For all the East Coasters, what do you think?

Is he sincere?

Edited version here: [us.video.aol.com]

I want to form my own opinion, but naturally I am biased and a bit confused that some people still think that was a Comedy Skit gone wrong.

The weird thing is when the audience was laughing, they thought it was a actual comedy bit. Jerry had to actually say, "It's not funny".

He knows he did something wrong and he is really shook up about it. He is like a kid in the cookie jar. He knows he is in trouble and just doesn't know what the outcome will be.

He said several times he is not a racist, but it was just a stupid thing to say.

I'm just wondering what some of the people in the other threads who justified and/or defended him, thought of the whole situation now after viewing the Letterman apology.

Other threads about the topic:

[forums.macresource.com]

[forums.macresource.com]

EDIT: Overall it is not the N-word thing that bothers me the most, but the way the video starts off....

"The camera started rolling just as Richards began his attack, screaming at one of the men, "Fifty years ago we'd have you upside down with a f***ing fork up your ass."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/20/2006 11:48PM by ArtP.

A racist is someone who actively beats down other races. Someone who engages in actions that keep people down in a social sense.

I believe the guy was sincere, I think he just @#$%& up and the momentum of the whole thing just sucked him in

...the only guy that can help him now is Jesse Jackson. No wait...he needs to call Jackie Chiles...Jackie will get him out of this



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2006 12:04AM by Kraniac.

If Richards isn't racist then that means Mel Gibson isn't anti Semitic just because they say so right?

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2006 12:35AM by pRON aHOLIC.

He's nobody's racist. Just a fool that Mr. T. would pity.

Mel has clearly demonstrated, on a number of occasions, drunk, sober and artistically, deeper and more complex feelings regarding the Jewish people, contemporarily and historically.

Richards was on a stage and failing miserably at dealing with a group of hecklers. He lost it and started to spiral. I don't think it's the same thing at all. Im not defending the guy or throwing up excuses for him, it was really bad. However, It's not the same thing.

Like his tirade on stage, it went on WAY too long. He would've come off looking better if he had kept it short & simple.

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Either way, in this era of instant web video...
There goes the reunion.

If Richards isn't racist then that means Mel Gibson isn't anti Semitic just because they say so right?

Not even close.

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An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

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I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.

I am watching it now, West Coast.
I think his apology is sincere and that he doesn't come off as a closet racist who just "happened" to spurt out that which exists in his id.

But what do I know, I'm a RAVING anti-dentite.

It seems so Kaufman-like to me.

I was JUST THINKING yesterday morning BEFORE the video, that I wonder why Seinfeld does NOT make a comeback.

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Why does that AOL link resize my window?

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Grateful11

I'll say one thing, at least Mel was drunk. I was in college and saw many drunk people do things they would not normally do. One of my friends committed suicide because another guy we knew had committed suicide and it depressed him.That's a far stretch from spouting off at the mouth, but one would never know the guy would do that while drunk. He was a good friend of mine at the time, too. Michael Richards (who I love) has no excuse of being in an altered state, so to speak. It was a stupid rant and he's paying for it now. But, I bet he never thought he was on camera, and he'll never think he's NOT on camera again.

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Those words and the tirade came to him too quickly for him to able to say he is not a racist. What's he supposed to do? Admit it? Of course he had to apologize profusely. Sorry if that comes up in public I would hate to hear him in private.

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Da Good Life

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spearmint
Those words and the tirade came to him too quickly for him to able to say he is not a racist. What's he supposed to do? Admit it?

Then what's the point of him saying he's not a racist and apologizing?

If he's doing it just because society expects him to apologize, but it isn't sincere and everyone believes it to be insincere, then why apologize at all? Do we really expect people to apologize for their actions if we also believe it wasn't an accident or unfortunate circumstance, but their actual true feelings and beliefs coming through? Don't we all see through that and realize the apology has no value?

I have mixed feelings about people apologizing for their beliefs regardless of how "wrong" those beliefs are. It would be better if people changed their "wrong" beliefs, rather than simply apologizing for them.

I mean do we now think that Mel loves Jews because he apologized?

If you take a look at the incident it's no "routine." it's harsh and ugly. I'm sure the Letterman audience members that were laughing didn't see that part, so sure they probably thought it was an act. They were at a comedy venue.

What I find absolutely amazing is that you have the whole Trent Lott episode a few years ago and the media put the guy through the ringer for saying it was too bad Strom Thurmond wasn't elected President. Lott apologized a million times in a million ways. He still lost his leadership job, and rightly so...it was a stupid comment to make even if it was just empty political rhetoric.

Here comes "Kramer," using all sorts of racial epithets that would probably make even Trent Lott blush and all he has to do is apologize once on a late night comedy talk show...via satellite? No wonder the audience was laughing.

What really stuck me was when Letterman asked Kramer what remedial steps he was going to take now. Kramer was tongue tied. That tells me he really hasn't been all that reflective about his tantrum. He is shook up all right...at the fact his career might be DOA. I know I have zero interest in seeing anything he does. I see him and I just see the tirade.

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DharmaDog

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spearmint
Those words and the tirade came to him too quickly for him to able to say he is not a racist. What's he supposed to do? Admit it?

Then what's the point of him saying he's not a racist and apologizing?

If he's doing it just because society expects him to apologize, but it isn't sincere and everyone believes it to be insincere, then why apologize at all? Do we really expect people to apologize for their actions if we also believe it wasn't an accident or unfortunate circumstance, but their actual true feelings and beliefs coming through? Don't we all see through that and realize the apology has no value?

I have mixed feelings about people apologizing for their beliefs regardless of how "wrong" those beliefs are. It would be better if people changed their "wrong" beliefs, rather than simply apologizing for them.

I mean do we now think that Mel loves Jews because he apologized?

What's the point? Richard wants to try and save his pathetic career. Being dishonest is definitely an option.

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Da Good Life



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2006 07:55AM by spearmint.

At leasthe didn't refuse to apologize before he apologized.

While we're at it, let's brand. anyone who called their wife an ass (even under their breath) a woman - hater.
After all, every one here is so lilly white perfect.

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billb
At leasthe didn't refuse to apologize before he apologized.

While we're at it, let's brand. anyone who called their wife an ass (even under their breath) a woman - hater.
After all, every one here is so lilly white perfect.

Fine. Give him two points for honest. He's still a loser by 98 points. Not sure how calling one's wife an "ass" is equal to going on a public tirade and calling strangers "n*" because they heckle you.

Here's the apology clip if you haven't seen it:
[www.youtube.com]

I thought it was pretty obvious in his rage he tried to go over-the-top with his inappropriateness on purpose but it it backfired badly... Apology seemed VERY sincere. I feel sorry for him having to go through this problem he's created. I don't believe he would harbor such hatred in everyday life.

Interesting note- I read that he used to do some sort of race-relations programs for the military, before his acting days.

Everything aside, I believe he is one of the best physical comedians of our time, along with Rowan Atkinson and John Ritter, and I hope he can heal, recover, and work again if he chooses.

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spearmint

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DharmaDog

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spearmint
Those words and the tirade came to him too quickly for him to able to say he is not a racist. What's he supposed to do? Admit it?

Then what's the point of him saying he's not a racist and apologizing?

If he's doing it just because society expects him to apologize, but it isn't sincere and everyone believes it to be insincere, then why apologize at all? Do we really expect people to apologize for their actions if we also believe it wasn't an accident or unfortunate circumstance, but their actual true feelings and beliefs coming through? Don't we all see through that and realize the apology has no value?

I have mixed feelings about people apologizing for their beliefs regardless of how "wrong" those beliefs are. It would be better if people changed their "wrong" beliefs, rather than simply apologizing for them.

I mean do we now think that Mel loves Jews because he apologized?

What's the point? Richard wants to try and save his pathetic career. Being dishonest is definitely an option.

I understand that. As does just about everyone else, so again I have to ask why bother apologizing it everyone knows he's just doing it to save his career. Is that really all we expect? You can do or say anything you you want, then issue an apology and it's all okey dokey?

I 'm all for free speech, and for people speaking their minds, and for people believing in whatever they want to believe in regardless of how repulsive it may be to others, but one can't expect there won't be ramifications for offensive actions or words after simply issuing a seemingly insincere apology for them.

I don't mean to sound harsh, I'm just posing a question. I don't think he should be cast off onto an island or anything.

Why apologize when we know it's only being done to save your career and people don't necessarily believe you're being sincere? Does the apology still work? Is a half-assed apology all it takes to get back into the public's good graces?

I think a big part of the reason why i'm so forgiving here is that it happened at a comedy club.

what? a stand up comic said something offensive? GET OUTTA HERE! stand up comics only say nice things!

thats why it doesn't compare to politicians or mel gibson.

that's a good point

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mattkime
I think a big part of the reason why i'm so forgiving here is that it happened at a comedy club.

what? a stand up comic said something offensive? GET OUTTA HERE! stand up comics only say nice things!

thats why it doesn't compare to politicians or mel gibson.

i agree, especially when the loudmouth hecklers brought it on in the first place, if you don't think it's funny just get up and leave...

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SteveJobs
It seems so Kaufman-like to me.

Yes, that's a good comparison, up to the point that Kaufman deliberately planned most of his stuff, whereas I do believe Richards got caught up in his own anger and lost control.

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I was JUST THINKING yesterday morning BEFORE the video, that I wonder why Seinfeld does NOT make a comeback.

He hasn't gone anywhere; he does the major house stand-up thing every once in a while, and Seinfeld made him a millionaire 80 times over, so he only needs to work as much as he likes.

Besides, if you mean a comeback to television, there's no way he can top what he's already done in the sitcom format. Like Letterman observd, Seinfeld will be playing forever (though Richards' gaffe might cause a slight temporary blip in the ratings).

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SteveJobs
It seems so Kaufman-like to me.

Yes, that's a good comparison, up to the point that Kaufman deliberately planned most of his stuff, whereas I do believe Richards got caught up in his own anger and lost control.

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I was JUST THINKING yesterday morning BEFORE the video, that I wonder why Seinfeld does NOT make a comeback.

He hasn't gone anywhere; he does the major house stand-up thing every once in a while, and Seinfeld made him a millionaire 80 times over, so he only needs to work as much as he likes.

Besides, if you mean a comeback to television, there's no way he can top what he's already done in the sitcom format. Like Letterman observed, Seinfeld will be playing forever (though Richards' gaffe might cause a slight temporary blip in the ratings).

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pixelzombie

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mattkime
I think a big part of the reason why i'm so forgiving here is that it happened at a comedy club.

what? a stand up comic said something offensive? GET OUTTA HERE! stand up comics only say nice things!

thats why it doesn't compare to politicians or mel gibson.

i agree, especially when the loudmouth hecklers brought it on in the first place, if you don't think it's funny just get up and leave...

I am sorry, but I finally have to weigh in here. The phrase, "especially when the loudmouth hecklers brought it on in the first place, if you don't think it's funny just get up and leave..." is just @#$%& stupid in this case. No one deserves to be called that word. No one. Try having being called that when you're six years old on a playground and you'll see how unbelievably inexcusable it is. Period.

And NO, white people have not earned the so-called "privilege" to use that term loosely, even with their brown "friends". It's only been 40-some years since the Civil Rights movement people. Some people's cultural memory & historical knowledge are not that short. That word was negatively & deliberately put into practice for a good 400 years. It still is.

Read this loud and clear: THAT WORD STILL HAS HORRIBLE MEANINGS AND RAMIFICATIONS. YOU DO NOT GET A PASS IF YOU'RE WHITE.

There are people who swung from trees and were eaten by dogs so I would NOT be called such a name as well have the right to vote and have an education.

Stop making excuses.

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trisho.
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Official Card-Carrying Mother Earthin' Sl*t.

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Chupa Chupa
What really stuck me was when Letterman asked Kramer what remedial steps he was going to take now. Kramer was tongue tied. That tells me he really hasn't been all that reflective about his tantrum.

As I've said another related thread, I've seen comics (especially the "outside" ones) get caught up in their own characters. Looking at him on Letterman, I can see he was/is still shell shocked at his own aberrant behavior.

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He is shook up all right...at the fact his career might be DOA. I know I have zero interest in seeing anything he does. I see him and I just see the tirade.

He DID say that he had a lot of "personal work" to do. That sounds like he is taking responsibility for his actions, instead of other recent jerks in the news who blame their behavior on alcohol or other outside forces. I believe his apology to be sincere. But you're right about one thing- it will take a LOT of work on his part to get people to look at him and NOT see the rant.

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trisho.
I am sorry, but I finally have to weigh in here. The phrase, "especially when the loudmouth hecklers brought it on in the first place, if you don't think it's funny just get up and leave..." is just @#$%& stupid in this case. No one deserves to be called that word. No one. Try having being called that when you're six years old on a playground and you'll see how unbelievably inexcusable it is. Period.

Read this loud and clear: THAT WORD STILL HAS HORRIBLE MEANINGS AND RAMIFICATIONS. YOU DO NOT GET A PASS IF YOU'RE WHITE.

Stop making excuses.

What's our position on the blacks who STARTED the whole fracus then calling Richards a "Cracker-ass muthaf*cka!"?

Racist or no?

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pixelzombie

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mattkime
I think a big part of the reason why i'm so forgiving here is that it happened at a comedy club.

what? a stand up comic said something offensive? GET OUTTA HERE! stand up comics only say nice things!

i agree, especially when the loudmouth hecklers brought it on in the first place, if you don't think it's funny just get up and leave...

Richards been at this long enough to know how to handle a heckler (the best I've ever seen at this is Greg Proops), and this wasn't it.

I do have to wonder, though, why some people go to a comedy club (or a movie, or especially a concert) and never shut up. It's like they think they're in their living rooms watching TV or something.

This of course does not excuse Richard's poor handling of the problem, but there it is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2006 12:13PM by Joey Cupcakes.

I got the impression that Richards was truly contrite. He said he had "personal work" to do so I felt like he was accepting responsibility and not trying to claim it was because he was drunk or his dog died or whatever. He should have kept it short and sweet, it became sort of embarassing to watch as he rambled on. I don't think it is relevent to discuss what people said back at him -- from what I saw they tried admonishing him politely ("that was uncalled for") and when he got more and more wound up and obnoxious, they began to respond in kind is all.

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HAS he been doing stand-up?

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Richards was at a loss for words during the interview, even before Letterman asked him any questions. I would expect this with anyone who lost their temper and said horrible, over the top things.

I don't understand why certain expression can be used by some and not by others.

Certain terms are always "ugly" to me. I wish everyone would quit using them across the board. I hate these terms on the street, in music, etc.

Why is this post not ton the Political Forum??

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herbiesyufy

What's our position on the blacks who STARTED the whole fracus then calling Richards a "Cracker-ass muthaf*cka!"?

Racist or no?

Also lame. I usually leave it at "@#$%&" and be done with it. Stop being stupid.

Sorry for the late response. I've been traveling.

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trisho.
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Official Card-Carrying Mother Earthin' Sl*t.

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herbiesyufy

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trisho.
I am sorry, but I finally have to weigh in here. The phrase, "especially when the loudmouth hecklers brought it on in the first place, if you don't think it's funny just get up and leave..." is just @#$%& stupid in this case. No one deserves to be called that word. No one. Try having being called that when you're six years old on a playground and you'll see how unbelievably inexcusable it is. Period.

Read this loud and clear: THAT WORD STILL HAS HORRIBLE MEANINGS AND RAMIFICATIONS. YOU DO NOT GET A PASS IF YOU'RE WHITE.

Stop making excuses.

What's our position on the blacks who STARTED the whole fracus then calling Richards a "Cracker-ass muthaf*cka!"?

Racist or no?

i find the term "cracker" to be a compliment as i happen to have a few whips in my collection, but i'd say that the hecklers were thrown off guard by MR's comments and could only respond with the lowest common denominator...

How does one determine a half-assed apology or a genuine apology?


I think this is where forgiveness, benefit of the doubt, etc come in.

I have one brother of 3 that always refuses to accept an apology. He also refuses to "forgive" . He is usually the party that is wrong and he is a big @#$%&. He is also the person in our family that is the mosts miserable. He thinks he is perfect and everyone else has major issues.