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Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: earache
Date: August 18, 2006 09:08PM
In my previous post [forums.macresource.com] I described my dilemma about a neighbor who complained about my barking dog. I got lots of very thoughtful replies on how to handle the situation. I even got some replies which did nothing to help but which I totally expected and appreciated. Thanks to all.

So onto the follow-up...

First of all, let me just say that I'm concerned about the situation and want to make things right with my dog and my neighbors. When my dog barks at random stuff I just can't stand it, so I know exactly how a neighbor might feel. So the first thing I did was to see if the problem really did exist. I hooked up my iSight to my PB and pointed the iSight out one of my backyard windows. Fired up Evocam (great security software) and set it up to record just audio. I left it running when I went to work on Thursday. Came home after about 6 hours and loaded the resulting QT file into iMovie so I could see the waveform of the audio to tell where my dog might be barking. Sure enough, there were a ton of little spikes throughout the length of the file. Almost all were barks. Crap. When I got the first note about the barking, I recorded for 3 days and got just a handful of barks, but now it was a different story. I could totally see why somebody would get pissed.

So what to do... I went out and bought a shock collar! (sorry BGnR I had to do it :-) ) No, I bought one of these ultrasonic collars. Same principle as the shock collar, but with an ear piercing alarm instead of a shock. I put it on my dog and watched him... after some time he heard something in the creek and went to check it out, he barked, the alarm went off and he jumped... no more barking. Now for the real test. Put it on him this morning and started the recording. Just two barks the whole day. I'm sure it would have been a lot more had it not been for the collar.

Now we'll start working on some positive reinforcement to get his behaviour in line. Hopefully the collar is a short term thing.

I go to see the neighbor tomorrow to make amends. Wish me luck. Thanks again to everyone for their inputs. I'll let you know how it goes.



earache
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: BigGuynRusty
Date: August 18, 2006 09:15PM
Quote
earache
So what to do... I went out and bought a shock collar! (sorry BGnR I had to do it :-) ) No, I bought one of these ultrasonic collars. Same principle as the shock collar, but with an ear piercing alarm instead of a shock.

My Gawd, how cruel!
So you are too Fing lazy to spend time with your dog, so you elect to blast the animal with sound? Do you realize how sensitive a dogs hearing is?

BGnR
Remember, you singled me out.



"Good heavens, Miss Sakamoto! You're beautiful!"
"If we dig precious things from the land, we will invite disaster."
"Near the day of Purification, there will be cobwebs spun back and forth in the sky."
"A container of ashes might one day be thrown from the sky, which could burn the land and boil the oceans."
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: BigGuynRusty
Date: August 18, 2006 09:23PM
What do you do when a kid cries?
Blast it with a stadium airhorn?

BGnR



"Good heavens, Miss Sakamoto! You're beautiful!"
"If we dig precious things from the land, we will invite disaster."
"Near the day of Purification, there will be cobwebs spun back and forth in the sky."
"A container of ashes might one day be thrown from the sky, which could burn the land and boil the oceans."
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: elmo3
Date: August 18, 2006 09:26PM
rusty, shut the @#$%& up and go away.

I'm sure you'd have made a great parent. <snort>



---------------


In the words of DharmaDog: &amp;quot;it may or may not be utter horse@#$%&, but it shouldn't be dismissed simply because it doesn't agree with your opinion.&amp;quot;

Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.

Trying is the first step to failure. -- Homer Simpson
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: earache
Date: August 18, 2006 09:28PM
BGnR, yes, I'm perfectly aware of how sensitive a dog's hearing is but I thought that was better than a shock. My parents used to use a shock collar on one of their dogs and it was awful (which is also why I singled out your comment, because it isn't something I would do). I needed an immediate solution to my problem while I worked on a long term solution. And no, I'm not too fricking lazy to spend time with my dog. I spend as much time as I can with him, but I work and have other things to do. Training with positive reinforcement is going to take time. I'll devote the time, but it's going to be stretched out. If I can turn this collar off in a week that'll be great, only time will tell.



earache
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: BigGuynRusty
Date: August 18, 2006 09:32PM
Quote
earache
BGnR, yes, I'm perfectly aware of how sensitive a dog's hearing is but I thought that was better than a shock.

So instead of an axe, you chose a baseball bat?
Nice!

BGnR



"Good heavens, Miss Sakamoto! You're beautiful!"
"If we dig precious things from the land, we will invite disaster."
"Near the day of Purification, there will be cobwebs spun back and forth in the sky."
"A container of ashes might one day be thrown from the sky, which could burn the land and boil the oceans."
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: Jp!
Date: August 18, 2006 09:55PM
Good report. Good to see a dog owner take positive action. Ignore 'him'..literally.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: Markintosh
Date: August 18, 2006 09:57PM
Can we move this thread to the other side please?



“Live your life, love your life, don’t regret…live, learn and move forward positively.” – CR Johnson
Loving life in Lake Tahoe, CA
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: C(-)ris
Date: August 18, 2006 10:00PM
Quote
Markintosh
Can we move this thread to the other side please?

Why? There is nothing political about it. It is standard fare for this side.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: Lux Interior
Date: August 18, 2006 10:08PM
I blame Bush.



There. Now you can move it.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: DaviDC.
Date: August 18, 2006 10:08PM
How, pray tell, does someone spend time with their dog while away at work during the day? Might be time to adjust the medication again, big guy.

Great follow-up. You sound like a good neighbor to me!



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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: BigGuynRusty
Date: August 18, 2006 10:12PM
Quote
DaviDC.
How, pray tell, does someone spend time with their dog while away at work during the day? Might be time to adjust the medication again, big guy.

Great follow-up. You sound like a good neighbor to me!

Another fusking idiot that doesn't get it.

BGnR



"Good heavens, Miss Sakamoto! You're beautiful!"
"If we dig precious things from the land, we will invite disaster."
"Near the day of Purification, there will be cobwebs spun back and forth in the sky."
"A container of ashes might one day be thrown from the sky, which could burn the land and boil the oceans."
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: h linamen
Date: August 19, 2006 04:24AM
BGnR..... a dog doesn't have to bark any more than a kid has to throw tantrums. The bark collar QUICKLY teaches the dog not to bark. He doesn't bark, he doesn't get the shock or the alarm. It's not like you are subjecting the animal to constant pain. He learns acceptable behaviour the same as when you discipline a child for unacceptable behaviour.

We don't allow sexual perverts to act on their "urges", so why allow a dog to disrupt an entire household or neighborhood with it's urge to bark. Control is the key. He doesn't bark, then he gets to live a life of ease, eating, sleeping, romping in the back yard and enjoying time with the family.

My adult son had to do the same thing with his Jack Russell terrier and it worked beautifully.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/19/2006 04:25AM by h linamen.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: MysteryGuest
Date: August 19, 2006 05:25AM
I was wondering about that little "work" thing myself. It's usually not voluntary...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/19/2006 05:25AM by MysteryGuest.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: CJsNvrUrly
Date: August 19, 2006 06:08AM
Sounds like a great plan, earache. I'm glad you're working it out.




bunny smileyCentral VA
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: Mr645
Date: August 19, 2006 07:55AM
Typically after he learns what the collar does, simply showing it to him or putting it on should stop his barking.

I still prefer the shock collar over the audio one. I mean do you know how many hours of entertainment you can get by watching your dog jump when the collar is up on full power? My dog finally chewed threw the extention cord that connected him collar to the wall outlet. So now he just drags a car battery around the back yard



"he is going to start WW3!!!!"
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: h linamen
Date: August 19, 2006 08:43AM
Mr645... You are hilarious... tongue in cheek, I'm sure.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: billb
Date: August 19, 2006 09:19AM
Sounds like he learned that his incessant barking eventually got you home and ended his loneliness/whatever.
Hope the collar un-learns it.

Is he loose and not tied ? (some dogs /most?/ don't like being tied.)

Your neighbor should be happy you're at least trying something.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: Go To Top
Date: August 19, 2006 09:51AM
Train the fsking dog ownerz of the world. The only way.



A man who is of "sound mind" is one who keeps the inner madman under lock and key.
(Paul Valery)
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: rocketiz
Date: August 19, 2006 02:56PM
I wish I had a neighbor like you who gave a dammm about
noise polution from dogs and I commend your method.
I doubt your collar causes any damage to the dogs' ears (the company who sold it would likely be sued) and if the dog
learns to modify their behavior, there is no problem for the
dog or the neighbor (win-win). I have moron neighbors who
have a doberman and I once wrote a note to them with no
results. My direct feeling is screw the dog, if you can modify
it's behavior without long-term harm more power to you. I don't even like to go into my own back yard.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: wowzer
Date: August 19, 2006 03:15PM
It's a dog. Treat it like a dog. Dogs respond to negative reinforcement.

Watch Dog Whisperer from the National Geographic channel. Totally amazing what that guy does.



All I ever really needed to know, I learned from watching Star Trek.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: ka jowct
Date: August 19, 2006 09:51PM
I wouldn't call what Cesar Millan does "negative reinforcement". And I suspect he'd tell you to walk your dog a lot more than you are currently doing.

If you aren't walking your dog two or three times a day, you should try to find a dog walker.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: Baby Tats
Date: August 19, 2006 10:21PM
You are in a difficult spot and I applaud your efforts for trying to do something to keep peace with your neighbors. We have had a few situations in our neighborhood escalate to the point that animal control has had to issue citations and there is now a possibility of a dog being removed. In a case like that, nobody (especially the dog) wins. As long as your dog is only barking at random noises then a collar can be appropriate. It sounds like his sensitivity control may be set too low. OTOH, if your dog is standing at your back door and barking because he misses you then a correction collar is nothing more than a torture device.

Buried in BGnR's vitriol is a good piece of advice in that you shouldn't view the collar as the only thing that you need to do. Spend 10 min 2-3X a day training him to bark at what you think is appropriate. You can set his proper sensitivity level with a little work. With the proper combination of positive reinforcement and assertiveness it won't take long to modify his behavior. Dogs respond amazingly well once you establish dominance and they view you as the alpha. Once that relationship is established then your dog will always look to you to tell him the proper behavior as opposed to you always having to correct the inappropriate behavior. And when you do have to correct an inappropriate behavior it only takes one or two times to get the point across. Owners and dogs who have this relationship are often the happiest and most content.

As wowzer points out the Dog Whisperer is amazing. But I would not characterisze what he does as negative reinforcement as much as it is establishing dominance and then showing the dog what is expected of them. Good show- but you have to remember that it is edited so don't expect to get the same results as quickly as he does.


BT


EDIT: Didn't see ka jowct's post as I was typing at the same time, but it seems that we agree about the dog whisperer. I agree that if your dog got a long walk in the morning then he would be much more likely to sleep during the day.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/19/2006 10:27PM by Baby Tats.
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: chas_m
Date: August 19, 2006 10:50PM
Quote
Lux Interior
I blame Bush.



There. Now you can move it.


Laugh of the day. Thanks Lux.

PS. love your band.



chas_m




[crawlingfromtheusa.blogspot.com] <-- Moving to Canada blog
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Re: Barking Dog - Part 2
Posted by: ka jowct
Date: August 19, 2006 11:28PM
Cesar Millan emphasizes over and over that walking your dog (not just talking it outside for 5 minutes to pee and poop, but a good-quality, half hour or longer walk every day) is extremely important in preventing unwanted behavior as well as in building a strong relationship. Of course it's also important to walk the dog correctly. Just letting the dog have the run of a yard isn't sufficient.

I've been trying to apply just a very, very small part of what he teaches when I walk my neighbor's dog. "Calm, assertive energy" and good walks really seem to work. My neighbor's wife recently introduced me to a friend of hers as the only person the dog likes apart from her husband. And as far as I can tell, this has happened primarily on the basis of taking decent walks with him and maintaining a calm energy.

I think you have to be very careful applying Millan's techniques, because he reads dog body language better than most people on the planet, and most of us are not going to be able to approach that level of insight without a lot of experience and practice.

We could really use someone like him in NYC, where so many good, salvageable dogs end up being dumped at shelters and killed because their owners have failed to handle them appropriately.
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