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Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 18, 2016 03:20PM
I was just reading the discussion in OWC's Rocket Yard Weekly on the new MBPs with soldered-on SSDs:

[blog.macsales.com]

It's pretty dismaying, because:

(1) If the drive fails you have to replace the entire motherboard. If it's no longer warranty or AppleCare, i.e. after one or three years, what will that cost?

(2) If other components fail, you won't be able to take the drive out and run it in an enclosure to get the data off.

(3) Drives do fail. What's the mean failure time for SSDs?

It's really beginning to look like my next computer won't be a Mac. I detest Windows, so maybe I better learn how to use Linux.

/Mr Lynn



"Hillbilly at Harvard"
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Founded in 1948 by Pappy Ben Minnich
Saturdays 9am - 11am Eastern
WHRB-FM, Cambridge, MA
Streaming at [www.WHRB.org]
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The HAH weblog: [hillbillyatharvard.wordpress.com]

Topical weblog: [walkingcreekworld.wordpress.com]

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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: jdc
Date: November 18, 2016 03:21PM
All drives fail, not if, but when.





Edited 999 time(s). Last edit at 12:08PM by jdc.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: davemchine
Date: November 18, 2016 03:26PM
There is no way I'd buy a computer with a soldered in SSD. I have three laptops in our house and I have upgraded the hard drive in each one over the years. It is the number one upgrade to improve performance and provide necessary additional storage! If Apple wants to turn the Macbook Pro into an iPad then they need to charge iPad prices so we won't feel bad about upgrading more often. Thank goodness it's only soldered on the version with that stupid bar across the top.



Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: davester
Date: November 18, 2016 03:39PM
From a drive failure standpoint it would be better to have in a plug in SSD, but don't forget that the whole computer is solid state so our viewing of the drive as a separate mechanical component is becoming an obsolete concept that does not make that much sense any more. The lines have blurred between what the motherboard is and what the storage is.

Your point number 2 is not relevant in a world of simple and pervasive backups. There is absolutely no reason to pull a drive to "get data off" if you have a decent backup (or preferably two).



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/18/2016 03:40PM by davester.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: sekker
Date: November 18, 2016 03:41PM
Apple has added a port on the MoBo that might allow Apple to recover data from the ssd if the MoBo fails otherwise.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 18, 2016 04:02PM
Once word gets out to the general public that these new MBPs are not repairable, what effect will that have on sales? Not good, I should think.

/Mr Lynn
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Gareth
Date: November 18, 2016 04:12PM
Quote
mrlynn
Once word gets out to the general public that these new MBPs are not repairable, what effect will that have on sales? Not good, I should think.

I doubt it will have any effect since the general public isn't as likely to want to upgrade their storage.

I wonder if the decision to solder the SSD has something to do with Touch ID and data protection/integrity, since the non-touchbar 13 MBP still has a removable (albeit proprietary) SSD.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Racer X
Date: November 18, 2016 04:14PM
I very dislike expensive products that aren't repairable without extraordinary effort and cost.

I drive a 2013 car, but the ones I love are my almost 50 year old Buicks, because, I can fix them. Jeez, I can't even buy a manual for my 2013. None. NADA. Not even a factory service manual is available.

At least if it had an SD slot, you could put a massive card in it to keep your media files on.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/18/2016 04:22PM by Racer X.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: hal
Date: November 18, 2016 04:19PM
Yes, I most likely will at some point, but not new.

(1) If the drive fails you have to replace the entire motherboard. If it's no longer warranty or AppleCare, i.e. after one or three years, what will that cost?

More likely, the MOBO fails before the SSD. MOBO failure not covered after three years is also a totaled mac and we've been dealing with this since the beginning.

(2) If other components fail, you won't be able to take the drive out and run it in an enclosure to get the data off.

True, but if you aren't backing up, it's hard to sympathize.

(3) Drives do fail. What's the mean failure time for SSDs?

All reports are that the PCI SSDs and MOBO memory failure rate is very, very low.

My biggest problem with the current line is the need for adapters and the damned price.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: testcase
Date: November 18, 2016 04:22PM
No.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: sekker
Date: November 18, 2016 04:32PM
No, and it's not just me.

Walt Mossberg and Nilay Patel from The Verge are returning their MBP test units and are not buying new machines.

Walt has a new MBA in a box for when his current machine fails.

Nilay just doesn't see how the new machines solve top problems.

And that's BEFORE the data on lack of repairability was released.

We just ordered 3 new Macs - 2015 models - for work.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/18/2016 04:33PM by sekker.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Zoidberg
Date: November 18, 2016 04:36PM
I'll buy whatever the company I work with will pay for. They could care less about expandability.



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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: jdc
Date: November 18, 2016 04:49PM
Quote
mrlynn
Once word gets out to the general public that these new MBPs are not repairable, what effect will that have on sales? Not good, I should think.

/Mr Lynn

Only time will tell, but $10 says you are wrong. "regular" people, or maybe more "mac" buyers are in a different tax bracket. They pay for it.





Edited 999 time(s). Last edit at 12:08PM by jdc.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 18, 2016 04:58PM
Quote
davester
From a drive failure standpoint it would be better to have in a plug in SSD, but don't forget that the whole computer is solid state so our viewing of the drive as a separate mechanical component is becoming an obsolete concept that does not make that much sense any more. The lines have blurred between what the motherboard is and what the storage is.

A valid point, but assuming SSD failure is much more likely than motherboard failure, it seems to me the height of folly to make that component not separately replaceable.

Though I suppose if it's just a couple of soldered connections, a good technician could still replace the SSD.

Quote

Your point number 2 is not relevant in a world of simple and pervasive backups. There is absolutely no reason to pull a drive to "get data off" if you have a decent backup (or preferably two).

How many people, even heavy computer users, are conscientious about backing up regularly? In my experience, not many.

/Mr Lynn
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: DP
Date: November 18, 2016 05:17PM
How many people, even heavy computer users, are conscientious about backing up regularly? In my experience, not many.

If that's the case, then they deserve it. It's ridiculous not to back up, back up, back up. You're right tho that lots of folks don't. In my photo classes, I'm always surprised about the number of students who don't b/u their hard drives. I'd think it's taught in school from the time they start tapping on the keys.





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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: davester
Date: November 18, 2016 05:40PM
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
davester
From a drive failure standpoint it would be better to have in a plug in SSD, but don't forget that the whole computer is solid state so our viewing of the drive as a separate mechanical component is becoming an obsolete concept that does not make that much sense any more. The lines have blurred between what the motherboard is and what the storage is.

A valid point, but assuming SSD failure is much more likely than motherboard failure, it seems to me the height of folly to make that component not separately replaceable.

I don't think that's a good assumption. From what I've read, memory failure is fairly infrequent, whereas there are lots of other things on the motherboard that are much more likely to fail.

Quote
mrlynn
Quote
davester
Your point number 2 is not relevant in a world of simple and pervasive backups. There is absolutely no reason to pull a drive to "get data off" if you have a decent backup (or preferably two).

How many people, even heavy computer users, are conscientious about backing up regularly? In my experience, not many.

You must hang out with a different crowd than me. Most people I know understand that they need backups. When you first setup a mac there are easy ways to configure your backup (either through a local time machine drive or essential files on iCloud). Admittedly, most people I know only do iCloud and/or Flickr backups of their documents, photos, etc but that's good enough.



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 18, 2016 05:45PM
Quote
DP
How many people, even heavy computer users, are conscientious about backing up regularly? In my experience, not many.

If that's the case, then they deserve it. It's ridiculous not to back up, back up, back up. You're right tho that lots of folks don't. In my photo classes, I'm always surprised about the number of students who don't b/u their hard drives. I'd think it's taught in school from the time they start tapping on the keys.

Household computers are often here and there, not connected to external drives. You'd be surprised (well, maybe you wouldn't, but many would) how many people don't even know how to use Time Machine. The best strategy for such folk is a cloud backup that happens wirelessly and automatically, but how many have set that up? And of course, it costs money.

I think 'deserve it' is too strong.

/Mr Lynn



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/18/2016 05:46PM by mrlynn.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Lew Zealand
Date: November 18, 2016 06:46PM
Not for a while. I might pick up a used one in 4-5 years but if I'd get any current MacBook Pro, it would be a refurb 13" i5 or i7 one with F-keys and removable SSD.

The rest are too pricey for me in any case...
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: November 18, 2016 08:05PM
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."



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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: sekker
Date: November 18, 2016 08:18PM
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 18, 2016 08:26PM
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

Apple Care is good for only three years. After that, what? Many of us keep Macs much longer.

/Mr Lynn
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: November 18, 2016 08:30PM
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

I always buy AppleCare for my Macs.

And Time Machine backup drives. And I'll set it up for network-backups.

I don't see that much of anything would be different with a new 15-inch MBP, except that it's gonna be much faster in every meaningful way, and it'll be lighter and it'll have a nicer screen.



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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: sekker
Date: November 18, 2016 08:35PM
Quote
Onamuji
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

I always buy AppleCare for my Macs.

And Time Machine backup drives. And I'll set it up for network-backups.

I don't see that much of anything would be different with a new 15-inch MBP, except that it's gonna be much faster in every meaningful way, and it'll be lighter and it'll have a nicer screen.

And more dongles...

I agree that the new 15" is not THAT much worse than the original MBPR15 with glued-in battery. You cannot fix this machine except for the SSD anyway.

For me, the absolute biggest disappointment with the new models is the substantively poorer battery life. Might not matter so much with the 15" model, but it's a deal-killer for me for any 13" machine. I am looking for at least 8 hour run-time for use on the road (airplane) and on the go (science conferences).
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: November 18, 2016 08:49PM
Quote
sekker
And more dongles...

Yes, but I don't foresee that becoming annoying.

More dongles in the bins in my closet and likely two more in my bag. But I stock up on new dongles every year for new tech. Nothing new about that.

For the desktop, perhaps one more dongle than otherwise -- the Thunderbolt-2 adapter.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/18/2016 08:51PM by Onamuji.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Acer
Date: November 18, 2016 11:06PM
Considering the proprietary options on my current MBPr are so expensive since they have to be reverse engineered, it might as well be soldered on. So, in a way, I already have purchased a MPB with soldered SSD.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: OWC Larry
Date: November 19, 2016 01:15AM
(1) I would disagree - we have encountered a very large market for replacement SSDs already for 2013 to 2015 models. We originally planned on only 480GB and 1TB model SSDs for PCIe - but dealers and service providers especially requested the 240GB for a lower cost option to service systems with failed SSDs. When you're replacing a failed, stock Apple 128/256GB and that was enough, you don't want to spend more than you have to for the unplanned event. None the less - especially with the smaller drives that will have a heavier write load as a percentage of total storage - going to see SSDs dying sooner than logic boards.. never mind 256GB just not being enough (512GB , imho, should have been the min offered on these 'Pro' models).

(2) - not that simple. - crap happens and often at the worst time. On a 5 hour flight the wife of the passenger next to me flopped into him and he proceeded to spill his water across my Macbook pro. I flipped it, shut it down, and started planning while shaking water out/off. I would have lost, as I recall it all, a good 3+ hours of work including that at the airport that was not backed up if that system was cooked and the drive was soldered. But - as it would be, I was already planning for finding a replacement when I landed of the same year/line to swap the SSD into and be back where I left off. I was lucky, the water didn't get down into anything and had no loss of function, but this being just a couple months after the MacBook 12" (first with soldered) came out, this scenario forever noted. And even if I had a backup and the solution was to restore -that would have taken many extra hours of down time vs. what I could do with a simple drive swap.

Crap happens - and it's always nice to have options... the soldered drive takes a lot of options away and certainly imposes a much higher pain upon those that aren't good backing up to begin with.

#3 - Very low is relative. If it's your book that has the failure, doesn't matter what the average is. Is there any other $2600 and up laptop that effectively is a doorstop if any one of a number of failures occurs? Completely non upgradeable? Is there a non-Apple laptop over $1000 that meets that?

Either way - Apple should sell a boat load of AppleCare...and to that note... I'd never buy one of these without also buying AppleCare.


Quote
hal
Yes, I most likely will at some point, but not new.

(1) If the drive fails you have to replace the entire motherboard. If it's no longer warranty or AppleCare, i.e. after one or three years, what will that cost?

More likely, the MOBO fails before the SSD. MOBO failure not covered after three years is also a totaled mac and we've been dealing with this since the beginning.

(2) If other components fail, you won't be able to take the drive out and run it in an enclosure to get the data off.

True, but if you aren't backing up, it's hard to sympathize.

(3) Drives do fail. What's the mean failure time for SSDs?

All reports are that the PCI SSDs and MOBO memory failure rate is very, very low.

My biggest problem with the current line is the need for adapters and the damned price.



OWC Larry
Other World Computing
[www.macsales.com]
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Bill in NC
Date: November 19, 2016 10:06AM
right now most (excepting liquid damage) can get a "depot repair" of your out-of-warranty Mac laptop for a few hundred bucks.

doubt it will be that cheap for models where the SSD is soldered to the motherboard.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: bfd
Date: November 19, 2016 04:31PM
It's been here since Wednesday, and so far it's great. Purchased AC with AMEX, so the appliance is covered for 4 years.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 19, 2016 06:48PM
Quote
Bill in NC
right now most (excepting liquid damage) can get a "depot repair" of your out-of-warranty Mac laptop for a few hundred bucks.

doubt it will be that cheap for models where the SSD is soldered to the motherboard.

Right. Doubtful if Apple will replace mobo+SSD for $300 (last 'depot' mobo replacement we got at an Apple Store).

Larry: Any chance the soldered connections are easy enough to open and re-solder so OWC could offer a mail-in SSD replacement for a reasonable fee?

/Mr Lynn
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: OWC Larry
Date: November 20, 2016 12:22AM
The probability is exceptionally low - and it's not an easy remove and replace process + controller is another embedded piece.

Quote
mrlynn
Quote
Bill in NC
right now most (excepting liquid damage) can get a "depot repair" of your out-of-warranty Mac laptop for a few hundred bucks.

doubt it will be that cheap for models where the SSD is soldered to the motherboard.

Right. Doubtful if Apple will replace mobo+SSD for $300 (last 'depot' mobo replacement we got at an Apple Store).

Larry: Any chance the soldered connections are easy enough to open and re-solder so OWC could offer a mail-in SSD replacement for a reasonable fee?

/Mr Lynn



OWC Larry
Other World Computing
[www.macsales.com]
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 20, 2016 06:50AM
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

Apple Care is good for only three years. After that, what? Many of us keep Macs much longer.

/Mr Lynn

Omanuji: You didn't answer the question.

/Mr Lynn
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: November 20, 2016 09:28AM
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

Apple Care is good for only three years. After that, what? Many of us keep Macs much longer.

/Mr Lynn

Omanuji: You didn't answer the question.

/Mr Lynn

Thought it was rhetorical.

After that, I use it until it dies or something better comes along and I hand it down to my brother.

...Just like I've done with most of my Macs since the 1980s.

...Keeping in mind that I'm not silly enough to buy a modern Mac laptop with the base-specs. It'll be 16GB/1TB/Radeon 460.



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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: sekker
Date: November 20, 2016 11:43AM
Quote
Onamuji
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

Apple Care is good for only three years. After that, what? Many of us keep Macs much longer.

/Mr Lynn

Omanuji: You didn't answer the question.

/Mr Lynn

Thought it was rhetorical.

After that, I use it until it dies or something better comes along and I hand it down to my brother.

...Just like I've done with most of my Macs since the 1980s.

...Keeping in mind that I'm not silly enough to buy a modern Mac laptop with the base-specs. It'll be 16GB/1TB/Radeon 460.

Plus $349 for Apple Care on that machine. That comes to $3648 plus tax, without any of the accessory dongles etc.

Note: Apple Care is still $249 list for the new 13" (and 2015 13") models.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/20/2016 11:46AM by sekker.
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: November 20, 2016 11:58AM
Quote
sekker
Plus $349 for Apple Care on that machine. That comes to $3648 plus tax, without any of the accessory dongles etc.

Note: Apple Care is still $249 list for the new 13" (and 2015 13") models.

I've already purchased the dongles. Needed them for work and couldn't wait for our purchasing guy to order some.

I can wait for a refurb and I get AppleCare at wholesale.



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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 20, 2016 12:48PM
Quote
Onamuji
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

Apple Care is good for only three years. After that, what? Many of us keep Macs much longer.

/Mr Lynn

Omanuji: You didn't answer the question.

/Mr Lynn

Thought it was rhetorical.

After that, I use it until it dies or something better comes along and I hand it down to my brother.

...Just like I've done with most of my Macs since the 1980s.

...Keeping in mind that I'm not silly enough to buy a modern Mac laptop with the base-specs. It'll be 16GB/1TB/Radeon 460.

No, it wasn't rhetorical. It was the point of the post. Many, many Mac users, even a good number here, keep their computers as long as they will run and can be repaired or updated.

Does it make sense for those of us who are not IT guys to buy a computer you can't repair or update after three years?

/Mr Lynn
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: November 20, 2016 04:13PM
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
Onamuji
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
mrlynn
Quote
sekker
Quote
Onamuji
> Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?

Having had some more time on the new 15-inch MBP, my answer is an unequivocal "yes."

And I guarantee you will be buying Apple Care.

Apple Care is good for only three years. After that, what? Many of us keep Macs much longer.

/Mr Lynn

Omanuji: You didn't answer the question.

/Mr Lynn

Thought it was rhetorical.

After that, I use it until it dies or something better comes along and I hand it down to my brother.

...Just like I've done with most of my Macs since the 1980s.

...Keeping in mind that I'm not silly enough to buy a modern Mac laptop with the base-specs. It'll be 16GB/1TB/Radeon 460.

No, it wasn't rhetorical. It was the point of the post. Many, many Mac users, even a good number here, keep their computers as long as they will run and can be repaired or updated.

Does it make sense for those of us who are not IT guys to buy a computer you can't repair or update after three years?

The original Retina MBP had similar issues. Whether the drive was removable or not, it was unique and the RAM was soldered to the board. 3rd party SSD replacements took a couple of years to show up and in the meantime it wasn't very clear what would happen if you needed a repair.

People bought them anyway.

If you want to look at comparable PC laptops... Well, there are none. Apple's SSDs mop the floor with them and nobody else has four Thunderbolt 3 ports in a lightweight portable.

Dell XPS 13 is the one that most people mention as a direct competitor... A pretty slow SSD. Light on RAM, short on ports. No Thunderbolt. And ooops! RAM is soldered to the logic board. Positioned better as a MacBook Air alternative.

You like Macs? You do anything with graphics or video? You buy the 15-inch Pro and learn to live with that darned super-fast SSD and the amazing graphics chip that can power six displays and the fact that you're likely to replace it in 5 years instead of 6 or 7 years.



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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: fauch
Date: November 21, 2016 05:56AM
Do they still have a headphone jack?? Does it plug into mains electricity or do I need special electric sockets in my house or adapters???
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: mrlynn
Date: November 21, 2016 07:08AM
Quote
Omanuji
. . . You like Macs? You do anything with graphics or video? You buy the 15-inch Pro and learn to live with that darned super-fast SSD and the amazing graphics chip that can power six displays and the fact that you're likely to replace it in 5 years instead of 6 or 7 years.

Sorta like buying a car with a non-replaceable engine, right?

Well, the chances of my being able to afford the high-end 15" are not very great unless down the road I trade my about-to-be-7-year-old 27" iMac and 13" MBP for a single 2016 15" MBP, and use it for both desktop and travel.

(Or, when refurbs become available I can get the non-touch-bar 13" and that does have a replaceable SSD, albeit a proprietary one that will be expensive. And then replace the iMac with a newer one—do they still have replaceable drives?)

Opinion so far on this thread seems to be against buying a laptop with a soldered-in drive.

/Mr Lynn
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Re: Will You Buy a MacBook Pro with a Soldered-on SSD?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: November 21, 2016 06:45PM
Quote
mrlynn
Well, the chances of my being able to afford the high-end 15" are not very great unless down the road I trade my about-to-be-7-year-old 27" iMac and 13" MBP for a single 2016 15" MBP, and use it for both desktop and travel.

The current 13-inch is not all that faster than the last-gen. If I were in the market for a 13-inch MBP, I would not be in a hurry to buy it.

...But my 2008 MBP and mini are feeling long in the tooth (for lack of fast network/USB/TB connectivity as both devices have SSDs) and I will likely dock the MBP as a replacement for both.



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