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Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: September 14, 2020 04:49PM
[twitter.com]

These people are protesting the local school district's mask requirement with some of the more ridiculous stuff I've heard to date.

No information presented by the reporter on why the state wants people to wear masks. Just breathless repetition of the protesters' complaints.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: vision63
Date: September 14, 2020 06:46PM
It's frightening. Fighting over pettiness. Grown people that really should know better.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Speedy
Date: September 14, 2020 07:25PM
“No shoes, no shirt, no service.”

‘George Floyd said he couldn’t breathe and the cops killed him. For those who claim they can’t breathe while wearing a mask: Maybe the cops were on to something.’



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/2020 07:48PM by Speedy.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: p8712
Date: September 14, 2020 07:58PM
The child being used to parrot lies about Covid and the flu is the part that really hurt. The old lady at the end had to be a troll, right?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/2020 07:58PM by p8712.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: davester
Date: September 14, 2020 08:03PM
Why are you making this a racial post? Just because St George is primarily populated by white people does not mean that the actions of a few idiots in that city reflects on their race.



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: btfc
Date: September 14, 2020 08:31PM
Not far from Bundyland.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Speedy
Date: September 14, 2020 08:36PM
Quote
davester
Why are you making this a racial post? Just because St George is primarily populated by white people does not mean that the actions of a few idiots in that city reflects on their race.

I often share LD’s embarrassment about being white.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: davester
Date: September 14, 2020 09:10PM
When it comes to stupidity and acting out there's plenty to go around, no matter what color your skin is. This I'm ashamed to be white BS is no different from I'm ashamed to be black, latin, asian, whatever.



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: wurm
Date: September 14, 2020 09:33PM
Yeah, we need a wall. Actually, we need a bunch of them...around certain counties.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: September 15, 2020 10:01AM
Quote
davester
Why are you making this a racial post? Just because St George is primarily populated by white people does not mean that the actions of a few idiots in that city reflects on their race.

Things I haven't seen on the variety of media I survey:

Tons of videos of BIPOC (Black, Indigenous, and People of Color) flouting public mask rules, belligerently interacting with store staff and customers, and marching in the streets to "End The Tyranny" of mandatory face coverings in public.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: btfc
Date: September 15, 2020 12:38PM
What a crock of B.S. Many incidents of attacks on business personnel or customers involved BIPOC. Several have been posted and discussed here. Of course that doesn’t fit your preconceptions, so it never happened, right?
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: September 15, 2020 12:50PM
Quote
btfc
What a crock of B.S. Many incidents of attacks on business personnel or customers involved BIPOC. Several have been posted and discussed here. Of course that doesn’t fit your preconceptions, so it never happened, right?

Point me to the protests.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: btfc
Date: September 15, 2020 01:07PM
Because the attacks and shootings don’t count?

Maybe you should amend the above post?
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: September 15, 2020 02:31PM
Quote
btfc
Because the attacks and shootings don’t count?

Maybe you should amend the above post?

Are you done editing me and ready to provide evidence? Harping on details to avoid the issue is a typical reaction defensive of the status quo.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: September 16, 2020 10:02AM
Hello!

These organized political rallies themed around refusal to wear masks, such as the one referenced in the OP, are a sociological phenomenon occurring among white Trump supporters since social distancing measures were put in place last spring. In the rally videos I've seen, I only see white people. They have taken place all around the country, including ironically in states like South Carolina that don't even have statewide mask mandates. The protesters claim these mandates, including rules imposed by their kids' schools and by local businesses, violate their rights.

I have not observed this type of rally in black or brown communities, but if there are examples that would be interesting to see.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: kj
Date: September 16, 2020 02:45PM
You shouldn't have to excuse people's bad behavior just because you are the same color they are. I hear racists hold all black people responsible for black crime, which is ridiculous for the same reason it's ridiculous to be embarrassed by the behavior of other white people. As if you're responsible for the behavior of all white people just because you're white.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: September 16, 2020 02:57PM
Quote
kj
You shouldn't have to excuse people's bad behavior just because you are the same color they are.

Hi kj.

Can you say where you think this was suggested in the thread? I don't think feeling embarrassed to share a visible identity with a badly behaving group of people implies a felt need to excuse them....

Quote
kj
I hear racists hold all black people responsible for black crime, which is ridiculous for the same reason it's ridiculous to be embarrassed by the behavior of other white people. As if you're responsible for the behavior of all white people just because you're white.

Indeed, holding all Black people responsible for the actions of a few is ridiculous. I doubt you'd find anyone here in disagreement.

I think you might be mistaking a sense of discomfort with affiliation for one of shared responsibility. I know that you, kj, would never hold LD or anyone else responsible for the actions of others. But sometimes, some of us feel a bit cringe-y when we see folks who look like us acting like fools...even when we clearly don't share their values.

It's not a right or wrong issue, I don't think.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: kj
Date: September 16, 2020 08:05PM
I did some heavy editing, and excuse is not the word that was supposed to be there.

I think people may be feeling responsibility because of their "affiliation", fwiw. No reason to bring race into it though. It's irrelevant, and I'm not sure what purpose it serves.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: September 16, 2020 08:48PM
Quote
kj
I did some heavy editing, and excuse is not the word that was supposed to be there.

I think people may be feeling responsibility because of their "affiliation", fwiw. No reason to bring race into it though. It's irrelevant, and I'm not sure what purpose it serves.


Race is very relevant here. The politics of coronavirus are racial. Public health in the United States has become racialized, and that hurts all of us. It's one of the main reasons we're having the worst pandemic experience of any Western nation.

Why do so many whites in the US feel so strongly that they should not have to follow basic public health guidelines, even when those have become ordinances and laws? And feel the need to flout the rules via political protests? And not just in the US, this phenomenon is also seen in Canada, Australia and the UK, also among white people.

When I said I was embarrassed about the behavior of some white people, I made a flippant comment about something that is actually deadly serious. No I don't feel responsible for their behavior in any way, but I'm sure as heck mortified by it.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Speedy
Date: September 16, 2020 09:17PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
In the rally videos I've seen, I only see white people.

Yep, things haven’t been the same at the rallies since ole Herman got the virus.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: September 16, 2020 09:19PM
Quote
Speedy
Quote
Lemon Drop
In the rally videos I've seen, I only see white people.

Yep, things haven’t been the same at the rallies since ole Herman got the virus.

Poor Herman. Still wondering who the Nevada rally is going to kill.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: kj
Date: September 16, 2020 10:20PM
Of course there are racial issues, but are you upset with these people because they are white? Probably not, which means you could have left race out of the post and said the same thing. No reason to be embarrassed they are white like you.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: September 17, 2020 07:29AM
Quote
kj
Of course there are racial issues, but are you upset with these people because they are white? Probably not, which means you could have left race out of the post and said the same thing. No reason to be embarrassed they are white like you.



This isn't personal to me. But the behavior I'm talking about in the OP is racial and pretending otherwise is harmful to our society. We have to stop pretending that white supremacy is not driving one the biggest problems we have in American society right now. It matters a lot WHO is doing these things, and why.
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Re: Sometimes it's embarrassing to be a white person: anti-maskers in St. George, UT
Posted by: kj
Date: September 17, 2020 01:37PM
Of course racism is bad. Ok, you win, I'm embarrassed for my white brethren and their racist behavior. Wait a minute. They don't want to wear masks? That's not racist behavior. WTF? No, I don't agree the behavior in the OP is racially motivated. That's ridiculous. Stupid behavior, but it's not racially motivated. Correlation is not causation. Man, what a mess.
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