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OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: spacescape
Date: June 27, 2006 02:15PM
Well, my Lease is up on my Explorer August 8th and I'm trying to figure out WHAT to replace it with. My wife has a 2003 Jetta w/ a 1.8T so we do have something kind of fun. I was all set to look at Pontiac G6's (4 door), Pontiac Grand Prix, Ford Fusion, Jeep Grand Cherokee or a GMC Torrent. Then this past weekend we've decided to look at a few SUV's w/ 3rd row seating based on the fact over the last 14 months (since we've become parents), we are finding ourselves needing to take a second car because five seats just aren't enough. We can live without 6+ seats but it might be nice to have.

Other than the Ford Explorer, Chrysler Pacifica and the Jeep Commodore anything other than a mini van that has 6+ seats that gets decent gas millage? Does anyone know if the sport wagons come w/ 6+ seats? It appears that the Passat and Audi Wagons only has 5 seats. Same goes for the Volvo's.

"IF" I stick to something more fuel efficient such as the G6, Fusion or the Grand Prix anyone here have one of these? If so, do you have kids? How large is the trunk.

I'm looking for something practical like the Explorer but w/ MUCH better gas millage.

Bill
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: tahoedrew
Date: June 27, 2006 02:24PM
If you're looking for something with good gas mileage why are you looking at cars out of Detroit? American cars are gas hogs (and generally worse in every category than Toyota's, Honda's or otherwise)!

Are you really tied to a US car? If so, you can buy Accords, Camry's, Legacy's, and a gazillion other "foreign" cars which are made in the US. I had a girlfriend who liked Chevy's, partly due to their "domestic quality," she claimed. Too bad her Chevy Equinox was made in CANADA and my Subaru Legacy was made in INDIANA!

HA!


~A
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: SteveJobs
Date: June 27, 2006 02:26PM
Get a minivan and be happy.



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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: iaJim
Date: June 27, 2006 02:27PM
Volvo wagon. That's what click and clack, the tappet brothers on NPR's Car Talk are always recommending in these situations. They also recommend used, but that's just them. Seem like dependable cars. Better yet, I think they are safe cars, and with your family, that's what you want.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: AlphaDog
Date: June 27, 2006 02:30PM
Take a look at the Toyota Highlander. It's available with a third seat, and you could get the Hybrid, which gets great gas mileage. Of course you pay more for that privilege, too. smiling smiley

[www.toyota.com]
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: mick e
Date: June 27, 2006 02:36PM
The Highlander is a nice safe, somewhat bland choice. mick e test drove one and it's just fine.

The Honda Element might be a fun option. mick e's buddy has one and he digs it bigtime.

Volvo might do the trick, although the quality is dropping thanks to Ford taking a crap on the marque.




Unpaid Social Liaison
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: Gareth
Date: June 27, 2006 02:37PM
Volvo wagons used to have a rear facing third row seat, if your kids are still small. Although I don't know how far back in the used market you'd have to look for that.

There's also the Ford Freestyle and Mercedes R-class.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: M A V I C
Date: June 27, 2006 02:50PM
I really like wagons. I've had three subaru wagons and now an audi. The audi is great. With the 2.7T and the adjustable suspension, it's both fun and practical. If I'm in the city and want it to handle like a sports car, I lower the suspension to sport mode and maybe even shift it into sport mode. If I'm up in the mountains and off maintained roads, I push the suspension up into level 4 which boosts the car 6 inches higher.




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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: jdc
Date: June 27, 2006 02:53PM
all SUVs will have gas milage within 1-2 mpgs of each other -- its just the way it is

my wife really wanted the highlander, but i just thought i was too small -- we ended up with a volvo XC 90, small, but not too big, 3rd row seat -- but mileage is the same as every other SUV on the planet -- 16 around town, 20 on the highway

not my first choice cause of what micke stated -- ford has dumped on them -- but it made my wife happy

im also curios about the american car thing -- they are always the most unreliable out there and many are made in friggin mexico

i might go straight to a minivan as well -- but honda or toyota -- not Chrysler...
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: spacescape
Date: June 27, 2006 02:53PM
Quote
M A V I C
I really like wagons. I've had three subaru wagons and now an audi. The audi is great. With the 2.7T and the adjustable suspension, it's both fun and practical. If I'm in the city and want it to handle like a sports car, I lower the suspension to sport mode and maybe even shift it into sport mode. If I'm up in the mountains and off maintained roads, I push the suspension up into level 4 which boosts the car 6 inches higher.

How many seats? Actually, my wife gave me the OK to get a Mustang GT... However, I really think we need something larger and then replace the jetta with something impractical next year.

Oh, and which audi wagon do you have? buy? lease?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/27/2006 03:06PM by spacescape.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: microchip13
Date: June 27, 2006 02:53PM
I second the look at foreign made cars.

I rode in a highlander a few days ago, very nice car, and very spacious.
The Rav4 is smaller, but you could also look at it, while not a hybrid, it still gets pretty good milage.



_______________________________________________________________
Security is just a word. The act of being secure is entirely different.
"...but I think that to make your dream a reality, having a dream itself is a mandatory prerequisite"
From A Book: Walking Through The Impossible

Just because it has two clutches, shifts faster, uses a torque converter or has near-infinite gear ratios, requires less driver intervention and is more efficient doesn't make it better in my opinion.
Save The Manual Transmission
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: DharmaDog
Date: June 27, 2006 02:58PM
I have a 2006 Fusion 3L V6 that gets ~25MPG combined. Rated 21 city & 29 Highway and puts out 221hp. But, if you can wait a bit (not sure how long, but later this year) There will be a version of the Fusion with a 3.5L V6, a six-speed manual, and all wheel drive. I think it is supposed to be around 260hp.


FWIW,
2006 Accord 3L V6 gets 20 city, 29 Highway. 244hp
2006 Camry 3L V6 gets 20 city, 28 Highway. 190hp

Couldn't find a Legacy with a 6 cylinder, but this is essentially the same car...
2006 Outback Sedan 3L V6 gets 19 city, 26 Highway. 250hp.

Another car that might be good is the New Saturn Aura:
It is available with a choice of 2 V6 engines. The top line one is the 3.6L that is found in the Cadillac CTS. Puts out 252hp and is rated at 18/27. The lower end V6 is a 3.5L putting out 224hp and rated at 20/30. Later in the model year, a 4 cylinder hybrid will be offered.

Anyway, we really like our Fusion. It drives and handles very well and gets good mileage. I wouldn't call it sporty, but it is somewhat fun to drive. The new one with the larger engine, all wheel drive and a 6-speed manual should be a blast though.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: spacescape
Date: June 27, 2006 03:00PM
Quote
jdc
im also curios about the american car thing -- they are always the most unreliable out there and many are made in friggin mexico

I agree w/ you but we still get quite a bit of our revinue from the american automotive companies. So, I need to stay US or German at this time.

Bill
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: jdc
Date: June 27, 2006 03:11PM
apples to apples -- the 2007 camry has 250 hp, not 190 (no more 2006s) and is rated at 22/31 with the V6



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/27/2006 03:12PM by jdc.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: DharmaDog
Date: June 27, 2006 03:12PM
apples to apples -- I was comparing cars from the same model year with same engine sizes. You however, are not. The Toyota you mention is the next model year with a larger (3.5L to be exact) engine.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/27/2006 03:16PM by DharmaDog.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: ADent
Date: June 27, 2006 03:14PM
RAV4 is avaiable w/3rd row and is fast w/V6.

Think minivan.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: Go To Top
Date: June 27, 2006 03:16PM
The new Audi SUV reviewed in the LA Times sounds and looks good. Not the same as the VW Toureg SUV which I like.



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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: wurm
Date: June 27, 2006 03:38PM
Here you go. Not quite a wagon. Not quite a minivan. Sort of a Ford. Decent room, fun to drive, seating for 6 and/or decent storage. FWIW, we don't own one, but we do love our two Mazdas ('01 MPV and '04 Tribute). [www.mazdausa.com]

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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: MEG
Date: June 27, 2006 04:04PM
The new Audi Q and Mercedes G-class SUVs have a third row seat. The Mercedes R class has 6 adult seats. The Mercedes E-class wagon has a third row bench seat (for 2 kids and/or people under 50 inches only) so it can seat 7. If they still make the wagon with the diesel engine option, you're looking at over 32 mpg for a car that'll out perform the gas version. The Audi A6 and All-Road use to have a third-row seat option but I haven't checked out the newest A6 models since the redesign and not sure about the all-road status. My limited experience with a Volvo (cross country) is that while nice, it is not as roomy inside as the E-class or A6. If you plan on having tall (over 5' 10") rear seat passengers a lot, it's probably not a good choice.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: iaJim
Date: June 27, 2006 04:04PM
I always think that I need to have a vehicle that I enjoy walking up to in the parking lot. That Mazda has a face that only a Mazda dealer can love. Sorry. I saw a Toyota Sequoia last week. Seemed a great vehicle.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: JEBB
Date: June 27, 2006 04:05PM
If you only occasionally haul lots of people, maybe a smaller car and using a second car at those times might be best for you. It would mean that you wouldn't be hauling around a lot of big iron and consuming the barrels of oil when you're driving alone, which you said is most of the time.

My mechanic, an independent, warned me against European cars because they charge mucho bucks to access their repair information. That protects their monopoly on services and means big repair bills for their car owners. He said that access to such information is reasonably priced for Japanese, American and Korean cars.

As for American cars, they do come up with good models but you have to be selective. My current '99 Saturn wagon with 114K miles seems to be bullet-proof. Personally I'd shy away from Fords or Chryslers but some GM models are good (as with my Saturn). Japanese cars have a good reputation. Korean cars seem to be getting a lot better, especially Huyandi.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: Harbourmaster
Date: June 27, 2006 04:11PM
Did I miss something here?

You now have a child and you suddenly need a vehicle that seats 6+ passengers???



Aloha, Ken


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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: anonymouse1
Date: June 27, 2006 04:11PM
RAV4. Everybody I know who has one is happy with them.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: spearmint
Date: June 27, 2006 04:15PM
Honda Element. My friends with a big Mercedes drive the Element instead for fun.





Da Good Life
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: M A V I C
Date: June 27, 2006 04:21PM
Quote
spacescape
Quote
M A V I C
I really like wagons. I've had three subaru wagons and now an audi. The audi is great. With the 2.7T and the adjustable suspension, it's both fun and practical. If I'm in the city and want it to handle like a sports car, I lower the suspension to sport mode and maybe even shift it into sport mode. If I'm up in the mountains and off maintained roads, I push the suspension up into level 4 which boosts the car 6 inches higher.

How many seats? Actually, my wife gave me the OK to get a Mustang GT... However, I really think we need something larger and then replace the jetta with something impractical next year.

Oh, and which audi wagon do you have? buy? lease?

5, comfortably. The Outback LTD Wagon I had before was 5 as well. The difference is the Outback's rear seats sit up a bit higher, so people back there have a better view. The audi has more leg room for passengers in the back seat.

I bought a certified AllRoad. For the love of God, don't buy new unless it's for business purposes and you're getting ~half off (especially for a US make.) My Outback was new, so I haven't always been in the "buy used" camp.

Also, I find comparing MPG and HP between cars to be apples and oranges as well. I test drove the 3.0L H6 outback and it was barely more powerful than the 2.5L H4, even though there is a significant HP difference. The AllRoad has 265HP and it can snap your head back in 1st, 2nd and 3rd gears. Much more punch than the Outbacks.

Of course, I drive mostly in the city with lots of hills and stop & go. Over the past couple months the computer tells me I've average about 18.8MPG. It gets better mileage going over a mountain pass than in the city.




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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: billb
Date: June 27, 2006 04:29PM
You don't keep a car for 10 years ?
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: M A V I C
Date: June 27, 2006 04:57PM
Quote
billb
You don't keep a car for 10 years ?

Even if I was to keep a car for 10 years, I still wouldn't buy new. It's not uncommon for some cars to drop in value by 50% in two years. Some friends of mine bought two new matching chevy's. They got some killer discounts where they basically got one car for free. A couple years later, their cars were worth as much as their loan was on a car.

And that's another thing - NEVER pay cash for a car.




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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: Kiva
Date: June 27, 2006 05:34PM
Jetta turbodiesel wagon, if you can find one...48mpg...

kiva



----------------------
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: M A V I C
Date: June 27, 2006 06:07PM
Quote
Kiva
Jetta turbodiesel wagon, if you can find one...48mpg...

kiva

Can those be converted to biodiesel?




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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: dad@home
Date: June 27, 2006 06:19PM
Very happy with my Ford Freestyle.

Stretched Volvo XC90 frame...stiff/safe/handles very well for a large car. Curtain airbags all the way back.

Seats 7 in three rows (adults fit in the 3rd row!).

FWD or AWD.

Best in class crash and roll over tests.

Better gas milage than most car based SUVs because of its CV tranmission. With my AWD I just got 25 mpg on 600 mile round trip to Seattle (over the Cascade mountains) at 75 mph and a/c on.

Zero defects so far after 18 months and 21,000 miles.

Dad@home
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: Kiva
Date: June 27, 2006 06:54PM
Quote
M A V I C
Quote
Kiva
Jetta turbodiesel wagon, if you can find one...48mpg...

kiva

Can those be converted to biodiesel?

yes. they're freaking impossible to find and there are some problems bringing them into CA to register. I always have my eye out, but it's unlikely..

kiva



----------------------
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: spacescape
Date: June 27, 2006 07:06PM
Quote
Harbourmaster
Did I miss something here?

You now have a child and you suddenly need a vehicle that seats 6+ passengers???

I didn't say I totally NEEDED 6+ seats... However, at least once a week we end up meeting my family (mom, dad and sister) and it would be nice if we could take one car.... Now, I think a sport wagon would be a really nice because they are front wheel drive, drive like a car and have the space of a SUV...

Bill
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: bfd
Date: June 27, 2006 07:28PM
Look at a CR-V. It's car based, so the suspension's a little mushier. You're not taking it off-road, anyway, it doesn't sound like, so that part won't matter. After your Exploder, you'll like it. bfd test drove one, and it's got quite a bit going for it. Mainly price/power and price/features ratios…
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: AlphaDog
Date: June 27, 2006 07:42PM
Quote
bfd
Look at a CR-V. It's car based, so the suspension's a little mushier. You're not taking it off-road, anyway, it doesn't sound like, so that part won't matter. After your Exploder, you'll like it. bfd test drove one, and it's got quite a bit going for it. Mainly price/power and price/features ratios…

The CRV was fun to drive, but did you ride in it? Especially in the back seat? That thing was almost as comfortable as a wooden park bench, and I've got pretty good "padding"! smiling smiley Seat comfort was one of the things that made me choose the used Highlander.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 27, 2006 08:44PM
you are all thinking WAY too small. trunk seats 6. Put the kids there. The "crumple zone" alone is larger than most Hondas.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/27/2006 08:45PM by Racer X.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: h'
Date: June 27, 2006 11:56PM
No car.



I suffer from the same sensitivity that you do. A few nuggets of wisdom were shared with me and I'm "trying" to incorporate them into my life. First, remember that nobody can hurt your feelings unless you let them. You can always reject what is being forced on you emotionally.
Second, nothing changes unless you change it. If you don't want the behavior to be repeated then you need to take action. Otherwise the kid has learned that his behavior is the way to get things done, because everyone lets him get away with it.
In the meantime I sympathize because I've been there.
-beerman
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: Phy
Date: June 28, 2006 12:21AM
Daughter-in-law has a Honda Pilot-- with 3rd seat. Lots of fun to drive and I think it has an auto, rather than truck chassis, so turns easier.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: mikebw
Date: June 28, 2006 01:24AM
How about the Toyota bB? [toyota.jp]
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: June 28, 2006 08:13AM
Go for the 2 seater. Attach a hitch, put on tow ropes, give the kids roller skates....

We just went through the same issue, and went for the Chrysler minivan. Third one we've owned. Mileage in the 19mpg range for city, 26 for highway (based on our measurements so far). And the kids like the fact that the seats fold flat, and there are lots of hidey holes for 'stuff'. Yeah, honda, hyundai, etc.. but I've used Chrysler's minivans since the early 80's , and I've never been burned by one. First one was donated at 170K miles, second one still runs and has 150K miles on it (I use it as a 'pick up truck', it's a little shaky for wife driving). This minivan replaced a full sized conversion van, which got around 12 mpg city and 16 highway, so we're doing better.

But this one is the 'town and country', which has more toys than I can handle. My wife says playing with the GPS keeps me out of her hair when she's driving, and I can't say she's wrong.

I would personally love to see a full-up hybrid minivan, and preferably one that can be used as an electric vehicle and externally recharged, but that's a few years away.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: h linamen
Date: June 28, 2006 08:44AM
We love our Mazda MPV. Never had a minivan before and now couldn't do without it. The MPV is slightly smaller than other minivans and therefore more agile, yet with all the conveniences. We get 21 around town and 27 on the highway.

[www.mazdausa.com]
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: June 28, 2006 09:06AM
Quote
mick e
The Honda Element might be a fun option. mick e's buddy has one and he digs it bigtime.

I too like the Element (I'm looking to get one sometime in the next few months), BUT it only seats four. Period. Due to the split rear seat design, the seat belt for a fifth passenger is not included.



It is what it is.
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: spacescape
Date: June 28, 2006 09:14AM
Just got a call from Ford and I they gave me what appears to be a great deal on a Fusion SEL that's pretty loaded. Right now thought the 5th of July they are paying for the first month and giving six month free gas on MOST Fords.

If I can get them to EAT my final payment of my Explorer I might consider it. However, I don't really want some of the features she quoted so I need to figure out "IF" I can same some more cash based on less features.

Now, I need to re-call my Pontiac/GMC saleguy and ask him for a quote on a G6 w/ V6 and a Grand Prix.

Bill
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Re: OT: Practical Car versus Fun Car. Tough Decision.
Posted by: jdc
Date: June 28, 2006 10:58AM
quotes:

>> The new Korean is made in the U.S., and the new American model is not. Hyundai built an all-new manufacturing plant in Montgomery, Alabama, for this 2006 Sonata. Ford's Fusion is assembled in Hermosillo, Mexico,...

>> It was a new design for the 2003 model year. Both the Accord and the Camry are built in U.S. plants—the Honda in Marysville, Ohio, and the Toyota in Georgetown, Kentucky.

it took second place in their test:
[www.caranddriver.com]
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