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Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 12:28PM |
[forums.macresource.com]
... seems like the battery is maybe having trouble holding a charge? I can jump it, but after jumping it and driving around a short time, then letting it sit for about a week, it needs a jump again. What's weird is that once it's jumped, it's showing a charge of 14.2 - 14.7V ... which would seem to be good. (I've measured this using both my Zus and also the Prius' internal diagnostics screen.)
So... question is whether I'd be better off buying a new battery and installing myself, or perhaps getting one of those solar trickle chargers mentioned in the thread.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
... seems like the battery is maybe having trouble holding a charge? I can jump it, but after jumping it and driving around a short time, then letting it sit for about a week, it needs a jump again. What's weird is that once it's jumped, it's showing a charge of 14.2 - 14.7V ... which would seem to be good. (I've measured this using both my Zus and also the Prius' internal diagnostics screen.)
So... question is whether I'd be better off buying a new battery and installing myself, or perhaps getting one of those solar trickle chargers mentioned in the thread.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 12:42PM |
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space-time
Just move your hamsters in the car.
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MacResource User Map: [www.zeemaps.com]#
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 01:19PM |
Using a voltmeter is not the best way to test a battery. There are testers meant for just this purpose. They create a load on the battery. Autozone or similar should have them.
As suggested, check the cables to make sure that they're clean and tight.
As suggested, check the cables to make sure that they're clean and tight.
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 01:38PM |
Stop overcomplicating it... replace the battery.
You have a dead battery... It's an EX-battery. It has shuffled off this mortal coil. It's pining for the fjords. It has EXPIRED.
If a good cable-check, cleaning, and tightening, doesn't do it... buy a new battery, install said battery.
Paul F.
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A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand. - Lucius Annaeus Seneca c. 5 BC - 65 AD
----
Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.
--
--
--
Eureka, CA
You have a dead battery... It's an EX-battery. It has shuffled off this mortal coil. It's pining for the fjords. It has EXPIRED.
If a good cable-check, cleaning, and tightening, doesn't do it... buy a new battery, install said battery.
Paul F.
-----
A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand. - Lucius Annaeus Seneca c. 5 BC - 65 AD
----
Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.
--
--
--
Eureka, CA
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 04:19PM |
OK guys, returning back to this thread...
The voltage I'm reading should be the battery, as I understand it -- I use my Zus and also the procedure described in this YouTube, which gave identical results: [www.youtube.com]
(under the Vehicle Signal menu, I didn't use a voltmeter...)
A battery from Amazon is about $170, the solar chargers mentioned in the original post about $70. (I would want to use solar instead of AC since I don't have a garage.)
It is admittedly a 7-year old battery now, and I don't do a lot of driving ... so probably it just sitting around for long periods of time without being driven has maybe done the battery in somewhat? (I'd never had this problem pre-corona.) But as pointed out by some of you above, it shouldn't actually be necessary to drive around to power the battery?
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
The voltage I'm reading should be the battery, as I understand it -- I use my Zus and also the procedure described in this YouTube, which gave identical results: [www.youtube.com]
(under the Vehicle Signal menu, I didn't use a voltmeter...)
A battery from Amazon is about $170, the solar chargers mentioned in the original post about $70. (I would want to use solar instead of AC since I don't have a garage.)
It is admittedly a 7-year old battery now, and I don't do a lot of driving ... so probably it just sitting around for long periods of time without being driven has maybe done the battery in somewhat? (I'd never had this problem pre-corona.) But as pointed out by some of you above, it shouldn't actually be necessary to drive around to power the battery?
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 04:25PM |
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kj
I would just replace it. I was having odd electrical problems, two different stores tested the battery and said it was fine. Difficulties starting, lights turning on by themselves, weird stuff. I went back in, the guy at autozone literally berated me for buying a new battery, but it immediately fixed all the problems. In fact, it's been a few years. No way it wasn't the battery, so the testing doesn't always work. In my opinion, it's basically the cheapest troubleshooting step you can take.
Yep, that's the conclusion I'm starting to come to as well ... just a little nervous about doing the battery swapout myself. It's one thing to watch a YouTube of how to do it, it's another to actually do it. Though it does seem relatively easy, except for accessing some of those recessed nuts.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 04:29PM |
A 7 year old battery... replacement cost $170. That's a maintenance cost of $24/year or $2 month.
Replace it.
Even if it ends up not being the battery, you got plenty life out of the old one, and will then have 7-10 years of life in the new one.
I'm not seeing a down-side to going ahead and doing it. I mean, spending $170 always sucks, but, It won't be wasted.
Paul F.
-----
A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand. - Lucius Annaeus Seneca c. 5 BC - 65 AD
----
Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.
--
--
--
Eureka, CA
Replace it.
Even if it ends up not being the battery, you got plenty life out of the old one, and will then have 7-10 years of life in the new one.
I'm not seeing a down-side to going ahead and doing it. I mean, spending $170 always sucks, but, It won't be wasted.
Paul F.
-----
A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand. - Lucius Annaeus Seneca c. 5 BC - 65 AD
----
Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.
--
--
--
Eureka, CA
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 04:35PM |
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PeterB
... just a little nervous about doing the battery swapout myself
Which step makes you nervous?
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 05:18PM |
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mattkime
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PeterB
... just a little nervous about doing the battery swapout myself
Which step makes you nervous?
The mechanical aspects of getting into the compartment, getting all the stuff loosened up, etc.
This is the YouTube I've been looking at, which does make it clear that you need some specific tools for the task: [www.youtube.com]
(also commented on in the original thread)
Oh, and also nervous from the perspective of that some of the Amazon reviews suggest that the batteries can die early for no apparent reason, and that Amazon and the manufacturers will try to pawn off the responsibility onto each other; or if the problem isn't really with the battery but something else, and then replacing the battery doesn't fix it. I'm tempted to call the dealership just to see how much they'd charge for this, but on the other hand I do like to do stuff myself.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 05:49PM |
do you have a batteries plus near you? They might install. No reason to go to a dealership for something like this.
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 08:18PM |
Are the battery terminals and cable clamps free of oxide? It looks like $170 is a very good price for an AGM battery for a 2014 Prius III.
I am not sure about a Prius, but it typically takes 20 minutes to fully charge a 12 V battery with the gas engine running continuously at over 1500 rpm. Just idling at 800 rpm won't do it.
Did you use a Prius forum to get a recommendation on the solar charger?
In tha 360. MRF User Map
I am not sure about a Prius, but it typically takes 20 minutes to fully charge a 12 V battery with the gas engine running continuously at over 1500 rpm. Just idling at 800 rpm won't do it.
Did you use a Prius forum to get a recommendation on the solar charger?
In tha 360. MRF User Map
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 08:34PM |
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Filliam H. Muffman
Are the battery terminals and cable clamps free of oxide? It looks like $170 is a very good price for an AGM battery for a 2014 Prius III.
I am not sure about a Prius, but it typically takes 20 minutes to fully charge a 12 V battery with the gas engine running continuously at over 1500 rpm. Just idling at 800 rpm won't do it.
Did you use a Prius forum to get a recommendation on the solar charger?
Thanks everybody for information. The solar charger recommendation was from the original thread -- don't recall who made the suggestion, but I thought it seemed like a reasonable idea.
The voltage check -- as I said, done through Zus, but the Prius diagnostic screen is through the car itself, and I would assume the diagnostic is really measuring the voltage as load is put on it ... at least, one would hope so for a self-contained diagnostic!
I am tempted to try what Filliam has suggested, before I replace the battery. I was curious, so I Googled and found this: [www.wildetoyota.com] ... which says to let it run for 8 hours (!!!) in Ready mode after jumpstarting ... I suppose I can do that, I have nothing to lose ... could just leave the car running overnight or something. Gas isn't really a problem for me at the moment. (Under non-corona conditions, I typically buy about $20-30 worth of gas, usually about 20 gallons, which lasts me 4-6 months.)
And yes, it may be time for a new battery. I know the manufacturing quality isn't what it used to be -- car batteries lasting 10+ years being a distant memory.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/10/2021 08:35PM by PeterB.
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 08:34PM |
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space-time
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space-time
Just move your hamsters in the car.
I'd like to issue a public apology, some people here found my commend very rude.
Greatly appreciated, thanks.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 08:46PM |
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PeterB
I am tempted to try what Filliam has suggested, before I replace the battery. I was curious, so I Googled and found this: [www.wildetoyota.com] ... which says to let it run for 8 hours (!!!) in Ready mode after jumpstarting ... I suppose I can do that, I have nothing to lose ... could just leave the car running overnight or something.
Wilde Toyota does mention that their procedure is intended to take into account Milwaukee Winter temperatures. Has it been snowing recently in NO?
In tha 360. MRF User Map
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 09:02PM |
AAA if you are a member will do it for $218 installed at your house.
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 09:18PM |
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Filliam H. Muffman
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PeterB
I am tempted to try what Filliam has suggested, before I replace the battery. I was curious, so I Googled and found this: [www.wildetoyota.com] ... which says to let it run for 8 hours (!!!) in Ready mode after jumpstarting ... I suppose I can do that, I have nothing to lose ... could just leave the car running overnight or something.
Wilde Toyota does mention that their procedure is intended to take into account Milwaukee Winter temperatures. Has it been snowing recently in NO?
No, but the heat/humidity down here wreaks havoc on batteries of all kinds -- I've never seen so many corroded AA and AAA batteries in my life, since being here. You can't leave batteries in remote controls, etc., without discovering that they've eventually corroded and leaked. Maybe it's been less of an issue here lately, because like many other parts of the country, it's been unseasonably cold.
And the $218 from AAA, that includes the battery...? That would be quite a deal!
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 09:45PM |
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Gareth
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PeterB
This is the YouTube I've been looking at, which does make it clear that you need some specific tools for the task: [www.youtube.com]
(also commented on in the original thread)
To reiterate from the original thread, while you need specific tools, they are common tools you'd find in any "mechanic's" tool set, or any socket set with metric sockets, and you could spend less than $20. All you need is a 10mm deep socket and a 1/4" ratchet. (Don't bother with the torque wrench).
But if any local auto parts store sells the appropriate battery, one of them will probably install it for free also.
Yep, I got that ... and I may very well already have all the right tools, with the possible exception of the metric stuff -- I'll have to check. So I AM really tempted to try this myself! (Remember, the issue is that I'm strictly self-isolating, and really avoiding contact with people as much as possible... so going to the local auto parts store is really out of the question...)
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 10, 2021 11:41PM |
Get a quote from the dealer. The Prius 12V batteries are expensive but in my case the surprisingly small markup from the dealer was worth it to not have to mess with the install. The dealer always wanted a ridiculous amount of money for things like air filters or wiper blades, but the 12V battery was a good deal.
After the battery is replaced and until things get back to somewhat normal, you will probably want to drive the car a minimum of once a week. You could get that solar battery maintainer but it won't help the main traction battery which might also degrade if the car is never driven.
I had a couple weird problems like that myself when my 12V battery was low. The 12V battery powers the car's computers so if the computers are getting insufficient voltage things can get um, interesting.
After the battery is replaced and until things get back to somewhat normal, you will probably want to drive the car a minimum of once a week. You could get that solar battery maintainer but it won't help the main traction battery which might also degrade if the car is never driven.
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kj
I would just replace it. I was having odd electrical problems, two different stores tested the battery and said it was fine. Difficulties starting, lights turning on by themselves, weird stuff. I went back in, the guy at autozone literally berated me for buying a new battery, but it immediately fixed all the problems. In fact, it's been a few years. No way it wasn't the battery, so the testing doesn't always work. In my opinion, it's basically the cheapest troubleshooting step you can take.
I had a couple weird problems like that myself when my 12V battery was low. The 12V battery powers the car's computers so if the computers are getting insufficient voltage things can get um, interesting.
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 11, 2021 10:32AM |
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mikebw
Gotta say, as a Prius owner here I didn't know this about the alternator, as was also mentioned above:
[en.wikibooks.org]
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Recharging the 12 volt battery
Unlike normal cars, the Prius does not charge the 12 volt battery via an alternator spun by the engine. This vehicle charges its 12 volt battery from the hybrid system, so if you are unable to take the car out for a run for any reason, just switching the system on for a while will do the job. To maintain charge in the 12V battery if the car is not being used often, Toyota recommend putting the car in 'Ready' mode for one hour, once per week. If the battery is completely flat, the vehicle may need to be put in 'Ready' for 4 - 8 hours to fully recharge. Be aware that the engine will start occasionally to ensure the high voltage battery doesn't discharge - so this should only be done in a well-ventilated area, not a closed garage. Doing this will also wreck your miles per gallon record. Alternatively, the 12 volt battery can also be recharged using a standard car battery charger.
Good to know that it can recharge the 12v by itself, but for times when you cannot wait it still seems prudent to keep a small jump 12v starter pack in the car.
Wow!! VERY good info here -- that part I've bolded is definitely not what I've been doing, so will give it a try. (Money is kind of tight for me right now, and if I can get away with not having to change the battery for a bit -- especially considering that I'm not doing that much driving right now -- all the better.)
Edit: so this basically means doing the same thing that the other video posted says to do -- essentially starting the car up and letting it idle for 6-8 hours. I could easily do that during the course of the day, just leave it parked and running ... since obviously I don't want to be sitting in the car that whole time, I presume I should start it up, then lock the doors and let it run. I don't really care if it uses up gas, since I have plenty stored away.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/11/2021 10:38AM by PeterB.
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 11, 2021 10:49AM |
Well, maybe my boneheaded move wasn't so boneheaded after all.
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 11, 2021 11:46AM |
Nope, not at all ... in fact I have done something similar to this, when I was grocery shopping and wanted to make sure that the groceries were all kept cold as I was unloading them into my house (pre-corona, of course). By keeping the car running for an extended period, the AC kept the inside ice-cold and allowed me to take my time getting stuff right into the freezer/refrigerator (this is an issue down here where the heat is such that, otherwise, your stuff could all be melted by the time you get it inside).
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 11, 2021 01:11PM |
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GGD
Maybe a good way to proceed is the following.
Give the 12V battery a good charging by letting the car "Run" while parked.
At the same time, start go through the initial steps in the battery swap process which is mostly removing panels to get access to the battery but stop short of disconnecting the battery.
This will give you an idea of the process, what tools you might be missing, and how comfortable you are in doing it yourself.
Then, after a good charging, if you find that the car still needs jumping as frequently, you'll have a better idea if you should just order a new battery to change yourself, or find a place to do the complete job.
Good ideas, all around.
Also ... should I be concerned of the possibility of theft, if the car is left running unattended like this...?
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 11, 2021 01:59PM |
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Filliam H. Muffman
Has it been snowing recently in NO?
Wow, spoke too soon. Weather Channel said there is going to be snow in the northern parts of LA on Monday.
I wasn't sure how the Prius charged the 12 V battery, good to know it is charged slowly off the drive battery.
In tha 360. MRF User Map
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Re: Followup to Prius battery woes Date: February 11, 2021 06:56PM |
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mikebw
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PeterB
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GGD
Maybe a good way to proceed is the following.
Give the 12V battery a good charging by letting the car "Run" while parked.
At the same time, start go through the initial steps in the battery swap process which is mostly removing panels to get access to the battery but stop short of disconnecting the battery.
This will give you an idea of the process, what tools you might be missing, and how comfortable you are in doing it yourself.
Then, after a good charging, if you find that the car still needs jumping as frequently, you'll have a better idea if you should just order a new battery to change yourself, or find a place to do the complete job.
Good ideas, all around.
Also ... should I be concerned of the possibility of theft, if the car is left running unattended like this...?
I assume you have the wireless key thing, so you can start the car by pressing start. Exit the car and then see if you can lock it with you and the key being on the outside. It might not like it, but if that works you should be OK. The car will run without the key until it gets turned off, so don't just leave it ON with the doors unlocked, if you think someone might steal it.
Right, but if someone somehow gets in the car with it running, can't they just drive off with it? (They wouldn't be able to start it up again without the FOB, but they might not care about that...)
Edit: my FOB doesn't start the car, I have to press the On button to do that, but I can exit the car and then just lock it manually with the manual key.
Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/11/2021 06:57PM by PeterB.
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