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Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 04, 2020 09:23AM
After decades of resisting calls to change their team name, the Cleveland Indians announced on Friday that they were willing to engage in discussions about whether the name is appropriate in the wake of national calls for social justice and reform.

“We are committed to engaging our community and appropriate stakeholders to determine the best path forward with regard to our team name,” the team said in a statement released Friday night.


(Also our $$$$$ponsors are threatening to leave us)

[www.nytimes.com]


Over to you Braves and Chiefs
Braves also need to ban the tomahawk chop
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: robfilms
Date: July 04, 2020 09:50AM
it is time to leave certain relics behind.

imho, braves, indians, redskins do nothing for the indigenous people and their culture we so ruthlessly debased and destroyed.

it is time to make changes.

stay well.

rob
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Rolando
Date: July 04, 2020 09:55AM
Cleveland Klan?
[www.youtube.com]



San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

"I don’t want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it." - Billy Graham 1981

"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 04, 2020 10:01AM
Yes I agree with rob. These names are deep, hurtful insults. "R..skins" has been the worst but the others are wrong too.

The people of tribal nations are people, not mascots.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2020 10:01AM by Lemon Drop.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Acer
Date: July 04, 2020 10:14AM
Cleveland Clevelands about sums it up.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: hal
Date: July 04, 2020 10:16AM
The NHL, Chicago and other entities have a rather detailed story about why the Chicago Blackhawks is different than the Indians and the Redskins. It'll be interesting to see how well that holds in the near future. I, personally have never bought into the story.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: July 04, 2020 10:38AM
It's way past time.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: July 04, 2020 10:42AM
Cleveland Southeast Asians?
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 04, 2020 10:47AM
"Mt. Rushmore, Redskin mascots and the like are manifestations of the American doctrine that first nations are a conquered people."

Think about it.

Confederate monuments symbolize Black Americans as a conquered and subjugated people too.
That was the theme of Trump's speech yesterday. Protecting that legacy for Whites.

It's all closely related.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: July 04, 2020 10:51AM
Non-BIPOC Americans can be deeply unsettled by the realization that now matter how deep or far you go back in American history, it never gets cleaner or easier or more defensible. It's even more discouraging to learn that in every moment, people were crying out about the injustices being committed. No one was ignorant, just entitled.

We could learn a lot from the Germans about coming to terms with our genocides.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2020 10:53AM by rjmacs.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 04, 2020 10:54AM
Quote
rjmacs
White people can be deeply unsettled by the realization that now matter how deep or far you go back in American history, it never gets cleaner or easier.

We could learn a lot from the Germans about coming to terms with our genocides.

Yes but they haven't got it completely figured out.

the neo-Nazi Reichsburger movement is giving them a lot of trouble lately. these people do not recognize the current German state as legitimate

(If our Prez hasn't re-tweeted them yet I'm sure he will soon...)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2020 10:55AM by Lemon Drop.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: GGD
Date: July 04, 2020 11:05AM
Will the Jeep Cherokee be next in line?
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: July 04, 2020 11:19AM
.....money motivates......these teams are only doing this because their 'sponsors' are 'asking' them to do so......not because of the outcry by people......



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: pdq
Date: July 04, 2020 11:30AM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Braves also need to ban the tomahawk chop

Chiefs fans do that too. Probably Cleveland fans too.

Watching fat white sports fans mimicking Native Americans on the cue of a Hollywood “Indian” music theme has always seemed incredibly embarrassing to this white guy.

Just stop it. Let it go.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: sekker
Date: July 04, 2020 11:41AM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
rjmacs
White people can be deeply unsettled by the realization that now matter how deep or far you go back in American history, it never gets cleaner or easier.

We could learn a lot from the Germans about coming to terms with our genocides.

Yes but they haven't got it completely figured out.

the neo-Nazi Reichsburger movement is giving them a lot of trouble lately. these people do not recognize the current German state as legitimate

(If our Prez hasn't re-tweeted them yet I'm sure he will soon...)

Go to some German museums, they have a LOT of work still to do.

I hope we can move forward this time. But I am not confident, as keeping others down seems to be a human trait.

Japan subjugated entire countries during WWII, and they largely ignore this.

China is subjugating people by force RIGHT NOW.

The future imagined by Star Trek seems further and further away every day.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2020 11:42AM by sekker.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 04, 2020 12:27PM
Quote
hal
The NHL, Chicago and other entities have a rather detailed story about why the Chicago Blackhawks is different than the Indians and the Redskins. It'll be interesting to see how well that holds in the near future. I, personally have never bought into the story.

Overall I think it's time to stop making excuses for these racist names and just change them already.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 04, 2020 12:35PM
Quote
sekker
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
rjmacs
White people can be deeply unsettled by the realization that now matter how deep or far you go back in American history, it never gets cleaner or easier.

We could learn a lot from the Germans about coming to terms with our genocides.

Yes but they haven't got it completely figured out.

the neo-Nazi Reichsburger movement is giving them a lot of trouble lately. these people do not recognize the current German state as legitimate

(If our Prez hasn't re-tweeted them yet I'm sure he will soon...)

Go to some German museums, they have a LOT of work still to do.

I hope we can move forward this time. But I am not confident, as keeping others down seems to be a human trait.

Japan subjugated entire countries during WWII, and they largely ignore this.

China is subjugating people by force RIGHT NOW.

The future imagined by Star Trek seems further and further away every day.

Yes, it's easy to get depressed and discouraged by the rhetoric from the President and his enablers.

Read this today from Dan Rather and liked it; a hopeful message for the 4th.

[twitter.com]
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 04, 2020 12:46PM
...and President Obama from 2017

"the work of Democracy has always been hard. It's always been contentious. Sometimes it's been bloody. For every two steps forward, if often feels like we take one step back. But the long sweep of America has been defined by forward motion, a constant widening of our founding creed to embrace all and not just some."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/04/2020 12:47PM by Lemon Drop.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: bfd
Date: July 04, 2020 01:43PM
Fans won't be happy unless they rename as the Cleveland Wahoos

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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Bill in NC
Date: July 04, 2020 02:31PM
We're Not Detroit!
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: July 04, 2020 03:37PM
Quote
bfd
Fans won't be happy unless they rename as the Cleveland Wahoos


those are some Cleveland Yahoos.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: July 04, 2020 06:58PM
Tossed the logo a couple of years ago.

So let’s talk about why the logo /name ?

Well... on the North Coast, the Indian wars of the 1700’s were very significant. And Indian warriors were respected and feared. As a result a feared warrior was chosen as the avatar of the feared Cleveland baseball team.

So it’s the 21st century. Baseball isn’t war. So removing the name is fine.


Keep in mind that the mascot for the Browns was a tiny Brownie ... on of the fae. The Irish did not complain...
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: Z
Date: July 05, 2020 09:59AM
Cleveland Clinicians! Striking fear into the hearts of all!
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: July 05, 2020 10:04AM
Scott Simon on NPR suggested the “Cleveland Rocks”.
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Re: Next: Cleveland "Indians" will be changing their name
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: July 05, 2020 02:26PM
Quote
cbelt3
Tossed the logo a couple of years ago.

So let’s talk about why the logo /name ?

They removed the racist logo from the stadium, and stopped using it in public-facing materials. However, merchandise with the logo is still sold in the team store, and their web page has a 'some very good people on both sides' feel to it.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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