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This stuff's amazing
Posted by: PeterB
Date: June 11, 2021 10:20AM
It's gotten stains out of my wood kitchen drawers, black ink that had penetrated deep into a white marble countertop, and now also has helped with the dried latex paint I mentioned in a previous post (though it took several applications and a fair bit of scrubbing, and hasn't completely removed it, but HAS made it a whole lot less noticeable): [forums.macresource.com]

[www.amazon.com]
Warning, this is NOT the same stuff you buy in a store... gotta be careful with it... contrary to what some of the reviewers have written, it's the real deal.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: Paul F.
Date: June 11, 2021 10:37AM
12%
I think at 20% it can start fires by oxidizing things at random... Clothes, shoes, people... pets...

12% is no joke.



Paul F.
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Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.

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Eureka, CA
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: davester
Date: June 11, 2021 11:18AM
Also note that H2O2 is unstable and will turn into water just by sitting around. That H2O2 that you have sitting in the medicine cabinet is 100% water now. Always buy a fresh bottle if you want to use it for anything. In this case, the expiration date is meaningful.



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: PeterB
Date: June 11, 2021 12:02PM
Quote
davester
Also note that H2O2 is unstable and will turn into water just by sitting around. That H2O2 that you have sitting in the medicine cabinet is 100% water now. Always buy a fresh bottle if you want to use it for anything. In this case, the expiration date is meaningful.

Yes, of course. This being so concentrated though, it lasts longer -- the bottle I just ordered from Amazon had an expiration date in 2023.

Also, it should be stored tightly capped in the fridge, which in my experience substantially extends its lifespan. The people in the Amazon reviews who were complaining that it lost potency probably didn't do this, and/or let it sit somewhere that it might get exposed to heat and/or light. When I order mine, I make sure to get it off the porch ASAP after delivery, and get it right into the refrigerator. Edit: I also notice with it, a distinct but subtle odor that I don't smell with the stuff you get in a store.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/11/2021 12:04PM by PeterB.
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: Diana
Date: June 11, 2021 01:08PM
Yes, it is amazing.

The hydrogen peroxide you buy at the store is typically 3%; as kinetic rates of chemical reactions are concentration dependent, the stuff you buy for personal use goes off slower than the 12%, but yes it will spontaneously degrade to water and oxygen (two water molecules to one oxygen). If you want to make sure your hydrogen peroxide does something at the time when needed, either buy fresh or store it unopened in a cool dark location until needed, as light and additional heat causes it to spontaneously degrade faster as they introduce more ambient energy into the system and thus lower the energy requirements for the reaction. Once opened, the clock starts ticking so use it rather quickly. As davester noted, pay attention to the expiration dates.

At 12% it isn't something you really want to play around with as it will oxidize most things it comes into contact with, particularly organics. Place some on your hand, and it will turn the skin white as it destroys the cells (not recommended--it takes a while for the skin to repair itself, depending on the amount of damage done). It is great for disinfecting as it is rather indiscriminate in the what it attacks so if you use at 12% I would dilute it considerably. I have used it at 20% to digest metal oxide samples for further analysis in lieu of the regular concentrated acid/heat route. Both methods have their issues--the H2O2 works without much more supervision than just occasional stirring but takes time, and the acid/heat method requires constant supervision (as the volume decreases, the incidence of splatter is greater and thus you can lose sample) but is quicker.

The most concentrated form I have personally seen and worked with is 20%. It doesn't start fires smile smiley at this concentration. Gloves, either nitrile or latex depending on the chances and length of time of exposure, would *probably* *most likely* *WILL* be a good idea. I know you can purchase it in a more concentrated form--50% w/w is the most I have seen advertised. Perhaps you could get it even more concentrated, but it needs to be stabilized at such high concentrations.

Cost? As you get more pure, the cost goes up. At Sigma-Aldrich, for example, 31% purity (Ultrapur) for inorganic trace analysis: $1,150 for 1 L. BTW, Sigma-Aldrich is a chemical supplier (as well as for other disciplines).

Diana
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: archipirata
Date: June 11, 2021 01:33PM
Thanks! I have used the regular strength to get rid of water stains on our hardwood floor. Works great but have to apply it about 6 times. I'm intrigued to try this. And yes, I'll start out by testing a very small amount.



Athens, OH
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: PeterB
Date: June 11, 2021 01:57PM
To add to what Diana has stated:

1) They may be adding some sort of stabilizer to this stuff, because I've kept an opened container tightly capped in my fridge and it's still been good after about a year. Not so with the regular stuff in brown bottles that you get in the store... at least, not in my experience. I understand from the chemistry perspective that a more concentrated solution should degrade faster than a less concentrated, but in my experience with this stuff-- for whatever reason-- it's been the opposite.

2) I've been using it undiluted for my purposes, but that's only because I really wanted to get rid of the stains, and yes, I've learned the hard way about the skin damage!

3) The stuff on Amazon seems very reasonably priced... I find that, in terms of use, a full bottle might last me about a year -- depending on how frequently I need to treat something to remove the stain.

4) I've seen and read people on Amazon using this for various personal care purposes. I cannot imagine doing something like that -- you'd be asking for trouble. I've only myself used it for the things I've mentioned, where other solvents / stain removers have failed.




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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: MrNoBody
Date: June 11, 2021 02:28PM
I use Sodium Percarbonate, add to filtered water and make your own H2O2.
5# bag $27 @ bezosville. [www.amazon.com]
(note, smaller sizes are also sold but the 5# is the most economical.)
Home beer brewing suppliers also sell it.



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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: freeradical
Date: June 11, 2021 05:05PM
Quote
MrNoBody
I use Sodium Percarbonate, add to filtered water and make your own H2O2.
5# bag $27 @ bezosville. [www.amazon.com]
(note, smaller sizes are also sold but the 5# is the most economical.)
Home beer brewing suppliers also sell it.

That's not a bad price so long as you don't have to pay the hazardous materials shipping charge that most places tack on for a chemical like this.
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: freeradical
Date: June 11, 2021 05:08PM
I use the typical 3% solution of hydrogen peroxide to clean the wax out of my ears. It sounds and feels quite weird as it bubbles away. I guess this 12% stuff would be too much. :-)
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: June 11, 2021 07:00PM
....I....'ear.....what you are saying.......



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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: PeterB
Date: June 11, 2021 07:47PM
Quote
MrNoBody
I use Sodium Percarbonate, add to filtered water and make your own H2O2.
5# bag $27 @ bezosville. [www.amazon.com]
(note, smaller sizes are also sold but the 5# is the most economical.)
Home beer brewing suppliers also sell it.

I've used OxyClean, which I presume is mostly sodium percarbonate, and never been able to get stains out in the way that the concentrated H2O2 does... don't ask me why.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: MrNoBody
Date: June 11, 2021 09:35PM
Quote
PeterB
I've used OxyClean, which I presume is mostly sodium percarbonate, and never been able to get stains out in the way that the concentrated H2O2 does... don't ask me why.

cuz OxyC is full of other stuff, far from being 'mostly' Na2CO3·1.5 H2O2.
It's main ingredient is Disodium carbonate. SDS



39°36'17"N 75°44'43"W

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DemComm Records 2021 Greatest Hits
includes:
Taxman by Joe & Nancy's Rich Ice Cream Band
The Humpty Dance by The Harris-Brown Hookup
Lets Spend The Night Together by The Fang-Swalwell Gang
Díaz-Canel Is A Friend of Ours by The AOC Squad
My Old Kentucky Retirement Home by MitchMcC & The Soggy Boxer Boys
Burning Down The House by Merrick & The Goons
Back In the USSR by Bernie's Red Square Trio

patriot smiley
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: PeterB
Date: June 12, 2021 10:17AM
Quote
MrNoBody
Quote
PeterB
I've used OxyClean, which I presume is mostly sodium percarbonate, and never been able to get stains out in the way that the concentrated H2O2 does... don't ask me why.

cuz OxyC is full of other stuff, far from being 'mostly' Na2CO3·1.5 H2O2.
It's main ingredient is Disodium carbonate. SDS

Hmmm... SDS doesn't agree with what's written here: [en.wikipedia.org]

Also, how do you know what concentration of H2O2 you're getting when mixing this with water?




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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: MrNoBody
Date: June 12, 2021 11:48AM
  1. SDS is factual while Wiki is who knows? See that "[citation needed] "?
  2. You don't know % but it hasn't stopped craftsmen for decades from using the stuff.
  3. I use one level tablespoon of sodium percarb. for a large load in the
    washer. OxiClean calls for 2-3 scoops!
Just trying to help & save ya some $$, you're on your own.
thumbsup smiley



39°36'17"N 75°44'43"W

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The search engine that doesn't track you.

DemComm Records 2021 Greatest Hits
includes:
Taxman by Joe & Nancy's Rich Ice Cream Band
The Humpty Dance by The Harris-Brown Hookup
Lets Spend The Night Together by The Fang-Swalwell Gang
Díaz-Canel Is A Friend of Ours by The AOC Squad
My Old Kentucky Retirement Home by MitchMcC & The Soggy Boxer Boys
Burning Down The House by Merrick & The Goons
Back In the USSR by Bernie's Red Square Trio

patriot smiley
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Re: This stuff's amazing
Posted by: PeterB
Date: June 12, 2021 12:11PM
Quote
MrNoBody
  1. SDS is factual while Wiki is who knows? See that "[citation needed] "?
  2. You don't know % but it hasn't stopped craftsmen for decades from using the stuff.
  3. I use one level tablespoon of sodium percarb. for a large load in the
    washer. OxiClean calls for 2-3 scoops!
Just trying to help & save ya some $$, you're on your own.
thumbsup smiley

Sure. I just want to know why this would work better than what I originally posted. The only real advantage I can see is stability, it being in dry form, though I'd imagine that it'll eventually go bad because of atmospheric water. And I'm not really using this for the laundry, using it to get stains out of things that otherwise seem hopeless...




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