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Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Ammo
Date: April 11, 2020 05:18PM
My car hasn’t been washed since the highway department stopped using road salt this winter so I finally decided to stop in at the car wash. I had to pay inside, so I was waiting in line (5-6’ distance) when another customer about the same distance away coughed. He tried to use his sleeve but was only partially successful. He then walked past everyone who was already in line to take his place at the end of the line. Thing is, his cough wasn’t just a clear the throat kind of cough, it was a loose in the chest type of cough. I feel so stupid because I’ve been so careful about staying healthy to this point. Of course, having this happen while I was doing something as unnecessary as a car wash doesn’t help, either.

Maybe I’m overreacting, but I wish I’d been smarter about this.



Where is there dignity unless there is also honesty? - Cicero
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: AllGold
Date: April 11, 2020 05:33PM
Did he smell of cigarette smoke?
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Speedy
Date: April 11, 2020 05:40PM
Covid is supposedly a dry cough. The cougher probably tilted his head down to aim for his elbow so you may find most droplets were headed for the floor. Worry more about someone who sneezes- more velocity, more distance.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: space-time
Date: April 11, 2020 05:40PM
Hope you are over-reacting, but really, avoid further non essential trips.

1) maybe he was not infected
2) if he was infected, maybe you didn't catch it (l know some head of state who had lunch and took photos with two people who later tested positive and he is OK)
3) if you got it, you could be asymptotic or you could have a mild form. PLEASE STAY ISOLATED FOR 14 DAYS.
4) if you do get sick and need hospitalization, hope that is after the peak is gone in your area and you get good medical care

but let's hope #3 and #4 never happen. Let's hope for #1.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2020 05:41PM by space-time.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: space-time
Date: April 11, 2020 05:51PM
BTW were you wearing any mask?
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: hal
Date: April 11, 2020 06:09PM
Around here hay fever is starting up...
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Speedy
Date: April 11, 2020 06:12PM
Self-quarantine for 14 days in your private room with meals left on the floor by the door.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 11, 2020 06:15PM
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C. While the evidence for it doing anything for COVID is lacking, it has been used to try to defend against other viruses (influenza in particular) and unlikely it could do much harm, if not used at high dose for an extended period. (And plus it might help you keep healthy if it was something else, like a regular cold or the flu.)

Edit: plus of course the self-quarantining recommended by others.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2020 06:56PM by PeterB.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: mattkime
Date: April 11, 2020 06:23PM
Eh, the number of people with a cough that also have vivid is still very low.



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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: norse
Date: April 11, 2020 07:08PM
Always wear a mask when you go to public places and don't touch your face.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 11, 2020 07:24PM
Quote
PeterB
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C...

The doses they use against infection are extremely high and performed intravenously. There is also no evidence that it works.

The same doses are used against some forms of cancer and there's a tiny little bit of evidence that it might be helpful in combination with chemo.

To provide some idea of how high these doses are: If I had cancer, the recommended dose for treatment would come to 136,000mg and any beneficial effect would not last a day.

You're recommending a placebo.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2020 07:25PM by Sarcany.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 11, 2020 08:18PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C...

The doses they use against infection are extremely high and performed intravenously. There is also no evidence that it works.

The same doses are used against some forms of cancer and there's a tiny little bit of evidence that it might be helpful in combination with chemo.

To provide some idea of how high these doses are: If I had cancer, the recommended dose for treatment would come to 136,000mg and any beneficial effect would not last a day.

You're recommending a placebo.

Perhaps, but there may be value in a placebo. Also, the literature suggests that the regular (mega)doses may be useful, at least against influenza, and possibly other viruses:

[pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

[pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov]

and more specific to our current situation: [academic.oup.com]




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Ammo
Date: April 11, 2020 08:25PM
Quote
space-time
BTW were you wearing any mask?

No. Ironically, we received 2 hand-made masks in the mail from my daughter 2 days ago, but our policy has been to wait 3 days before handling any letters or packages. However, it’s my understanding that these types of cloth masks don’t protest the user anyway.



Where is there dignity unless there is also honesty? - Cicero



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2020 08:27PM by Ammo.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Grateful11
Date: April 11, 2020 08:30PM
Stay well my friend! I think you'll be fine.



Grateful11
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: AllGold
Date: April 11, 2020 09:07PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C...

The doses they use against infection are extremely high and performed intravenously. There is also no evidence that it works.

The same doses are used against some forms of cancer and there's a tiny little bit of evidence that it might be helpful in combination with chemo.

To provide some idea of how high these doses are: If I had cancer, the recommended dose for treatment would come to 136,000mg and any beneficial effect would not last a day.

You're recommending a placebo.

Probably, but 1000mg a day doesn't do any harm.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: April 11, 2020 09:26PM
.....no use in worrying about 'what might be'......take one day at a time....quarantine just in case and see if you develop any symptoms.....you want to protect your family 1st.....see what happens as the days go by.....



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2020 09:28PM by NewtonMP2100.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: sekker
Date: April 11, 2020 09:38PM
Isolate, get sleep and some exercise.

Keep an eye out for symptoms, especially loss of taste or smell.

I had a bad case of allergies recently, and I was quite sneezy. So don't worry about one symptom.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: sunfalcon
Date: April 11, 2020 09:42PM
Yes, it's allergy season as well. I went outside and coughed...had a phlemy cough and then I looked around to see if anyone was out there and heard me. It's crazy. Those of us with allergies are screwed...lol. Hopefully, you are fine!
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: RgrF
Date: April 11, 2020 10:01PM
Quote
sunfalcon
I went outside and coughed...had a phlemy cough and then I looked around to see if anyone was out there and heard me. It's crazy.
^^^^^ This.

I have a more or less permanent cough that stems from a sinus condition. Went out for the first time in three weeks yesterday and boy did I notice that cough, something I've taken for granted for years. Immediately became apprehensive of what the reaction of those within hearing distance might be, so I cut it short and went home.

Shortly after while at home my doctor called* to make sure I understood what I should do in general and that I was in a group that should not leave home even if dressed in a hazmat suit. Something I kinda' already knew.

*first time he's ever called me without a prompt, can't tell you how surprised I was and grateful I am to have a man like this overseeing my well-being.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: sekker
Date: April 11, 2020 10:12PM
PS I have had a low level chronic cough since I was 24 or so. I scared someone early in the work day before the stay at home order - they were really frightened, and I hadn't noticed since it was just my 'morning cough'.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 11, 2020 10:55PM
Quote
AllGold
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C...

The doses they use against infection are extremely high and performed intravenously. There is also no evidence that it works.

The same doses are used against some forms of cancer and there's a tiny little bit of evidence that it might be helpful in combination with chemo.

To provide some idea of how high these doses are: If I had cancer, the recommended dose for treatment would come to 136,000mg and any beneficial effect would not last a day.

You're recommending a placebo.

Probably, but 1000mg a day doesn't do any harm.

Can eat a hole in your stomach and is known to grow cancer tumors quite effectively, retarding the body's natural defenses against cancer.

Harm enough?



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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: deckeda
Date: April 11, 2020 11:01PM
Many of us have had, or will have encounters we later wish we had not. But at some point, even if infected you have to let yourself off the hook.

Why? Because there have been so many that didn't consider the risk at all. On several levels, you have. We can argue about non-essential trips and so on, but none of this will be perfect.

I committed my own sin today. I was out cutting some brush away when a stranger was near, searching the creek for arrow heads. (Like 40 feet away, no cough or whatever). Right before she left she handed me one and I accepted. Our encounter was brief, shorter than the time yesterday spent accepting a cardboard box from the postal worker.

In both instances I washed my hands and the objects, but really, how imperfect is that still, when you're literally ignoring distancing? I'll do better tomorrow ... which is a LOT more than some people can say.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 11, 2020 11:19PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
AllGold
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C...

The doses they use against infection are extremely high and performed intravenously. There is also no evidence that it works.

The same doses are used against some forms of cancer and there's a tiny little bit of evidence that it might be helpful in combination with chemo.

To provide some idea of how high these doses are: If I had cancer, the recommended dose for treatment would come to 136,000mg and any beneficial effect would not last a day.

You're recommending a placebo.

Probably, but 1000mg a day doesn't do any harm.

Can eat a hole in your stomach and is known to grow cancer tumors quite effectively, retarding the body's natural defenses against cancer.

Harm enough?

Huh? High dose vitamin C may have some use in treating cancer: [www.cancer.gov]




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2020 11:21PM by PeterB.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: deckeda
Date: April 11, 2020 11:27PM
When I take a high-dose vitamin C pill, most of it gets pissed away. As in, you have yellow pee. But let's say it helps some cancer patients feel better. That's not in any way comparable to say, a cure or prevention.

The topic was viral avoidance/protection as it relates to the immune system, and there remans zero evidence it would do anything here, or there.

Look Peter, we already can't take a @#$%& because of the TP situation. You want OJ to cost $50 a jar?
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 11, 2020 11:54PM
Quote
PeterB
Huh? High dose vitamin C may have some use in treating cancer: [www.cancer.gov]

Yes, but that's high-dose IV vitamin C. It has a different effect, pro-oxidative vs anti-oxidative.

In a supplement, it can prevent chemo from working and can also grow cancers.

[www.webmd.com]

Antioxidants in general appear to accelerate cancer progression because they destroy free radicals.

Our bodies attack cancer cells using free radicals.

[www.bbc.com]

[www.webmd.com]

[careoncology.com]

And also...
[www.sciencedaily.com]



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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Diana
Date: April 12, 2020 12:33AM
Quote
PeterB
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
AllGold
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C...

The doses they use against infection are extremely high and performed intravenously. There is also no evidence that it works.

The same doses are used against some forms of cancer and there's a tiny little bit of evidence that it might be helpful in combination with chemo.

To provide some idea of how high these doses are: If I had cancer, the recommended dose for treatment would come to 136,000mg and any beneficial effect would not last a day.

You're recommending a placebo.

Probably, but 1000mg a day doesn't do any harm.

Can eat a hole in your stomach and is known to grow cancer tumors quite effectively, retarding the body's natural defenses against cancer.

Harm enough?

Huh? High dose vitamin C may have some use in treating cancer: [www.cancer.gov]

The key term is "may" and is usually considered a "weasel" type word in that the author doesn't know for sure but he thinks it merits further investigation.

Sorry, but the link doesn't say that it is used in the treatment of cancer, but it has been used in conjunction with the cancer fighting drugs. Some can tolerate it, and some cannot. The studies they cited show a mixed bag of results, from the cancers grew, to they didn't grow, but nowhere did they say that the vitamin C itself caused the cancers to shrink. Some found that their treatments were easier to tolerate with its use. At best, the vitamin C allowed the patients a bit of a better quality of life, possibly due to its antioxidant effect, but that is a surmise on my part.

The taking of vitamin C and zinc and whatever else nutritional supplements to slow/stop/prevent colds or the flu has not found to be effective. I know, anecdotally we hear about it all the time, but double blind randomized placebo-controlled trials of this same issue have not shown the same promise. I truly wish it had.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Diana
Date: April 12, 2020 12:45AM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
Huh? High dose vitamin C may have some use in treating cancer: [www.cancer.gov]

Yes, but that's high-dose IV vitamin C. It has a different effect, pro-oxidative vs anti-oxidative.

In a supplement, it can prevent chemo from working and can also grow cancers.

[www.webmd.com]

Antioxidants in general appear to accelerate cancer progression because they destroy free radicals.

Our bodies attack cancer cells using free radicals.

[www.bbc.com]

[www.webmd.com]

[careoncology.com]

And also...
[www.sciencedaily.com]

True enough. Free radicals, which everyone seems to have freaked out about, really are necessary. Additionally, the body has systems in place to absorb/kill the excess and any unneeded free radicals. The excessive use of additional antioxidant can prevent normal functioning. I'm not saying WILL, but rather CAN.

Diana

PS. Thanks, Sarcany.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: freeradical
Date: April 12, 2020 02:44AM
Hey, who's talking about me?

In a Linus Pauling thread no less!
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: RgrF
Date: April 12, 2020 04:30AM
So now you're truly radicalized?
Probably not, huh?
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Racer X
Date: April 12, 2020 06:15AM
Quote
PeterB
For those who think they may have been exposed, I've been suggesting taking high dose vitamin C. While the evidence for it doing anything for COVID is lacking, it has been used to try to defend against other viruses (influenza in particular) and unlikely it could do much harm, if not used at high dose for an extended period. (And plus it might help you keep healthy if it was something else, like a regular cold or the flu.)

Edit: plus of course the self-quarantining recommended by others.

Vit C is one of the water soluble nutrients. What you can't absorb, you pee out. As such, you need it regularly. So I suspect it is hard to overdose at a toxic level. However Sodium Ascorbate, one of the forms of Vit C does contain sodium. That could be a problem.



********************************************
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The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 12, 2020 09:12AM
Quote
Diana
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
Huh? High dose vitamin C may have some use in treating cancer: [www.cancer.gov]

Yes, but that's high-dose IV vitamin C. It has a different effect, pro-oxidative vs anti-oxidative.

In a supplement, it can prevent chemo from working and can also grow cancers.

[www.webmd.com]

Antioxidants in general appear to accelerate cancer progression because they destroy free radicals.

Our bodies attack cancer cells using free radicals.

[www.bbc.com]

[www.webmd.com]

[careoncology.com]

And also...
[www.sciencedaily.com]

True enough. Free radicals, which everyone seems to have freaked out about, really are necessary. Additionally, the body has systems in place to absorb/kill the excess and any unneeded free radicals. The excessive use of additional antioxidant can prevent normal functioning. I'm not saying WILL, but rather CAN.

Diana

PS. Thanks, Sarcany.

Isn't can also a weasel word? grinning smiley

And I'm looking at the Pubmed articles ... I would say the majority favor vitamin C for anticancer / antiviral effects (yes, I am aware it depends both on dose and form/route of administration). Yes, there are also publications going the other way too, or saying that it has no effect at all. And I could have linked to other websites, but I thought cancer.gov would have been the most credible ... certainly more credible than webmd or sciencedaily.

I'm not offended, but again ... I would suggest anyone interested, look at the primary, peer-reviewed literature ... while it's not for certain that it works, it does seem, on balance, that it is doing something.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 12, 2020 10:36AM
Quote
PeterB
I'm not offended, but again ... I would suggest anyone interested, look at the primary, peer-reviewed literature ... while it's not for certain that it works, it does seem, on balance, that it is doing something.

There's a whole lot of money being made in the vitamin racket, resulting in an effective disinformation campaign against factual reporting on the benefits and liabilities of vitamin supplements. Even some otherwise intelligent physicians buy into the quackery.

Unfortunately, due to its very nature, pubmed is not a reliable source in and of itself. It contains a lot of articles and citations to "predatory" and fake journals and a lot of the stuff published there has not been peer-reviewed.

I think that you'll find that reputable studies do come out against vitamin supplements in general, and Selenium, A, B, E, and C specifically.

Other supplements have little or no effect, notably vitamin D which seems to have some rough correlation with the prevalence of some cancers in some populations when it's measured in the blood, but there's no evidence that it's helpful when it's ingested as a supplement.



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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 12, 2020 11:44AM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
PeterB
I'm not offended, but again ... I would suggest anyone interested, look at the primary, peer-reviewed literature ... while it's not for certain that it works, it does seem, on balance, that it is doing something.

There's a whole lot of money being made in the vitamin racket, resulting in an effective disinformation campaign against factual reporting on the benefits and liabilities of vitamin supplements. Even some otherwise intelligent physicians buy into the quackery.

Unfortunately, due to its very nature, pubmed is not a reliable source in and of itself. It contains a lot of articles and citations to "predatory" and fake journals and a lot of the stuff published there has not been peer-reviewed.

I think that you'll find that reputable studies do come out against vitamin supplements in general, and Selenium, A, B, E, and C specifically.

Other supplements have little or no effect, notably vitamin D which seems to have some rough correlation with the prevalence of some cancers in some populations when it's measured in the blood, but there's no evidence that it's helpful when it's ingested as a supplement.

Sarcany, the problem is with making blanket statements like this, which is why I'm using weasel words. grinning smiley ... for example, vitamin supplementation (of C or D) can be VERY helpful for those who are deficient, and it's currently estimated that about 20-40% of the US population may be borderline deficient for D (and in many cases, be unaware of it). As for C, many cancer patients are deficient for C, so it probably also makes a huge difference for studies of C as to whether or not the patients undergoing the clinical trials were deficient to begin with. As for PubMed, they do a pretty good job of weeding out the predatory/fake journals / non-peer reviewed stuff, or at least it is marked as such, as for example an opinion paper.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: deckeda
Date: April 12, 2020 12:14PM
I'm exhausted. Until there's a vaccine, the true fix is to Stay Away, followed closely by washing hands and wearing a mask.

Anything --- ANYTHING --- else that "can" help is so very unknown and unproven as to be a waste of breath for covid-19 unless you're a researcher scientist directly working on ... the vaccine.

Have fun playing what-if. I wish I had that kind of free time.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: d4
Date: April 12, 2020 12:21PM
If you are located in NY, chances are, you're f'd.
Nebraska? You're probably ok.
And wear a mask. Something is better than nothing.



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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: April 12, 2020 01:00PM
You know what's dangerous?

An extra trip to the store to get supplements.

stormtrooper smiley



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 12, 2020 01:34PM
Quote
rjmacs
You know what's dangerous?

An extra trip to the store to get supplements.

stormtrooper smiley

Some of us are already prepared. grinning smiley




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 12, 2020 01:59PM
Quote
PeterB
Sarcany, the problem is with making blanket statements like this, which is why I'm using weasel words. grinning smiley ... for example, vitamin supplementation (of C or D) can be VERY helpful for those who are deficient...

1. We weren't talking about people who were deficient in nutrients due to congenital or environmental factors who might benefit from supplements.

2. Yeah, vitamin C can help with scurvy. No, it doesn't prevent or cure cancer. Vitamin D can help with rickets, but the optimum level in the blood hasn't even been established and taking too much can cause hypercalcemia.

Treat vitamins like other medications and wait for your doctor to recommend it before you start a course of treatment.



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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Speedy
Date: April 12, 2020 04:24PM
So I should filter out the A and D from the milk I buy?



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: April 12, 2020 04:35PM
.....you may have to filter the T.....and.....A out.......



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 12, 2020 05:37PM
Quote
Speedy
So I should filter out the A and D from the milk I buy?

There are very tiny amounts of vitamins D and A in fortified milk. It's measured in micrograms, not even milligrams.

It's not comparable to what you'd get in bottled supplements.



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Re: Ugg . . . I think I may have been exposed
Posted by: AllGold
Date: April 12, 2020 05:39PM
I take a multivitamin. I have for decades because I rarely eat "right" (rarely eat enough fruits and vegetables). I also take 500mg of vitamin C because apparently, I've been hoodwinked by the vitamin companies. wink smiley And I take vitamin E daily because it helps with my dry skin.

I know I'm going to die (actually, I almost did recently). I'm just not sure whether the vitamins I take are postponing or accelerating my death.
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