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New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Speedy
Date: June 18, 2020 04:43PM
If I’m on the jury, I’d vote that she gets nothing. Masks save lives of other people. Wear one.

[abcnews.go.com]

A New York City mom who believes she was wrongfully arrested for not properly wearing a face mask while on the subway platform, intends to file a $10 million notice of claim against the city for excessive force, her attorney says.

Kaleemah Rozier, 22, said she was on her way home with her 5-year-old son inside the Atlantic Avenue–Barclays Center station in Brooklyn on May 13 when she was approached by several unidentified NYPD officers.

"I just want justice," said Rozier to ABC News on Wednesday in a phone interview.

Police said Rozier was not properly wearing a face mask over her mouth and nose. When she was asked to comply with the orders or get "ejected from the station," Rozier allegedly refused and cursed at the officers, a NYPD spokeswoman said.

Wearing a face mask while in public is a recommendation given by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in order to prevent the spread of the coronavirus, but has been mandatory in New York state, when unable to stay at least six feet from others, since April, including on public transportation.

A bystander began recording the incident as the crowd of officers escorted Rozier and her little boy up the stairs of the subway station.

Police told ABC New York station WABC after the arrest that Rozier threatened to cough on the officers, but authorities did not mention that element of the case in their statement to ABC News on Wednesday. Rozier reportedly told the New York Daily News that she made the threat, but said it was only after police started following her through the station.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: June 18, 2020 04:49PM
This isn't about the mask. It's about the police roughing her up during an arrest. I agree with her that it was excessive.

They were right to tell her she couldn't be in the subway without a mask and to escort her out, but not right to assault her and injure her. The cops really need to keep their f&cking hands off people.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: hal
Date: June 18, 2020 05:19PM
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do? I don't pretend to have the answer...
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Speedy
Date: June 18, 2020 05:57PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
This isn't about the mask. It's about the police roughing her up during an arrest. I agree with her that it was excessive.

They were right to tell her she couldn't be in the subway without a mask and to escort her out, but not right to assault her and injure her. The cops really need to keep their f&cking hands off people.

She threatened to cough on them.

>>

Tangentially related: [www.cidrap.umn.edu]

Face masks allow virus-containing droplets to escape, study finds

In a study with implications for COVID-19 transmission, mild coughing can expel small saliva droplets through and around a face mask and travel as far as 1 meter (3.3 feet), according to a study published yesterday in Physics of Fluids.

Researchers from the University of Nicosia in Cyprus simulated airborne droplet transmission for a person with and without a mask using computer models and found that, while masks may reduce airborne droplet transmission and protect the wearer from other people's saliva droplets, they provide incomplete protection against the many droplets that spread around and away from them.

Mask certification standards define a surgical mask's effectiveness as a constant value and don't take into account fluid flow dynamics, droplet leakage through mask openings, or the effects of repeated coughing, which can saturate the masks and reduce their efficiency, the authors said.

The study showed that 10 cough cycles reduced mask efficiency about 8%, and severe coughing and longer mask-wearing time would reduce it even further.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: RgrF
Date: June 18, 2020 06:01PM
Quote
hal
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do? I don't pretend to have the answer...

It's a public health issue, they can't just give her a ticket a walk away any more than they can ticket a DUI and walk away.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: June 18, 2020 06:13PM
I'm just reading what is on the page:
Because of this terrible event and the assault of this petite young woman by SIX officers, the Mayor of New York banned police from arresting people for not wearing a mask.

"While on the upper level of the station, the encounter quickly escalated as Rozier's son was "pulled away from her" and she was forced to the floor and an officer placed a knee on the back of her neck, according to the notice of claim provided to ABC News and expected to be filed on Thursday morning.

"Do not do this in front of your kid mam," an officer allegedly told Rozier.

Rozier, 22, who claims she was not resisting, said she was "pushed in the back of her head and neck to the ground, had her arm pulled and twisted, had a knee pressed in the back of her neck and forcefully placed in handcuffs" by at least six police officers, the notice of claim read.

According to the notice of claim, some of Rozier's injuries are "to the neck, back, left wrist, right wrist, left hip, left knee."

Police said in their statement that Rozier "waived her arms and struck an officer with her hand. As a result of these actions, she was taken into custody and placed under arrest."

The 2-minute video of Rozier's confrontation with police and subsequent arrest was later posted on social media."

Look, people curse at the police. They give them a hard time. That's what this young black woman did. If you can't keep your cool you can't be a cop.

Boy, they showed her!
They will write her a very big check.

The payouts made due to police brutality alone could probably fund a world class public education program for the city.

This needs to end. Let's end it and stop making excuses for these cops.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Dennis S
Date: June 18, 2020 06:45PM
"The payouts made due to police brutality alone could probably fund a world class public education program for the city."

I don't have a link, but I remember reading that New York City pays out $200-300 million per year for brutality claims.

Edit: Searching for the number showed results all over the map.

[www.google.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/18/2020 06:50PM by Dennis S.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: June 18, 2020 08:40PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Look, people curse at the police. They give them a hard time. That's what this young black woman did. If you can't keep your cool you can't be a cop.

That would be a good rule.



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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: RgrF
Date: June 18, 2020 09:17PM
NYC Transit Police seem to have a worse history of abuse than does the main force, I'm sure Steve G could offer more on this.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: June 18, 2020 09:29PM
Quote
RgrF
NYC Transit Police seem to have a worse history of abuse than does the main force, I'm sure Steve G could offer more on this.

Actually, in all my years of riding the subway, I've never seen the transit cops abuse anyone. The most I've ever seen is them writing a ticket for someone who jumped the turnstile.

On the other hand, I've never seen them do anything nice, either.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: S. Pupp
Date: June 19, 2020 09:56AM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
Lemon Drop
Look, people curse at the police. They give them a hard time. That's what this young black woman did. If you can't keep your cool you can't be a cop.

That would be a good rule.

On the other hand, not cursing or threatening or resisting the police would also be a good rule to follow. Given human nature, to expect respect without giving respect is to expect the improbable.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: June 19, 2020 10:37AM
Quote
S. Pupp
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
Lemon Drop
Look, people curse at the police. They give them a hard time. That's what this young black woman did. If you can't keep your cool you can't be a cop.

That would be a good rule.

On the other hand, not cursing or threatening or resisting the police would also be a good rule to follow. Given human nature, to expect respect without giving respect is to expect the improbable.

Stop. You are justifying a racist policy by suggesting that targeted citizens (particularly Black and brown ones) should comply with it to avoid harm. That is a racist idea and it's wrong.

Empirically, we know that Black and brown people are implicitly perceived as more dangerous and violent than white people by the police. We know that they experience more reported police abuse and brutality than their white counterparts. We have seen, over and over, the entitlement the police display when controlling Black and brown bodies in ways we simply don't see white people treated.

Until and unless that changes, and policy that encourages any force that is not absolutely necessary is a racist policy, because it has a disparate impact on people in racial groups.

The police must fix this problem, with the public's help and accountability measures. This woman should not have been separated from her child and physically abused because she was not wearing a mask. That is a ridiculous response to anyone not wearing a mask, regardless of race.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 19, 2020 11:55AM
It's hard to be certain with the poor quality video, but it looks like the cop who directly confronts her is himself black.

So are his actions "racist", just "cop" violence, or both?

[www.youtube.com]

OT: why is the quality of this video so poor?
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: June 19, 2020 01:44PM
Quote
DeusxMac
It's hard to be certain with the poor quality video, but it looks like the cop who directly confronts her is himself black.

So are his actions "racist", just "cop" violence, or both?

[www.youtube.com]

OT: why is the quality of this video so poor?

Racism can be enacted by anyone who has the power to enact a racist policy or idea. The color of the perpetrator is secondary.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: S. Pupp
Date: June 19, 2020 03:15PM
Quote
rjmacs
Quote
S. Pupp
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
Lemon Drop
Look, people curse at the police. They give them a hard time. That's what this young black woman did. If you can't keep your cool you can't be a cop.

That would be a good rule.

On the other hand, not cursing or threatening or resisting the police would also be a good rule to follow. Given human nature, to expect respect without giving respect is to expect the improbable.

Stop. You are justifying a racist policy by suggesting that targeted citizens (particularly Black and brown ones) should comply with it to avoid harm. That is a racist idea and it's wrong.

Empirically, we know that Black and brown people are implicitly perceived as more dangerous and violent than white people by the police. We know that they experience more reported police abuse and brutality than their white counterparts. We have seen, over and over, the entitlement the police display when controlling Black and brown bodies in ways we simply don't see white people treated.

Until and unless that changes, and policy that encourages any force that is not absolutely necessary is a racist policy, because it has a disparate impact on people in racial groups.

The police must fix this problem, with the public's help and accountability measures. This woman should not have been separated from her child and physically abused because she was not wearing a mask. That is a ridiculous response to anyone not wearing a mask, regardless of race.

I do not deny that there is a problem that needs a systemic fix. My comment, however, is race-neutral; it applies to every human being approached by the police.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: June 19, 2020 03:40PM
People have bad days, and bad weeks and years. You're far more likely to have an encounter with police when you're having a bad day and not feeling your Miss Manners best. Doesn't make it OK to beat you up or kill you as "punishment" for your "disprespect."
(We have deep cultural problems with corporal punishment, of which police brutality is a part. There's a lot to fix).

Again, if someone can't handle getting bad-mouthed, they have no business in police work (or social work, or special ed, or mental health, or many other fields)
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: June 19, 2020 04:29PM
Quote
S. Pupp
I do not deny that there is a problem that needs a systemic fix. My comment, however, is race-neutral; it applies to every human being approached by the police.

Your comment isn't race-neutral, because the policy you're reinforcing is racist.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: S. Pupp
Date: June 19, 2020 04:56PM
Quote
rjmacs
Quote
S. Pupp
I do not deny that there is a problem that needs a systemic fix. My comment, however, is race-neutral; it applies to every human being approached by the police.

Your comment isn't race-neutral, because the policy you're reinforcing is racist.

I am amused at the concept that treating one’s fellow human beings with respect, not cursing at them or threatening them, is a racist policy. It strikes me as an important part of many religions. I’m missing something here, or you’re misunderstanding me.

Edit:
Some background: I am a mixed breed who, in his youth, was targeted by whites and blacks alike, also by security guards and police. I have more than a vague idea of what African Americans go through; I have empathy. My comment is based on my own experiences with security and police, not on a flippant disregard for the victim. I am not in support of a racist policy.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2020 05:18PM by S. Pupp.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: June 19, 2020 05:13PM
Quote
S. Pupp
Quote
rjmacs
Quote
S. Pupp
I do not deny that there is a problem that needs a systemic fix. My comment, however, is race-neutral; it applies to every human being approached by the police.

Your comment isn't race-neutral, because the policy you're reinforcing is racist.

I am amused at the concept that treating one’s fellow human beings with respect, not cursing at them or threatening them, is a racist policy. It strikes me as an important part of many religions. I’m missing something here, or you’re misunderstanding me.

It's not the encouragement to be respectful.

You said, "Given human nature, to expect respect without giving respect is to expect the improbable."

I say police must be held to a higher standard, and should be expected to respond respectfully in all circumstances. It's a job requirement.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: S. Pupp
Date: June 19, 2020 05:39PM
Quote
rjmacs
Quote
S. Pupp
Quote
rjmacs
Quote
S. Pupp
I do not deny that there is a problem that needs a systemic fix. My comment, however, is race-neutral; it applies to every human being approached by the police.

Your comment isn't race-neutral, because the policy you're reinforcing is racist.

I am amused at the concept that treating one’s fellow human beings with respect, not cursing at them or threatening them, is a racist policy. It strikes me as an important part of many religions. I’m missing something here, or you’re misunderstanding me.

It's not the encouragement to be respectful.

You said, "Given human nature, to expect respect without giving respect is to expect the improbable."

I say police must be held to a higher standard, and should be expected to respond respectfully in all circumstances. It's a job requirement.

I understand now what you’re saying.
I don’t know how better to express my view, though. As I said in my edit above, my opinion is based on my experience as a target myself. People are not perfect. Under stress and fear, anyone can crack and become inappropriate, even those in professions in which people are held to a higher standard. “Human nature” does not excuse bad behavior, but it does help to explain it.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: June 19, 2020 05:43PM
Quote
S. Pupp
I am amused at the concept that treating one’s fellow human beings with respect, not cursing at them or threatening them, is a racist policy. It strikes me as an important part of many religions. I’m missing something here, or you’re misunderstanding me.

Lovely. You're giving cops carte blanche while automatically making everyone else their victims, taking away civil liberties without even a trial.

People can cuss. It's from this thing called the First Amendment. You might want to have a look at it some time.

...When a cop picks the black reporter out of a crowd of reporters and arrests him on a bogus charge, I think it's perfectly okay for the reporter to say "WTF, @#$%&?!!"

(Not that he did say that. I'm just saying had he done so, he would have been within his rights.)







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2020 05:50PM by Sarcany.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: S. Pupp
Date: June 19, 2020 06:04PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
S. Pupp
I am amused at the concept that treating one’s fellow human beings with respect, not cursing at them or threatening them, is a racist policy. It strikes me as an important part of many religions. I’m missing something here, or you’re misunderstanding me.

Lovely. You're giving cops carte blanche while automatically making everyone else their victims, taking away civil liberties without even a trial.

People can cuss. It's from this thing called the First Amendment. You might want to have a look at it some time.

...When a cop picks the black reporter out of a crowd of reporters and arrests him on a bogus charge, I think it's perfectly okay for the reporter to say "WTF, @#$%&?!!"

(Not that he did say that. I'm just saying had he done so, he would have been within his rights.)

Are you being serious, or funny? I can’t tell.
If serious, you are massively overreacting.

In the words of Rodney King: Can’t we all just get along?
Oh wait - he was being racist, and giving the cops carte blanche.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2020 06:06PM by S. Pupp.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: June 19, 2020 06:25PM
Quote
S. Pupp
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
S. Pupp
I am amused at the concept that treating one’s fellow human beings with respect, not cursing at them or threatening them, is a racist policy. It strikes me as an important part of many religions. I’m missing something here, or you’re misunderstanding me.

Lovely. You're giving cops carte blanche while automatically making everyone else their victims, taking away civil liberties without even a trial.

People can cuss. It's from this thing called the First Amendment. You might want to have a look at it some time.

...When a cop picks the black reporter out of a crowd of reporters and arrests him on a bogus charge, I think it's perfectly okay for the reporter to say "WTF, @#$%&?!!"

(Not that he did say that. I'm just saying had he done so, he would have been within his rights.)

Are you being serious, or funny? I can’t tell.
If serious, you are massively overreacting.

I think not.

It's the cop's job to protect the rights of the man cussing him, not to harass, arrest, brutalize, or murder that man. Anyone who doesn't get that is in serious need of correction.





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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: S. Pupp
Date: June 19, 2020 06:55PM
Quote
Sarcany
It's the cop's job to protect the rights of the man cussing him, not to harass, arrest, brutalize, or murder that man.

I agree. I’m not arguing against that.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: June 19, 2020 07:42PM
Quote
S. Pupp
Quote
Sarcany
It's the cop's job to protect the rights of the man cussing him, not to harass, arrest, brutalize, or murder that man.

I agree. I’m not arguing against that.

And yet, you proposed that civilians have a duty to "respect" cops, without regard for the actions of the cops.

Politeness is not required by law, and being impolite is a Constitutional right. Respect is something to be earned, not mindlessly granted to anyone with a uniform. When someone's a jerk, the effect is magnified by a uniform and deadly weapons.

When cops do their job, protecting and serving the people of this nation, they earn respect. When they harass and shoot and gas and beat and arrest and murder people, they do not deserve respect. They deserve prison-time.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2020 07:43PM by Sarcany.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 19, 2020 07:46PM
I’d still like to hear some thoughts on hal’s query.

Quote
hal
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do?
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: June 19, 2020 08:00PM
Quote
DeusxMac
I’d still like to hear some thoughts on hal’s query.

Quote
hal
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do?

There is a concept in law called de minimis.

And there is an obligation upon every moral person to disobey an immoral or unconstitutional law.

Further, there is an obligation to disobey an order when it is used unjustly, selectively enforced to further racist or personal agendas.

What does a cop do? Backs off for a moment, de-escalates where posible, and does what is appropriate to minimize harm to the people he's charged with protecting, including the one he just ordered to do something. In many cases, that may mean that he steps back, provides a warning and then permits the offender to peacefully leave the premises.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2020 08:03PM by Sarcany.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: RgrF
Date: June 19, 2020 08:09PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
DeusxMac
I’d still like to hear some thoughts on hal’s query.

Quote
hal
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do?

There is a concept in law called de minimis.

And there is an obligation upon every moral person to disobey an immoral or unconstitutional law.

Further, there is an obligation to disobey an order when it is used unjustly, selectively enforced to further racist or personal agendas.

You mean when anti-maskers (for want of a better term) tell a cop not to trample on their constitutional (fill-in-the reason) rights for not obeying an order that would appear on it's face to be lawful?

Cops are not trained to back off or de-escalate, they should be, but they aren't.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/19/2020 08:09PM by RgrF.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 19, 2020 08:11PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
DeusxMac
I’d still like to hear some thoughts on hal’s query.

Quote
hal
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do?

...he steps back, provides a warning and then permits the offender to peacefully leave the premises.

I think it’s pretty clear hal was asking what the cops do when the “offender” refuses to “leave the premises peacefully”.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: June 19, 2020 08:29PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
DeusxMac
I’d still like to hear some thoughts on hal’s query.

Quote
hal
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do?

...he steps back, provides a warning and then permits the offender to peacefully leave the premises.

I think it’s pretty clear hal was asking what the cops do when the “offender” refuses to “leave the premises peacefully”.

He could ask her why she's not wearing her mask -- nicely. He could offer to leave with her and buy her a cup of coffee. He could impose his body in front of her and tell her that she's welcome to stand where she is, but unfortunately he's under orders and can't let her board a train without her donning a mask.

I'm sure if you thought about it for a few seconds you could come up with a bunch of other things he could do to avoid violence.



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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 19, 2020 10:13PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
DeusxMac
I’d still like to hear some thoughts on hal’s query.

Quote
hal
This is a question that needs answering. When a citizen does not comply with a lawful order - what do the cops do?

...he steps back, provides a warning and then permits the offender to peacefully leave the premises.

I think it’s pretty clear hal was asking what the cops do when the “offender” refuses to “leave the premises peacefully”.

He could ask her why she's not wearing her mask -- nicely. He could offer to leave with her and buy her a cup of coffee. He could impose his body in front of her and tell her that she's welcome to stand where she is, but unfortunately he's under orders and can't let her board a train without her donning a mask.

I'm sure if you thought about it for a few seconds you could come up with a bunch of other things he could do to avoid violence.

I’m tempted to ask how many moons your planet has...

Even with this specific example of officers’ violent overreaction, you’re positing fatuous suggestions that don’t really respond to hal’s legitimate question.

- “Ask her why she's not wearing her mask”; she had it right there around her neck. Have we seen anything that states she was prevented from giving a reason when first confronted by the officers?

- “Buy her a cup of coffee”; they’re on duty, they can’t leave their assigned duties and stations, especially not for every non-mask-wearer they’re going to deal with.

- “She’s welcome to stand where she is”; actually she wasn’t permitted where she was without wearing the mask last month.

- “Can’t let her board a train without her donning a mask”; she wasn’t even supposed to be in the station without one on (see above).
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: June 19, 2020 10:56PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Even with this specific example of officers’ violent overreaction, you’re positing fatuous suggestions that don’t really respond to hal’s legitimate question...

I don't blame you for failing to see it.

We are conditioned to assume that our "peacekeepers" need to be "warriors."

They don't.

BTW: The rule for the NY subway is that you must wear a mask when you can't remain 6 feet apart from others. Lots of riders leave their mask off until they head for a subway car. This was selective-enforcement.



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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: August West
Date: June 19, 2020 10:58PM
You have theory, and you have applied. It's a valuable skill to have the capacity to effectively and successfully marry the two. In many ways, I think this thread represents an inability to recognize that one depends on the other. I believe that the effective middle ground between theory and application is where we find common sense, something that seems rare.



Picasso in his studio after the liberation of Paris, taken by my friend and mentor.

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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: S. Pupp
Date: June 20, 2020 09:04AM
Quote
August West
You have theory, and you have applied. It's a valuable skill to have the capacity to effectively and successfully marry the two. In many ways, I think this thread represents an inability to recognize that one depends on the other. I believe that the effective middle ground between theory and application is where we find common sense, something that seems rare.

Thinking about what you've said, I believe its wisdom applies to very many problems we have in the world today. In many fields (healthcare comes to mind), administrators make decisions based on theories that, in application, just don't work. The failure to come to a middle ground results in mediocrity.
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Re: New York City mom plans $10 million lawsuit against police after arrest for improperly wearing face mask
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: June 20, 2020 01:02PM
Quote
August West
You have theory, and you have applied. It's a valuable skill to have the capacity to effectively and successfully marry the two. In many ways, I think this thread represents an inability to recognize that one depends on the other. I believe that the effective middle ground between theory and application is where we find common sense, something that seems rare.

This is cute, especially in that way that it entirely naturalizes the racist outcomes of 'human nature'.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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