing Mitt as a liar that he is and watching him, and his supporters, squirm in the process.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2012 07:09PM by john dough.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: mick e
Date: July 18, 2012 06:19PM
But you've had all your Obama questions answered, swampy - aren't you the least bit curious to learn something about Romney?

What if he's the REAL Socialist? What if he secretly shares a sleeping bag with Putin on hunting trips? What if he likes to get doinked by his dressage horse?

THE PUBLIC HAS A RIGHT TO KNOW!!!!!




Unpaid Social Liaison
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Avenger
Date: July 18, 2012 07:56PM
IRS is really failing Obama. I am sure White House has called them a dozen times by now.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: swampy
Date: July 18, 2012 08:39PM
He is running for president and is not ready????? REALLY??? The majority of Americans want to know what is behind Mitt, yet he and his supporters are running away from this as they are obviously hiding something.

Do you have a link to that? Majority? Who says?

Funny that you did not give the same benefit of the doubt to Obama when the birthers (including you) were/are up in arms.

We are still waiting. Patience is a virtue.

I would bet $35 that you are not registered as "no party". You have been in the far right camp from day one.

I have no reason to lie about this. I've said so since day one in this forum. I have even stated my reasons for dropping my former Democratic affiliation. I'll take a gift certificate at Amazon.

No one is shutting up or going away here. If anything, they are exposing Mitt as a liar that he is and watching him, and his supporters, squirm in the process

Squirming? You wish.





If you don't stand for something, you'll probably fall for anything.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2012 08:40PM by swampy.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: john dough
Date: July 18, 2012 10:16PM
Google is your friend:

Surveys Say a Majority of People Want Romney to Release His Tax Returns
[news.yahoo.com]

Even people in his own party want him to come clean:

19 Prominent Republicans Who Want Romney To Release More Tax Returns Right Now
[thinkprogress.org]

Remember, Romney was vetted by McCain's people and after seeing his tax records, they chose, of all people, Sarah Palin.

Only the most racist gullible among us do not believe that he was born in the US. I will not even honor you with the facts as this has been beaten to death. Only the most bigoted are holding out hope of something different.

You have been in the far right fringe from the beginning. This "no party" statement of yours carries about as much weight as your debating skills.

Seeing Mitt flap in the wind is just priceless. Karma is catching up with him, from being a homophobic bully in high school to forcing people to the poorhouse to lying about his finances and business record, things will fall off a cliff come November and I will be none the sadder for him.



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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: RgrF
Date: July 18, 2012 11:16PM
Quote
Avenger
IRS is really failing Obama. I am sure White House has called them a dozen times by now.

That would be both unethical AND illegal. Not that those obstacles would impede someone of your mindset, maybe you can worm your relatives in-waiting into government service to do your future bidding.

Amoral, immoral unethical and illegal are not the same thing in our lexicon, they seem to be in yours.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Avenger
Date: July 18, 2012 11:40PM
IRS does not need Obama's permission to audit Romney. Why haven't they? Put up or shut up.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 18, 2012 11:48PM
How would you know if Romney had been audited by the IRS? Or not?
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Avenger
Date: July 19, 2012 12:00AM
I wouldn't know but I assure you Obama would know and someone at NYT would know the next day.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 19, 2012 12:02AM
Oh, ok.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: RgrF
Date: July 19, 2012 12:08AM
Not knowing has never been a barrier from posting an opinion about something you know nothing of. That will probably continue to be true since you exhibit no sense of remorse for having been so wrong so often and continue to carry on delivering the curent political talking points as given to you by your superiors.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Avenger
Date: July 19, 2012 07:25AM
You should have gone to bed.
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Re: Swiss Mystery
Posted by: Surfrider
Date: July 19, 2012 09:01AM
1979's "Offshore Banking Business" by "The Members", a great English band.

[www.youtube.com]
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