Speaking of cars, Diesel vs gas engine

[M A V I C]

davester wrote:
[quote=Racer X]
lower maintanence frequency and engine longevity are why diesels are hugely popular overseas.

I'm not sure where you're talking about, but in Europe that was only true in the olden days. The main reason europeans buy diesels is that fuel prices are almost twice as high as here (or more in some cases). Maintenance costs are essentially the same as modern gas cars, and most people don't keep their gas cars to the point where engine longevity is an issue any more (i.e. well north of 100k miles on modern gas cars).
It's still true. I've asked several shops about it. The TDIs last a lot longer and require less maintenance.

[Speedy]

davester wrote:
What Gareth said is correct. Diesel and electric torque characteristics are not complementary whereas gas and electric are.

Big gensets are all Diesels. The users, like hospitals, are not concerned about economy as much as reliability. Diesel hybrids exist in Europe and get better mileage (for equal sized vehicles) than any gas hybrid. The high torque is ideally suited to turn a generator. Americans seem to not like Diesels until they drive one.

[Gareth]

Speedy wrote:
[quote=davester]
What Gareth said is correct. Diesel and electric torque characteristics are not complementary whereas gas and electric are.

Big gensets are all Diesels. The users, like hospitals, are not concerned about economy as much as reliability. Diesel hybrids exist in Europe and get better mileage (for equal sized vehicles) than any gas hybrid. The high torque is ideally suited to turn a generator. Americans seem to not like Diesels until they drive one.
A diesel genset is a different application than a hybrid car. In that case, you're using a diesel engine to produce electricity. If you used that application on a car, you would use a diesel engine to RUN the electric motor. This is different than what we consider a hybrid car (i.e. Prius which has two separate drivetrains, either the electric motor or the gas engine can turn the wheels). That application is more like a Chevy Volt, a range extending electric/plug-in car, in which the electric motor always turns the wheels and the engine powers the electric motor if need be.

Personally, I think carrying around two drivetrains (ala Prius) is rather stupid, and think that in the case of the Chevy Volt (a range extending electric/plug-in), a diesel engine might make sense.

What diesel hybrids are in Europe? Are they like the Prius (two drivetrains?) or Volt (only electric drivetrain)?

[Speedy]

The Diesel hybrid once discussed on the forum was a Peugeot. There are others.

[ztirffritz]

A diesel Volt would be ideal.

[davester]

I very much doubt that they'll go with a diesel volt. The cost of the car is already too high and going with a diesel engine would surely drive the cost up for minimal advantage (since the target audience is those who utilize the car primarily in electric mode).

[N-OS X-tasy!]

JPK wrote:
Most of the new diesels need "deer piss" as a consumable that gets injected to keep emissions lower. Although it is not actually deer piss, the synthetic urea can be a pricey additive that most people don't consider.

The new Mazda6 diesel does not, one of the revolutionary aspects of the new engine. It also utilizes an all-aluminum block for significant weight (and thus fuel) savings.

[C(-)ris]

M A V I C wrote:
[quote=davester]
[quote=Racer X]
lower maintanence frequency and engine longevity are why diesels are hugely popular overseas.

I'm not sure where you're talking about, but in Europe that was only true in the olden days. The main reason europeans buy diesels is that fuel prices are almost twice as high as here (or more in some cases). Maintenance costs are essentially the same as modern gas cars, and most people don't keep their gas cars to the point where engine longevity is an issue any more (i.e. well north of 100k miles on modern gas cars).
It's still true. I've asked several shops about it. The TDIs last a lot longer and require less maintenance.
It is true, for VW anyway. A Jetta TDI is good for 300 to 350k miles before it needs a full blown rebuild. It is common to see them running around with that many miles on them. You don't see any gas Jetta's with 300k on the stock engine. A 1.8T or a 2.0 NA is good for around 200 to 250k. You easily get another 100k miles out of the Diesel.

[eustacetilley]

Speedy wrote:
The Diesel hybrid once discussed on the forum was a Peugeot. There are others.

The volume production Peugeot 508, 3008 and Citroen DS5 Hybrid4 series. There is also the rather scarce MB E300 Bluetec Hybrid, and the Volvo V60 D6 Plug-In Hybrid. There was one collaboration that might actually have been sold here, but it's a real Saab story.

Eustace

[lost in space]

If you plan on owning it 6 years, at 12K miles per that's only 72K miles. Seems like that would make long-term reliability, timing belt, etc. moot points, no?