advertisement
Forums

The Forum is sponsored by 
 

AAPL stock: Click Here

You are currently viewing the Tips and Deals forum
Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: wave rider
Date: May 22, 2019 08:49PM
When you got your plug-in, did it bump your electricity bill much?

Neighbor got a Tesla and the landlord complained that it bumped the bill by $300/month. Does that sound right? Sounds more expensive than a gas engine…

Thanks for your thoughts.



=wr=
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: May 22, 2019 08:59PM
Quote
wave rider
Neighbor got a Tesla and the landlord complained that it bumped the bill by $300/month. Does that sound right? Sounds more expensive than a gas engine…

Thanks for your thoughts.

Implausible, but possible.

It's potentially as expensive as a gas engine or even more expensive.

From what I hear, for the average driver it can add anywhere from $20 to $100 per month depending upon location. More in some locations where electricity is especially expensive like parts of California. Less where electricity is cheap.

...I have heard of some aggressive drivers racking up $200/month bills.

...Some electric companies offer an electric car discount. Might inquire about that.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: graylocks
Date: May 22, 2019 09:21PM
my budget billing went up about $12 a month for my Volt. Volt uses about 10Kw per full charge. most days i only depleted about halfway. rates here in my part of GA are about $0.06 per Kwh. i measure this against the $150 a month i formerly spent on gas.

so how many watts does a Tesla pull, how far on average does your friend deplete the battery and what are rates like? compute those parameters and see if the landlord is exaggerating or not.



"Success isn't about how much money you make. It is about the difference you make in people's lives."--Michelle Obama



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/22/2019 09:22PM by graylocks.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: May 22, 2019 09:21PM
.....the universe is balanced.....you to take from here.........it goes there......conservation of......



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: Rolando
Date: May 22, 2019 09:41PM
Most places charge different rates at different times. Is the Tesla owner charging overnight, when rates are usually lowest?



San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

"I don’t want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it." - Billy Graham 1981

"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: JoeH
Date: May 22, 2019 09:51PM
Besides time of day rates, some places have rates based on the peak instantaneous usage. Depending on the charger draw, conceivably it could have pushed the electric bill into a higher rate. But I suspect the landlord is either exageratiing or attributing all of an increase to the Tesla when there are multiple causes.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: vision63
Date: May 22, 2019 10:03PM
Quote
JoeH
Besides time of day rates, some places have rates based on the peak instantaneous usage. Depending on the charger draw, conceivably it could have pushed the electric bill into a higher rate. But I suspect the landlord is either exageratiing or attributing all of an increase to the Tesla when there are multiple causes.

landlord
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: mattkime
Date: May 22, 2019 10:14PM
landlord.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: Racer X
Date: May 22, 2019 10:48PM
possible, but not likely. biggest tesla 3 battery is@74KwH, so that times 30 times the electric rate is worst case from a flat battery every night. That is also about 9 thousand miles a month........
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: wave rider
Date: May 22, 2019 11:15PM
Sarcany, good thought about EV rates, looks like PG&E has those.

Graylocks, I think the rate here is $0.156/kWh. (Rolls eyes)

Initially, neighbor was using 110v charging all sorts of hours. A Tesla charger was installed, I think he is using off hours now. I am wondering if the Tesla charger still uses electricity when not plugged into the car, its led stays on.

Three of the residences on the property seem to be on the same meter. All three just paid rent since we cannot subdivide the utility bill accurately. Landlord wants to charge Tesla neighbor more and now he wants me and the other neighbor to start paying utilities. Single meter is still an issue to me. I like the Tesla neighbor a lot, just not interested in subsidizing his Tesla.

PG&E does offer a separate meter for the charger, that may be a solution.

Thanks for everyone’s thoughts.



=wr=



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/22/2019 11:17PM by wave rider.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: ztirffritz
Date: May 22, 2019 11:27PM
I have two Chevy Volts. Mine have approximately 14kWh each. But in reality, they're only consuming about 2-3kWh/day. My electric bill went up about $15-20. If your neighbor is driving 200miles/day and charging it every night from near 0 charge to full, it's possible. A model 3 has a 50-60kWh battery. I doubt that it really went up that much though.



**************************************
MacResource User Map: [www.zeemaps.com]#



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/23/2019 07:36AM by ztirffritz.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: GGD
Date: May 22, 2019 11:31PM
The way PG&E's rates typically work, there's a baseline allocation and a low rate per kWh, then a higher rate for usage above that baseline and an even higher rate for much higher usage.

[www.pge.com]

Having 3 residences on one meter means that the baseline, which assumes a single residence, will be exceeded much faster, and you'll have much of your usage in the second tier pricing. The addition of the Tesla might have pushed you into the "High Usage Surcharge" rates, so all of that additional usage will be at a very high cost per kWh.

You really need to see the bills and the usage before and after the Tesla, and what's the highest rate tier you're getting charged.

Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: mattkime
Date: May 22, 2019 11:32PM
You might be able to look up the utility usage of the property online. You can do that where I live.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: Speedy
Date: May 22, 2019 11:59PM
See the bills.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: wave rider
Date: May 23, 2019 12:46AM
GGD, great info! You are onto something.

Will have to see if I can view the bills. Haven’t paid a utility bill in over twenty years now. Rent for sure.



=wr=
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: space-time
Date: May 23, 2019 06:01AM
gas here is $2.80 (give or take) and my chevy volt is supposed to get 34 or so MPG. I think I actually get less, but let's use the official numbers. So $2.80/34=0.082, so a mile costs me 8.2 cents on Gas.

the battery has 10.8 kWh, and 1 kWh is about 17 cents here (12 cents generation and 5 cents distribution). In summer I get as much as 40 miles, in winter as low as 20, but average is somewhere around 32

A full charge costs me $1.82 ($1 less than a gallon of gas) and I get about the same mileage. On electric mode a mile costs me 5.7 cents

EDIT; if I were to drive 1000 miles/month, I would use $57 worth of electricity, or $82 worth of gas, or a combination of these. Bonus us that most of the electric charge is free (L2 charger at work)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/23/2019 07:51AM by space-time.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: dad@home
Date: May 23, 2019 06:53AM
Real world example:

I have had a Tesla Model S85D for 4 years and have driven 103,000 miles.

The car’s consumption has been 308Wh/mile (the car keeps track).

Total consumption over 4 years is 103,000 x 308 = 31,724,000 Wh or 31,724kWh.

I get my power from Avista who charges a flat rate of just under 10 cents per kWh.

So 31,724 kWh x 0.1$/kWh = $3172 for 4 years and 103,000 miles. About $66 extra electricity per month.

This car replaced a Ford Freestyle that got about 25mpg.

103,000mi x 1/25mpg = 4120 gallons of gas.

Using $3/gal for regular means

4120 gal x $3/gal =$12,360.

So i’ve saved $9188 over 4 years with a car that doesn’t need oil changes, new mufflers, tune ups, or brake jobs.

If your power rate is higher your savings will be less.

Best car I’ve ever owned.

John



For some must watch, while some must sleep
So runs the world away



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/23/2019 08:20AM by dad@home.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: May 23, 2019 07:23AM
Quote
dad@home
If your power rate is higher your savings will be less.

If your cost for a gallon of gas is higher, your savings will be greater.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: May 23, 2019 09:16AM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
dad@home
If your power rate is higher your savings will be less.

If your cost for a gallon of gas is higher, your savings will be greater.

I drive a hybrid. Changes things up considerably.

Using the same sort of calculation...

I fill up every 3 weeks or so. 11 gallons at $3 per gallon... $33x17 = $561 per year or $2244 over 4 years.

That's cheaper than charging the Tesla.

...Actually, it's WAY cheaper than charging the Tesla. My power company charges about 40% more than dad@home's and offers no discounts for off-peak usage or electric cars.

I'd need a solar charger to make it affordable, but then I'd be absorbing the cost of the solar installation... and my power company has effectively outlawed home-solar installations so that's moot.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: Ken Sp.
Date: May 23, 2019 09:16AM
Before I got lots of solar panels, my obscenely high PG&E rates, yielded 3.3¢ per mile charging after 11:00PM when the rates go down to 12¢/KWh from peak of 49¢/KWh
The nearby, ratepayer owned SMUD utility calculates out to around 2¢ per mile.
Driving nearly 30,000/year, I was spending $425-$475/month for gas. Before solar, I was paying $80-$100/month of additional electricity.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: May 23, 2019 09:59AM
.....does this apply to hair plug-ins too.....??



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: wave rider
Date: May 23, 2019 10:25AM
Does the Tesla charger use energy when not plugged into the car?



=wr=
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: ztirffritz
Date: May 23, 2019 10:31AM
Quote
wave rider
Does the Tesla charger use energy when not plugged into the car?

No. We'll maybe a minuscule amount for the LED light on the front, but that's fractions of a cent per month.



**************************************
MacResource User Map: [www.zeemaps.com]#
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: mikebw
Date: May 23, 2019 10:56AM
At least with the Nissan Leaf, I have read that you can schedule the car itself for when you want it to charge, so you just plug it in and then once your rates are low (assuming they drop for overnight) you can have it automatically charge up, and you can also set to what level you want it to charge to.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: graylocks
Date: May 23, 2019 11:09AM
Quote
mikebw
At least with the Nissan Leaf, I have read that you can schedule the car itself for when you want it to charge, so you just plug it in and then once your rates are low (assuming they drop for overnight) you can have it automatically charge up, and you can also set to what level you want it to charge to.

you can also schedule with a Volt so i'd be really shocked if a Tesla couldn't do this.



"Success isn't about how much money you make. It is about the difference you make in people's lives."--Michelle Obama
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: May 23, 2019 11:38AM
Quote
graylocks
Quote
mikebw
At least with the Nissan Leaf, I have read that you can schedule the car itself for when you want it to charge, so you just plug it in and then once your rates are low (assuming they drop for overnight) you can have it automatically charge up, and you can also set to what level you want it to charge to.

you can also schedule with a Volt so i'd be really shocked if a Tesla couldn't do this.

Absolutely the Tesla can do this as well.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: freeradical
Date: May 23, 2019 01:44PM
How does depreciation expense on the battery figure in to the picture?
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: Ken Sp.
Date: May 23, 2019 02:52PM
Quote
freeradical
How does depreciation expense on the battery figure in to the picture?

Battery degradation in the Tesla is minimal. In my first 30,000 miles, the battery degraded 3%, in the last 35,000 miles it has degraded about 0.1% more. I’ve lost about 1 mile of my 280 mile range.

Many 200,000 mile cars have 6-8% degradation.
The newer cells in the Model 3 appear to be doing even better.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Question for plug-in car users…
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: May 23, 2019 03:44PM
Three of the residences on the property seem to be on the same meter.

Wow, I don't know that I'd be happy with that starting from Day One.

It sounds like the landlord just wants more money, since he wants everyone to pay utilities.

But if I was on a 'party-line' meter and somebody got an EV, I certainly wouldn't want to be paying for their lifestyle.

I wonder what PG&E wants for installing a meter for the charger. That something the landlord should require of the Tesla owner, and not punish everybody else.

But like I said, he probably sees this as an increased income opportunity, as well as not wanting to eat the excess charges.

With a Tesla charger the neighbor should be able to charge off peak much of his charging time.






I am that Masked Man.

Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

I've been to the edge of the map, and there be monsters.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody counts or nobody counts.

When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men except
by believing all possible evil of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login

Online Users

Guests: 106
Record Number of Users: 186 on February 20, 2020
Record Number of Guests: 5122 on October 03, 2020