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Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: SteveO
Date: August 09, 2018 07:44AM
[www.cnn.com]

Wow. Just unconscionable. And they're sticking to it being "justified."
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: August 09, 2018 08:23AM
If they were going to an ICE center it would not have happened.
[www.texasobserver.org]
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: samintx
Date: August 09, 2018 08:48AM
What will our human rights prez say about this horrendous act committed by his friends?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2018 03:40PM by samintx.
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: August 09, 2018 09:31AM
ANOTHER REASON DEMS NEED TO WIN BACK THE SENATE!!

We're helping the Saudis and UAE do this. The Saudis successfully courted Trump, leading to the reversal of an Obama policy not to sell weapons systems to the Saudis due to civilian deaths in Yemen.
Yemen is currently the world's worst humanitarian crisis with most of the victims children. We're making it worse.

Donald Trump is quietly escalating America’s role in the Saudi-led war on Yemen, disregarding the huge humanitarian toll and voices in Congress that are trying to rein in the Pentagon’s involvement. Trump administration officials are considering a request from Saudi Arabia and its ally, the United Arab Emirates, for direct US military help to retake Yemen’s main port from Houthi rebels. The Hodeidah port is a major conduit for humanitarian aid in Yemen, and a prolonged battle could be catastrophic for millions of civilians who depend on already limited aid.

With little public attention or debate, the president has already expanded US military assistance to his Saudi and UAE allies – in ways that are prolonging the Yemen war and increasing civilian suffering. Soon after Trump took office in early 2017, his administration reversed a decision by former president Barack Obama to suspend the sale of over $500m in laser-guided bombs and other munitions to the Saudi military, over concerns about civilian deaths in Yemen. The US Senate narrowly approved that sale, in a vote of 53 to 47, almost handing Trump an embarrassing defeat.


[www.theguardian.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2018 09:31AM by Lemon Drop.
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: max
Date: August 09, 2018 10:00AM
Quote
Lemon Drop
ANOTHER REASON DEMS NEED TO WIN BACK THE SENATE!!

We're helping the Saudis and UAE do this. The Saudis successfully courted Trump, leading to the reversal of an Obama policy not to sell weapons systems to the Saudis due to civilian deaths in Yemen.

Absolutely, Trump weapon sales are a total turnaround from Obama policies....
Quote

The State Department announced the first arms sales of the Trump administration Monday, saying it approved sending various munitions and equipment to four countries, including Saudi Arabia. Approval of the transfers has to be finalized by Congress. The $1.85 billion in sales is a fraction of the $40 billion in transfers the Obama administration agreed to as recently as 2015, but the decision signals continuity in foreign arms sales under President Trump.
[www.washingtonpost.com]

Talk about warmongering as the primary criteria for your politics.
Your sole reason to elect Democrats is more of this. ...
Quote

Obama’s Administration Sold More Weapons Than Any Other Since World War II
Many were sold to the Middle East, especially Saudi Arabia.

President Barack Obama, who won the Nobel Peace Prize in 2009, will leave office in a few weeks with the dubious honor of having sold more weapons than any other American president since World War II
[motherboard.vice.com]

The irony of your hypocrisy, Lemon, is that the Democrat you supported, was even more bloodthirsty than anybody in the government today, and that includes both Trump and Bolton.
I have no doubt that Trump will continue the trend started by Obama, but every Democrat out there, so far wants even more war, more conflicts.


Except for Bernie....




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"We know that no one ever seizes power with the intention of relinquishing it. Power is not a means, it is an end.
One does not establish a dictatorship in order to safeguard a revolution;
one makes the revolution in order to establish the dictatorship."
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: August 09, 2018 10:42AM
1. Looking at page 17 of the Congressional Research Service report (not the hyperbole in the Vice article linked above) you see that US agreements to sell weapons worldwide DECREASED while Obama was in office. Beginning with 2008 means you are including agreements reached by the Bush admin.
Also - the existence of agreements doesn't mean that the weapons were actually transferred. Saudi Arabia has quite a wish list of weapons but doesn't necessarily have the funds to pay for them.

2. In both 2015 and 2016, the Obama administration was signaling to Riyad through cancelled arms deals that it wanted to see an end to the targeting of civilians in Yemen. This never included a total end to arms sales to SA. But the Trump administration has reversed that with promises to sell the munitions the previous admin was going to withhold (if the Saudis can pay for them) Overall Trump is increasing US worldwide weapons sales over those of the past few years.
[www.ciponline.org]



3. Although US worldwide arms sales overall decreased 10% in 2010, Obama did make a $60 billion deal with SA that was about containing Iran's nuclear weapons program. The size of this deal is an outlier. The Israelis were apparently OK with it because the stuff they buy from us is more sophisticated.
[www.theatlantic.com]
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: max
Date: August 09, 2018 03:40PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
1. Looking at page 17 of the Congressional Research Service report (not the hyperbole in the Vice article linked above) you see that US agreements to sell weapons worldwide DECREASED while Obama was in office.
Nice little strawman diversion, but we're not discussing worldwide sales, were we, Lemon?
You were the one that brought up Obama increased Saudi sales and that part of the article was quoted...

Quote
Lemon Drop
in 2010, Obama did make a $60 billion deal with SA that was about containing Iran's nuclear weapons program. The size of this deal is an outlier. The Israelis were apparently OK with it because the stuff they buy from us is more sophisticated.
Another excuse for Obama military sales to Saudis, another strawman, Isreal being OK with Saudi said sales does not sell your false claim one iota, they are still the largest increase of arm sales of arms to SA, before present.

The inconvenient truth, you are so ardently trying to wiggle out from, Lemon, about Obama arms sales to Saudi Arabia:....
Quote

When Donald Trump is asked to justify his trip to Saudi Arabia, he’ll cite that $110 billion in arms sales.
There are a few interesting things about these sales. The first is that many of these sales were already in the works. The Obama administration spent eight years quietly selling a lot of arms to Saudi Arabia: When President Obama left office, for example, the United States still had $100 billion in the foreign military sales pipeline with Saudi Arabia and, in 2011, had inked what was previously the largest arms sale in U.S. history with the Kingdom—a $29 billion deal to sell F-15s to the Saudis.

Obama-era sales to Saudi Arabia were in keeping with sales to other Gulf states: Both Qatar and the United Arab Emirates bought a tremendous amount of U.S. arms between 2009 and 2017. Qatar bought more U.S. arms than any other state in 2014 and, in the waning days of the Obama administration, announced that it would buy nearly $4 billion in Boeing-made F-15s in addition to $19 billion in commercial aircraft, also from Boeing.

Overall, the Arab Gulf states went on a spending spree during the Obama years, and most of the money was spent on American arms.

So why didn’t you hear a lot about this from Democratic politicians during the 2016 election season?
Why were you silent, Lemon?
[www.theatlantic.com]

The significant part you are so busy trying to obfuscate is the Democratic lack of alternative you claim would make a difference.
Your choice of candidate was not only even a greater warmonger, bur totally bought and paid for with Saudi money...

And no, I am not defending Trump, nor am I condemning Obama for this, I have no position in the matter, just highlighting your flaming hypocrisy, your false narrative, your revisionism, your false outrage...




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"We know that no one ever seizes power with the intention of relinquishing it. Power is not a means, it is an end.
One does not establish a dictatorship in order to safeguard a revolution;
one makes the revolution in order to establish the dictatorship."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2018 03:40PM by max.
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: August 09, 2018 04:26PM
Quote
max
And no, I am not defending Trump, nor am I condemning Obama for this, I have no position in the matter...

ROTFL
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: bfd
Date: August 09, 2018 07:00PM
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: billb
Date: August 09, 2018 11:09PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
1. Looking at page 17 of the Congressional Research Service report

conveniently no link to a myriad of CRS reports


It's no secret Obama became the biggest arms broker since WWII



The Phorum Wall keeps us safe from illegal characters and words
The doorstep to the temple of wisdom is the knowledge of one's own ignorance. -Benjamin Franklin
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: Pam
Date: August 10, 2018 08:38AM
Obama increased sales to allies to replace aging equipment and also to arm allies to avoid putting US boots on the ground.

Yemen is a very tough situation. All of the coalition parties do not have the same long term goals. In general I don't get the feeling that there is enough concern for the civilian population. No matter the goals, bombing a school bus is inexcusable.
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: Acer
Date: August 10, 2018 12:03PM
Remember when the right was championing Obama's arm sales in the middle east during his administration? No, I don't either.
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: Pam
Date: August 10, 2018 12:39PM
Quote
Acer
Remember when the right was championing Obama's arm sales in the middle east during his administration? No, I don't either.

The right was against everything Obama wanted, just because. They have shown their true colors x 100 with Trump.
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: August 10, 2018 01:59PM
Quote
billb
Quote
Lemon Drop
1. Looking at page 17 of the Congressional Research Service report

conveniently no link to a myriad of CRS reports


It's no secret Obama became the biggest arms broker since WWII


It's inside the link provided by max, the Vice article. Glad you're interested bill!

[fas.org]
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: max
Date: August 12, 2018 11:57AM
Quote
max
Quote
Lemon Drop
1. Looking at page 17 of the Congressional Research Service report (not the hyperbole in the Vice article linked above) you see that US agreements to sell weapons worldwide DECREASED while Obama was in office.
Nice little strawman diversion, but we're not discussing worldwide sales, were we, Lemon?
You were the one that brought up Obama increased Saudi sales and that part of the article was quoted...

Quote
Lemon Drop
in 2010, Obama did make a $60 billion deal with SA that was about containing Iran's nuclear weapons program. The size of this deal is an outlier. The Israelis were apparently OK with it because the stuff they buy from us is more sophisticated.
Another excuse for Obama military sales to Saudis, another strawman, Isreal being OK with Saudi said sales does not sell your false claim one iota, they are still the largest increase of arm sales of arms to SA, before present.

The inconvenient truth, you are so ardently trying to wiggle out from, Lemon, about Obama arms sales to Saudi Arabia:....
Quote

When Donald Trump is asked to justify his trip to Saudi Arabia, he’ll cite that $110 billion in arms sales.
There are a few interesting things about these sales. The first is that many of these sales were already in the works. The Obama administration spent eight years quietly selling a lot of arms to Saudi Arabia: When President Obama left office, for example, the United States still had $100 billion in the foreign military sales pipeline with Saudi Arabia and, in 2011, had inked what was previously the largest arms sale in U.S. history with the Kingdom—a $29 billion deal to sell F-15s to the Saudis.

Obama-era sales to Saudi Arabia were in keeping with sales to other Gulf states: Both Qatar and the United Arab Emirates bought a tremendous amount of U.S. arms between 2009 and 2017. Qatar bought more U.S. arms than any other state in 2014 and, in the waning days of the Obama administration, announced that it would buy nearly $4 billion in Boeing-made F-15s in addition to $19 billion in commercial aircraft, also from Boeing.

Overall, the Arab Gulf states went on a spending spree during the Obama years, and most of the money was spent on American arms.

So why didn’t you hear a lot about this from Democratic politicians during the 2016 election season?
Why were you silent, Lemon?
[www.theatlantic.com]

The significant part you are so busy trying to obfuscate is the Democratic lack of alternative you claim would make a difference.
Your choice of candidate was not only even a greater warmonger, bur totally bought and paid for with Saudi money...

And no, I am not defending Trump, nor am I condemning Obama for this, I have no position in the matter, just highlighting your flaming hypocrisy, your false narrative, your revisionism, your false outrage...

Quote
DeusxMac
I am a troll and although I cannot argue your point, but I highly resent that you can and find highly inconvenient.

Quote
bfd
Me too.
Me too.

Somehow I am not surprised, that neither one of the two trolls can actually argue a subject....


The question still remains, Lemon, why were you silent then,
[www.theatlantic.com]

...and your personal responsibility for the election of the present regime you are blaming for the very same behavior of the one you supported.....
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: August 12, 2018 12:35PM
Quote
max

Quote
DeusxMac
I am a troll and although I cannot argue your point, but I highly resent that you can and find highly inconvenient.

Quote
bfd
Me too.
Me too.

And yet again max constructs phony quotes of others, demonstrating his flagrant mendaciousness.
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Re: Saudi-Led Coalition Bombs School Bus Full of Kids
Posted by: max
Date: August 12, 2018 01:29PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
max

Quote
DeusxMac
I am a troll and although I cannot argue your point, but I highly resent that you can and find highly inconvenient.

Quote
bfd
Me too.
Me too.

And yet again max shows us up, demonstrating his flagrant ability to illustrate us for what we truly are.

Besides your flaming max obsession, you still have not touched the subject under discussion, have you, DeusxMac?.....




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"We know that no one ever seizes power with the intention of relinquishing it. Power is not a means, it is an end.
One does not establish a dictatorship in order to safeguard a revolution;
one makes the revolution in order to establish the dictatorship."
Options:  Reply • Quote
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