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Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: February 14, 2021 12:31PM
I've been using 1Password myself for some time now, but stopped upgrading at version 6.8.9 because I do NOT want my passwords stored on some developers servers, nor do I want to "subscribe" to it as a service.

Does anyone have recommendations for a password manager app that:

1. Does not require a subscription; is purchased outright

2. Stores user's passwords ONLY on the user's devices, not remotely

3. Works across the user's devices, i.e. a Mac app that can sync with an iPhone app


TIA
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Wags
Date: February 14, 2021 12:34PM
I just use the built in Mac app. Never had a prob with it.

Free
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: mattkime
Date: February 14, 2021 12:37PM
did 1Password get rid of the non subscription license or is it merely well hidden?

I'm still on 1Password 6.8.9

I use dropbox to sync passwords to my iphone.



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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: space-time
Date: February 14, 2021 12:38PM
If you like the 1Password, I think you can still get a stand-alone license (no subscription) and to can store the keychain on the local machine. I think, not 100% sure.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: graylocks
Date: February 14, 2021 12:40PM
Quote
space-time
If you like the 1Password, I think you can still get a stand-alone license (no subscription) and to can store the keychain on the local machine. I think, not 100% sure.

yes, you have to hunt around a bit but there is still a one-time purchase ($70) app. i think you can store the vault locally. i use Dropbox because I want 1P available for all my devices.



"Success isn't about how much money you make. It is about the difference you make in people's lives."--Michelle Obama
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: btfc
Date: February 14, 2021 12:44PM
I like LastPass.

[www.lastpass.com]
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: February 14, 2021 12:44PM
Quote
Wags
I just use the built in Mac app. Never had a prob with it.

Free

What are you referring to with "the built in Mac app"? Keychain?

If so, that really doesn't have the capabilities of apps like 1Password.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: btfc
Date: February 14, 2021 12:47PM
Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: February 14, 2021 12:49PM
Quote
mattkime
did 1Password get rid of the non subscription license or is it merely well hidden?

I'm still on 1Password 6.8.9

1Password 7 is subscription only, and it's the only version the App store offers now.

Quote
mattkime
I use dropbox to sync passwords to my iphone.

Well then your "sync" would be going through DropBox's servers wouldn't it?
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: February 14, 2021 12:53PM
Quote
btfc
I like LastPass.

[www.lastpass.com]

Isn't LastPass syncing through their servers? "Anything you save on one device is instantly available on any other device you use"
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Zoidberg
Date: February 14, 2021 01:00PM
Quote
Wags
I just use the built in Mac app. Never had a prob with it.

Same here. It works on all my devices seamlessly, and is pretty easy to use when I need to just see a password. I wouldn't say no to Apple making a better interface to see things in it, but it works.



YMMV (Your Mileage May Vary)
TETO (To Each Their Own)

(BTW, it's spelled < y'all >.)
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: btfc
Date: February 14, 2021 01:03PM
Not sure why you feel the need to argue with people who are trying to help you.

And do your own homework.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Wags
Date: February 14, 2021 01:04PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
I just use the built in Mac app. Never had a prob with it.

Free

What are you referring to with "the built in Mac app"? Keychain?

If so, that really doesn't have the capabilities of apps like 1Password.

What other capabilities? Genuinely curious.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: mattkime
Date: February 14, 2021 01:08PM
I think finding something that syncs directly between your mac and iphone may be the sticking point.



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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: February 14, 2021 01:08PM
Quote
btfc
Not sure why you feel the need to argue with people who are trying to help you.

Not "arguing", just asking for some clarification from some, and reiterating the parameters I'm seeking for others who may have overlooked or misunderstood them.

Quote
btfc
And do your own homework.

I am; I'm asking the knowledgable folks here for their recommendations.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: February 14, 2021 01:16PM
Quote
Wags
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
I just use the built in Mac app. Never had a prob with it.

Free

What are you referring to with "the built in Mac app"? Keychain?

If so, that really doesn't have the capabilities of apps like 1Password.

What other capabilities? Genuinely curious.

1. Ability to generate passwords
2. Ability to set characteristics of passwords generated: length, number of digits, number of characters
3. Show of the strength of passwords
4. General categories: passwords, logins, secure notes, credit cards, identities, software licenses, etc.
5. Security audits: weak passwords, duplicate passwords, age of passwords
6. Ability to group passwords in personalized folders for order and quicker access
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: sekker
Date: February 14, 2021 01:18PM
1Password 7 is available as a license or standalone purchase as an upgrade:
[support.1password.com]

You can still buy a standalone (not as an upgrade) but only from 1password directly:
[1password.community]

Standalone 1Password can sync via Dropbox, iCloud or both. I actually use both approaches since we have an older family vault in Dropbox we started before 1Password could share via iCloud, and use iCloud for my separate business and personal (non-family) password vaults.

If you are on Catalina or above, you can use iCloud's folder sharing to make a vault to share with all family members on an iCloud Family Sharing Plan and totally skip any Dropbox scenarios.

1Password has far more options and tools than Keychain.

1Password costs $$ to purchase - Mac, Windows and iOS apps all cost $$.

I refuse to give my financial passwords to a company that gives their tool away for free (I do use Keychain a bit, but it's a part of the Apple ecosystem and you pay for it via the premium hardware you buy). You get what you pay for; if you are not paying for the software, you are being monetized in some other way. I think it's a mistake to assume such a freemium model is going to keep your key data safe; even if the company is playing ethically, they may not have the $$ to do so.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Rolando
Date: February 14, 2021 01:20PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
What other capabilities? Genuinely curious.

1. Ability to generate passwords
2. Ability to set characteristics of passwords generated: length, number of digits, number of characters
3. Show of the strength of passwords
4. General categories: passwords, logins, secure notes, credit cards, identities, software licenses, etc.
5. Security audits: weak passwords, duplicate passwords, age of passwords
6. Ability to group passwords in personalized folders for order and quicker access

That is a great answer. I've Never known why a Mac/iOS user would need beyond Keychain. Thanks for the enlightenment.



San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

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"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2021 01:22PM by Rolando.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: sekker
Date: February 14, 2021 01:37PM
Quote
Rolando
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
What other capabilities? Genuinely curious.

1. Ability to generate passwords
2. Ability to set characteristics of passwords generated: length, number of digits, number of characters
3. Show of the strength of passwords
4. General categories: passwords, logins, secure notes, credit cards, identities, software licenses, etc.
5. Security audits: weak passwords, duplicate passwords, age of passwords
6. Ability to group passwords in personalized folders for order and quicker access

That is a great answer. I've Never known why a Mac/iOS user would need beyond Keychain. Thanks for the enlightenment.

Sharing passwords amongst family members, too.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Wags
Date: February 14, 2021 02:02PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
I just use the built in Mac app. Never had a prob with it.

Free

What are you referring to with "the built in Mac app"? Keychain?

If so, that really doesn't have the capabilities of apps like 1Password.

What other capabilities? Genuinely curious.

1. Ability to generate passwords
2. Ability to set characteristics of passwords generated: length, number of digits, number of characters
3. Show of the strength of passwords
4. General categories: passwords, logins, secure notes, credit cards, identities, software licenses, etc.
5. Security audits: weak passwords, duplicate passwords, age of passwords
6. Ability to group passwords in personalized folders for order and quicker access

Thanks for this info. I can see where some of these would be useful to a power user. Keychain does include a couple of these. Works well enough for my simple needs.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: rz
Date: February 14, 2021 02:08PM
I'm probably the only person who only uses 1Password as basically a secure list of passwords. There's nothing automated about the way I use it. When I login to a site, I open 1Password, get the password, and type it in. I don't sync it anywhere. I don't have it generate anything. It says I'm on v6.9.1. I'm also only on iOS 10. I doubt it'll work whenever I get a new phone.

My wife bought it a while ago and tried using it the way others mention it above, but had all kinds of problems.

All I'd be looking for is a vault for passwords. No need for any fancy syncing or anything.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: rz
Date: February 14, 2021 02:11PM
Quote
sekker

Standalone 1Password can sync via Dropbox, iCloud or both. I actually use both approaches since we have an older family vault in Dropbox we started before 1Password could share via iCloud, and use iCloud for my separate business and personal (non-family) password vaults.
...
I refuse to give my financial passwords to a company that gives their tool away for free (I do use Keychain a bit, but it's a part of the Apple ecosystem and you pay for it via the premium hardware you buy). You get what you pay for; if you are not paying for the software, you are being monetized in some other way. I think it's a mistake to assume such a freemium model is going to keep your key data safe; even if the company is playing ethically, they may not have the $$ to do so.

uh, I don't get your logic. Just because you pay Apple for iCloud, doesn't make it any safer than somewhere like Dropbox. In both cases, your data is not in your possession.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: pipiens
Date: February 14, 2021 02:24PM
[www.stickypassword.com]
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: jdc
Date: February 14, 2021 02:34PM
Quote
DeusxMac
I've been using 1Password myself for some time now, but stopped upgrading at version 6.8.9 because I do NOT want my passwords stored on some developers servers, nor do I want to "subscribe" to it as a service.

3. Works across the user's devices, i.e. a Mac app that can sync with an iPhone app

We have this discussion about every 3 months or so, so if you were so inclined to search all dates you would find these same Q/As.

And to repeat what others have said, 1PW V7 can be bought as a stand alone app, no subscription.

Im not sure I understand #3... in order for your iDevices to sync, PWs have to be stored somewhere... in the cloud? I think the default for 1PW vault is dropbox. At least that's where mine is. Sync with MBA (big sure), iMac (Catalina) and iPhone 12 (14).





Edited 999 time(s). Last edit at 12:08PM by jdc.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Fritz
Date: February 14, 2021 02:38PM
Enpass. Local storage. No issues.



!#$@@$#!

If there are spelling issues, please pardon, Owen the cat is sitting on my keyboard.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: tuqqer
Date: February 14, 2021 02:50PM
Already stated by others, but to be clear, 1Password v7 can be purchased as a standalone. I own v7, as I'm not a fan of monthly payments (except Netflix and a few others). And it works on the latest M1 and latest Safari

If I were to start over, I'd check out Enpass, as they offer a free version.



Mac mini (M1 2020, 16G 2T) Big Sur 11.x Dual 25" Acer 1440p LCDs11" i5 MacBook Air
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: testcase
Date: February 14, 2021 02:57PM
What happens when you either:

1: Forget the "Master Password" (the recent BitCoin guy) or

2: Have an entity that decides IT no longer likes / accepts your password (sound familiar Apple)?


Would you be locked out from you ownr data / accounts?

Yes, ideally important information should have a hard copy duplicate that would be stored in a "secure" place BUT, feces occurs and, Mr Murphy LOVES to make surprise appearances.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Robert M
Date: February 14, 2021 03:53PM
DeusxMac,

1Password without a doubt. People can say what they want about Keychain Access but it cannot compete with 1Password. Search the forum for the various threads about password managers. The shortcomings of Keychain Access become readily apparent when compared to a system like 1Password. If nothing else, just its horrid interface alone is enough to keep me away from it.

You don't have to pay a subscription for 1Password7. A stand-alone version of it is available. However, the subscription version has many features that the stand-alone version lacks. Currently, I'm using 1Password6. Non-subscription. It does everything I need to do and then some. I haven't felt a need to move to 1Password7 yet.

Robert
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: space-time
Date: February 14, 2021 04:16PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Wags
I just use the built in Mac app. Never had a prob with it.

Free

What are you referring to with "the built in Mac app"? Keychain?

If so, that really doesn't have the capabilities of apps like 1Password.

What other capabilities? Genuinely curious.

1. Ability to generate passwords
2. Ability to set characteristics of passwords generated: length, number of digits, number of characters
3. Show of the strength of passwords
4. General categories: passwords, logins, secure notes, credit cards, identities, software licenses, etc.
5. Security audits: weak passwords, duplicate passwords, age of passwords
6. Ability to group passwords in personalized folders for order and quicker access

1. Ability to generate passwords

Keychain does that. See screenshot below.

2. Ability to set characteristics of passwords generated: length, number of digits, number of characters

You can set the length (max length in Mojave is 31) and you can choose from several combinations such as numbers and letters, memorable, random, etc, but you cannot customize it as much as in 1Passcord, true.

3. Show of the strength of passwords

Keychain does that. Again see screenshot.

4. General categories: passwords, logins, secure notes, credit cards, identities, software licenses, etc.

Again, you can do some of this in keychain. You can have passwords, logins, secure notes, and you can have multiple keychains. What you cannot do it organize it like in 1Password.

5. Security audits: weak passwords, duplicate passwords, age of passwords

You can see the age if you sent by Last Modified. But indeed you cannot easily find duplicates.

6. Ability to group passwords in personalized folders for order and quicker access

You can probably do some of that with having multiple keychains





Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2021 04:22PM by space-time.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: February 14, 2021 04:41PM
Quote
mattkime
did 1Password get rid of the non subscription license or is it merely well hidden?

I'm still on 1Password 6.8.9

I use dropbox to sync passwords to my iphone.

It’s well hidden, but still available.

I’ve been putting it off, but I’ll be upgrading to version 7 today (the non-subscription version), as version 6.x no longer works with more recent versions of Safari. Like mattkime, I use Dropbox to sync my (encrypted) password repository to all my devices.

While I concur with OP’s sentiment about passwords being stored on the software publisher’s server, hopefully he understands that they are stored in encrypted form.



It is what it is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/14/2021 04:49PM by N-OS X-tasy!.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: wurm
Date: February 14, 2021 04:54PM
Another happy Enpass user here. As for What happens when you Forget the "Master Password", most all of these password managers make it very clear that if you do, you're basically screwed. So think of one you'll remember.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Ammo
Date: February 14, 2021 07:08PM
It’s been so long since I bought 1Password standalone that I’ve forgotten if once you buy the initial license, companion apps for your other devices are free or not. Anybody know?



Where is there dignity unless there is also honesty? - Cicero

Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a battle you know nothing about. —Wendy Mass
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: sekker
Date: February 14, 2021 10:38PM
Quote
rz
Quote
sekker

Standalone 1Password can sync via Dropbox, iCloud or both. I actually use both approaches since we have an older family vault in Dropbox we started before 1Password could share via iCloud, and use iCloud for my separate business and personal (non-family) password vaults.
...
I refuse to give my financial passwords to a company that gives their tool away for free (I do use Keychain a bit, but it's a part of the Apple ecosystem and you pay for it via the premium hardware you buy). You get what you pay for; if you are not paying for the software, you are being monetized in some other way. I think it's a mistake to assume such a freemium model is going to keep your key data safe; even if the company is playing ethically, they may not have the $$ to do so.

uh, I don't get your logic. Just because you pay Apple for iCloud, doesn't make it any safer than somewhere like Dropbox. In both cases, your data is not in your possession.

It's not that I pay for iCloud, it's that I pay for 1Password. And 1Password does NOT keep a key to my vaults nor even stores my data. Lastpass etc are 'free' - it's my opinion that such a business model is far riskier to put personal data. Just my view.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: February 15, 2021 12:54AM
Quote
Ammo
It’s been so long since I bought 1Password standalone that I’ve forgotten if once you buy the initial license, companion apps for your other devices are free or not. Anybody know?

I just purchased a 1Password license moments ago -- the registration splash screen indicates that the software can be used on "as many Macs as needed."



It is what it is.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: RE:up
Date: February 15, 2021 06:56AM
What is the price for the standalone version of 1PW 7?
The subscription is $36/year for single user, $60/year for family of 5.

Couldn't find the non sub price on their website.
Anyone know?
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: clay
Date: February 15, 2021 07:13AM
Quote
RE:up
What is the price for the standalone version of 1PW 7?
The subscription is $36/year for single user, $60/year for family of 5.

Couldn't find the non sub price on their website.
Anyone know?

follow these instructions:
[1password.community]

I think I paid maybe double the subscription price for my standalone 7 license, but don't remember exactly. Totally worth it to me.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: space-time
Date: February 15, 2021 07:21AM
Quote
RE:up
What is the price for the standalone version of 1PW 7?
The subscription is $36/year for single user, $60/year for family of 5.

Couldn't find the non sub price on their website.
Anyone know?


$65 for desktop/laptop + $10 for iPhone

it's impossible to find, they do not show the price on the web site. I don't like their business tactics lately.

[www.tomsguide.com]

Mac users can still buy a single license for the 1Password standalone application for a one-time fee of $64.99, but this is not advertised. To purchase this version, you have to download 1Password 7 from the AgileBits website, then click "Need a license? We have those too" when prompted after opening the app for the first time.

The standalone option lacks many of 1Password's advanced features, including sharing, restoring items, Travel Mode, and the Two-Secret Key Derivation security feature. You'll have to pay again for major version updates to the desktop application.

To sync the standalone desktop app's data with the mobile 1Password apps, you would need to make a one-time in-app purchase of $9.99 in the iOS and/or Android app to unlock the Pro features.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: RE:up
Date: February 15, 2021 08:49AM
Thanks S-T,

So $75 if you want the standalone desktop and the mobile app.

Wish Agile would make it easy to find prices. Odd way to do business.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: tuqqer
Date: February 15, 2021 08:55AM
Quote
space-time

it's impossible to find, they do not show the price on the web site. I don't like their business tactics lately.

Agreed. They've become a weird company the last couple years, and it's why I stopped promoting them. I still use the standalone version, but I now tell others about EnPass and anything else. Agile really @#$%& up with their off-putting price model.



Mac mini (M1 2020, 16G 2T) Big Sur 11.x Dual 25" Acer 1440p LCDs11" i5 MacBook Air
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: sekker
Date: February 15, 2021 10:30AM
Agree that Agile is having a challenge moving from one-time to SAAS financial model.

I think they had something lined up with Dropbox but it fell through, leading to this current chaos.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: February 15, 2021 11:11AM
Well, I installed 1Password v7.7 last night. Installation was easy enough, but it only imported approximately 2/3 of the entries from my previous 1Password vault. Not too pleased about that.



It is what it is.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: btfc
Date: February 15, 2021 02:11PM
“ They've become a weird company the last couple years, and it's why I stopped promoting them.”

Yes, me too; I used to recommend them, but I’ve moved on.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: tahoedrew
Date: February 15, 2021 04:50PM
Count me in as a "third" for Enpass.

There is a fee which provides the ability to sync from one device to another, but using whatever service you choose. I'm just getting started implementing that on my QNAP NAS so my file is still entirely on hardware I control.

~A
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: graylocks
Date: February 15, 2021 04:51PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Well, I installed 1Password v7.7 last night. Installation was easy enough, but it only imported approximately 2/3 of the entries from my previous 1Password vault. Not too pleased about that.

i also had trouble upgrading a month or so ago. Had a number of back/forth with support and was able to sole the problem. i just tried to find the emails with the fix they sent me but apparently I trashed them. things did all work out, though, and it's working fine.



"Success isn't about how much money you make. It is about the difference you make in people's lives."--Michelle Obama
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: rich in distress
Date: February 15, 2021 06:45PM
I hate to break it to y’all, but the best of such services is baked in on MacOS and iOS.
Sorry, no pee cees.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: graylocks
Date: February 15, 2021 07:25PM
Quote
rich in distress
I hate to break it to y’all, but the best of such services is baked in on MacOS and iOS.
Sorry, no pee cees.

best is a relative term. the baked in system doesn't do all that i get from 1Password. That program is what works best for me.



"Success isn't about how much money you make. It is about the difference you make in people's lives."--Michelle Obama
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: space-time
Date: February 15, 2021 08:17PM
Quote
rich in distress
I hate to break it to y’all, but the best of such services is baked in on MacOS and iOS.
Sorry, no pee cees.

wrong. see above.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: rich in distress
Date: February 16, 2021 12:06AM
Stockholm syndrome I say. If you only spent some quality time with it...
But graylocks is right, what works best for each.
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: clay
Date: February 16, 2021 12:25PM
FYI, just saw this story:

"LastPass will restrict free users to only one type of device starting next month"

[9to5google.com]
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Re: Password manager recommendations?
Posted by: Robert M
Date: February 16, 2021 02:02PM
Rich,

You can't be serious. A brief summary of the issue facing Keychain Access.:

Interface, awful.

Features, limited in comparison to 1Password.

Secure? Astonishingly, no. Unless I'm mistaken, the password for the main keychain is the same as the password for my account. That means, anyone using my computer can open the app and access all of the data in it.

Overall utility, barely usable for much of anything except for maybe the basics.

Cross-platform. Mac, iOS and iPadOS. Windows? Nope.

That's my nice way of calling Keychain Access garbage. Based on using it exclusively for a week as a test, I can say without a doubt that it was never really intended for use by anyone to be a dedicated password manager like 1Password.

Robert
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