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“Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: $tevie
Date: February 04, 2019 03:03PM
Quote

“Does anybody think it’s any coincidence that on the eve of potentially my being elevated that that’s when this uncorroborated smear comes out? Does anybody believe that’s a coincidence? I don’t think anybody believes that’s a coincidence.”

“This is not the first time this was brought up. … It’s uncorroborated because it’s not true, so it goes away for a year and it crops up right at this moment.”

Big League Politics, a conservative website that first posted the racist photo from Gov. Ralph Northam’s medical school yearbook page, aired elements of the allegation Sunday night, based on a personal message between Adria Scharf, of Richmond, and a friend who claims Fairfax assaulted her in 2004.
[www.richmond.com]

Quote

Big League Politics was founded by ex-Breitbart staffers who thought the site was too mainstream.
[www.motherjones.com]



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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: February 04, 2019 03:12PM
Yes we were commenting on that earlier, in the thread about Northam below.

The Fairfax story doesn't look like it's going anywhere.

Unfortunately for Northam the bad news about him appears to be true; the yearbook photo isn't doctored. At that point it doesn't really matter who leaked it.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: samintx
Date: February 04, 2019 06:36PM
Haven’t heard that but did hear he has the 200 yr old freedom paper giving his great grandfather his freedom by Lord Fairfax. That is how he got his name. Had this paper in his pocket when sworn in.

Might be great great grandfather..sorry.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: February 04, 2019 06:55PM
Quote
samintx
Haven’t heard that but did hear he has the 200 yr old freedom paper giving his great grandfather his freedom by Lord Fairfax. That is how he got his name. Had this paper in his pocket when sworn in.

Might be great great grandfather..sorry.

"Thomas Fairfax was a follower of Swedenborg. Because of these religious beliefs, he manumitted his slaves (including the great-great-great grandfather of Virginia Lieutenant Governor Justin Fairfax), some of whom he taught a trade and sent to Liberia. This is consistent with the thinking of the American Colonization Society."
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: max
Date: February 04, 2019 06:56PM
This is hilarious.
Democrats reaping the Me Too whirlwind...

Quote

He acknowledged they had a consensual encounter in his hotel room at the 2004 Democratic National Convention in Boston.

“Everything was 100 percent consensual,” he said, later saying, “There was no inappropriate contact whatsoever.”
“The same person called me sometime later and wanted to meet with me, wanted to come visit me. I was still in law school at Columbia Law School. Wanted to come to New York City to meet with me; wanted me to meet her mother. And said that … months later. And years later now, we have a totally fabricated story out of the blue that’s meant to attack me because of where I am in politics.”




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"We know that no one ever seizes power with the intention of relinquishing it. Power is not a means, it is an end.
One does not establish a dictatorship in order to safeguard a revolution;
one makes the revolution in order to establish the dictatorship."
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: February 05, 2019 07:53AM
I can't think of anyone, Democrat or Republican, who has called for the resignation of a public official over a single, isolated, uncorroborated claim of sexual misconduct that has been investigated and found not to be newsworthy by multiple mainstream news organizations.

It would be super weird to interpret the #MeToo movement as encouraging or requiring dire consequences for anyone accused of anything by anyone, no matter whether the evidence. Wouldn't it?



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Lux Interior
Date: February 06, 2019 08:31AM
Quote
rjmacs
It would be super weird to interpret the #MeToo movement as encouraging or requiring dire consequences for anyone accused of anything by anyone, no matter whether the evidence. Wouldn't it?

Yet people do interpret it that way.

Probably the same people that think a marginal tax rate of 70% on >$10MM income is going to take $700 of their $1000 paycheck.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: February 06, 2019 03:28PM
At the White House, he'd get his own challenge coin.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: February 06, 2019 06:04PM
Quote
rjmacs
I can't think of anyone, Democrat or Republican, who has called for the resignation of a public official over a single, isolated, uncorroborated claim of sexual misconduct that has been investigated and found not to be newsworthy by multiple mainstream news organizations.

It would be super weird to interpret the #MeToo movement as encouraging or requiring dire consequences for anyone accused of anything by anyone, no matter whether the evidence. Wouldn't it?

We now have her public statement and there has been some corroboration.

This is what #MeToo is about.

We believe Dr. Vanessa Tyson the same way that we believed Christine Ford. We accept that a woman's word is evidence and without corroboration it's just as credible as a man's denial.

(Except that WaPo has corroborated that they were made aware of this allegation in 2018 and didn't publish the story and Fairfax has acknowledged the sexual encounter so now there's some corroboration for her story.)

The appropriate response is to take the time and effort to establish the facts as best we can and act accordingly under the law.

The state attorney should begin an investigation which may be used to press criminal charges if Justin Fairfax has committed sexual assault.

If the governor steps down before the investigation is complete then we ask Justin Fairfax not to take the oath of office until the investigation is complete. If he takes the oath then the investigation should be handed off to independent council and he's subject to impeachment as well as prison should that be warranted.

One other thing: According to NBC News, Fairfax's first response to his aides when addressing Dr. Vanessa Tyson's statement was to use a vile disapprobation. It was unsuitable for a public servant to use such language and if it proves true (he's disputing the story) then it's appropriate to question his fitness for public office on that basis.







Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2019 06:18PM by Sarcany.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: $tevie
Date: February 06, 2019 07:27PM
Quote
Sarcany
We now have her public statement and there has been some corroboration.

This is what #MeToo is about.

We believe Dr. Vanessa Tyson the same way that we believed Christine Ford. We accept that a woman's word is evidence and without corroboration it's just as credible as a man's denial.

(Except that WaPo has corroborated that they were made aware of this allegation in 2018 and didn't publish the story and Fairfax has acknowledged the sexual encounter so now there's some corroboration for her story.)

The appropriate response is to take the time and effort to establish the facts as best we can and act accordingly under the law.

The state attorney should begin an investigation which may be used to press criminal charges if Justin Fairfax has committed sexual assault.

If the governor steps down before the investigation is complete then we ask Justin Fairfax not to take the oath of office until the investigation is complete. If he takes the oath then the investigation should be handed off to independent council and he's subject to impeachment as well as prison should that be warranted.

One other thing: According to NBC News, Fairfax's first response to his aides when addressing Dr. Vanessa Tyson's statement was to use a vile disapprobation. It was unsuitable for a public servant to use such language and if it proves true (he's disputing the story) then it's appropriate to question his fitness for public office on that basis.
Thank you. I find it incredible that the very people here who have spent the past year or so wanting to crucify anybody accused of anything, right on the spot, have suddenly decided that in this case it's an obvious fraud and we shouldn't pay attention to it.



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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Pam
Date: February 06, 2019 09:31PM
Without being too indelicate, just how is one forced to perform oral when not threatened in some form? If she really didn't want to perform, but did so anyway....maybe her past sexual assaults played a role in her following through?
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: February 07, 2019 10:38AM
There is Pam's point, which is usually unsaid, and it does come just coincidentally when this guy is on the verge of being elevated to governor.

If true, though, this is a helluva lot worse than dressing up in blackface.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Pam
Date: February 07, 2019 11:04AM
Quote
mrbigstuff
There is Pam's point, which is usually unsaid, and it does come just coincidentally when this guy is on the verge of being elevated to governor.

If true, though, this is a helluva lot worse than dressing up in blackface.

My thinking is her passive behavior was her shutting down due to her past assaults. To her this was another assault. To him she was willing. Both can be telling the truth.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: February 07, 2019 11:09AM
Quote
$tevie
Thank you. I find it incredible that the very people here who have spent the past year or so wanting to crucify anybody accused of anything, right on the spot, have suddenly decided that in this case it's an obvious fraud and we shouldn't pay attention to it.

I didn't say anything of the sort.

My comments were made before Dr. Tyson had made a public statement.

I never said, nor did or do I believe, that Dr. Tyson's story was a fraud, nor did I ever suggest that we shouldn't pay attention to it.

Dr. Tyson should have agency in how this proceeds. She should be asked how and whether she wishes to pursue a criminal complaint. Leaders in government and law enforcement should offer her support and protection against the attacks that will come as a result of this public accusation. Her voice, as well as the voices of other survivors of sexual assault, should be central to the conversation about how Virginia moves forward.

Edit: removed, "and contemporaneous accounts of her story were corroborated by others," which is inaccurate.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/07/2019 01:32PM by rjmacs.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Pam
Date: February 07, 2019 12:27PM
Quote
rjmacs
Quote
$tevie
Thank you. I find it incredible that the very people here who have spent the past year or so wanting to crucify anybody accused of anything, right on the spot, have suddenly decided that in this case it's an obvious fraud and we shouldn't pay attention to it.

I didn't say anything of the sort.

My comments were made before Dr. Tyson had made a public statement and contemporaneous accounts of her story were corroborated by others.

I never said, nor did or do I believe, that Dr. Tyson's story was a fraud, nor did I ever suggest that we shouldn't pay attention to it.

Dr. Tyson should have agency in how this proceeds. She should be asked how and whether she wishes to pursue a criminal complaint. Leaders in government and law enforcement should offer her support and protection against the attacks that will come as a result of this public accusation. Her voice, as well as the voices of other survivors of sexual assault, should be central to the conversation about how Virginia moves forward.

Have there been contemporaneous accounts? All I have read is that she didn't start talking until last October.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: $tevie
Date: February 07, 2019 12:30PM
Quote
rjmacs
I can't think of anyone, Democrat or Republican, who has called for the resignation of a public official over a single, isolated, uncorroborated claim of sexual misconduct that has been investigated and found not to be newsworthy by multiple mainstream news organizations.



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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: $tevie
Date: February 07, 2019 12:31PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Yes we were commenting on that earlier, in the thread about Northam below.

The Fairfax story doesn't look like it's going anywhere.

Unfortunately for Northam the bad news about him appears to be true; the yearbook photo isn't doctored. At that point it doesn't really matter who leaked it.



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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: February 07, 2019 01:28PM
Quote
Pam
Have there been contemporaneous accounts? All I have read is that she didn't start talking until last October.

My mistake, Pam. I re-read the accounts I've seen and I don't see that; I misread something. I apologize.

Quote
Pam
Without being too indelicate, just how is one forced to perform oral when not threatened in some form? If she really didn't want to perform, but did so anyway....maybe her past sexual assaults played a role in her following through?

Any kind of coercion constitutes sexual assault. The force with which she reports he controlled her physically left her "utterly shocked and terrified." I don't think a person in shock/being traumatized can be expected to behave according to typical expectations.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Pam
Date: February 07, 2019 02:11PM
Quote
rjmacs
Quote
Pam
Have there been contemporaneous accounts? All I have read is that she didn't start talking until last October.

My mistake, Pam. I re-read the accounts I've seen and I don't see that; I misread something. I apologize.

Quote
Pam
Without being too indelicate, just how is one forced to perform oral when not threatened in some form? If she really didn't want to perform, but did so anyway....maybe her past sexual assaults played a role in her following through?

Any kind of coercion constitutes sexual assault. The force with which she reports he controlled her physically left her "utterly shocked and terrified." I don't think a person in shock/being traumatized can be expected to behave according to typical expectations.

Was it coercion? I read her full statement and her passivity raised red flags. No verbal protests, her hands were free but no clawing at his arm or hand, no grabbing and putting hurt on his junk... He was not in a position of power (career, physical threats) so why did she not verbally or physically fight back? I have many questions for both of them. If she shut down because of past experiences she's not lying, but she's also pushing a narrative that isn't true.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: February 07, 2019 02:26PM
She explicitly says, "I tried to move my head away, but could not because his hand was holding down my neck and he was much stronger than me."

That is an account of physical coercion. She also says she was crying and gagging, which are signs of distress.

People can engage in whatever sort of sexual activity they choose, but without explicit mutual consent and prior discussion, nothing about this description sounds like it could be reasonably mistaken for consensual.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Pam
Date: February 07, 2019 04:39PM
Quote
rjmacs
She explicitly says, "I tried to move my head away, but could not because his hand was holding down my neck and he was much stronger than me."

That is an account of physical coercion. She also says she was crying and gagging, which are signs of distress.

People can engage in whatever sort of sexual activity they choose, but without explicit mutual consent and prior discussion, nothing about this description sounds like it could be reasonably mistaken for consensual.

I agree about consent but disagree that her statement is enough to make a judgement and deem Fairfax guilty. She did not fight back, she said nothing, even when being led to the bed. The gagging, well let's not get into that. The crying, was is out right sobbing, a few teardrops...what? Who does not fight back and why. Those are my questions. This could easily be a previously victimized person victimizing another. Which happens.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: February 07, 2019 04:49PM
Quote
Pam
I agree about consent but disagree that her statement is enough to make a judgement and deem Fairfax guilty. She did not fight back, she said nothing, even when being led to the bed. The gagging, well let's not get into that. The crying, was is out right sobbing, a few teardrops...what? Who does not fight back and why. Those are my questions. This could easily be a previously victimized person victimizing another. Which happens.

To be clear, Pam, I didn't "make a judgment and deem Fairfax guilty." I'm just trying to be clear that what Tyson described is not ambiguous. Any time a person is prevented from leaving a sexual encounter unimpeded (because they are being physically prevented or blocked), sexual coercion is occurring. What she described was being physically prevented from exiting the encounter when she tried to do so.

I don't have any observations on motive, accuracy, or any explanations.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: February 08, 2019 04:03PM
Well, another woman has come forward with a similar allegation, and she did report it contemporaneously to friends, according to the Washington Post.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: February 08, 2019 05:15PM
Quote
$tevie
Quote
Lemon Drop
Yes we were commenting on that earlier, in the thread about Northam below.

The Fairfax story doesn't look like it's going anywhere.

Unfortunately for Northam the bad news about him appears to be true; the yearbook photo isn't doctored. At that point it doesn't really matter who leaked it.

My sincere apologies Stevie for not having a crystal ball and only commenting on the facts that were in front of us at the time.
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Re: “Lt. Gov. Justin Fairfax denies sexual assault allegation”
Posted by: $tevie
Date: February 08, 2019 06:35PM
You probably should have known better than to make declarative statements based on a story that was mere hours old. Those weren't "facts" those were "early reports".



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