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Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: davemchine
Date: June 21, 2022 09:28PM
I'm currently running iTunes 12.8.3.1 on High Sierra. With the new Mini on the way I'll be upgrading to Apple's new suite of software for media. I have a few questions.
1) Does this new group of software have a name?

2) Is the new software Music, Apple TV, Apple Books, and Apple Podcasts or is there more?

3) My iTunes database is at ~/Music/iTunes/iTunes Music Library.xml , will this remain or will these new apps create new databases?

4) When I use the migration manager to move from the iMac to the Mini will this software update happen automagically or will I need to initiate it somehow?

I have a fairly large media library at about 26TB so you can imagine why I'm nervous about the upgrade. Thanks for any info.



Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
[colquhoun.info]
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: Article Accelerator
Date: June 22, 2022 01:12AM
Quote
davemchine
I have a fairly large media library at about 26TB

Yes, fairly large. goodone
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: ka jowct
Date: June 22, 2022 07:41AM
How is this ginormous 26TB library stored? My library is weak and puny in comparison, and I am paranoid enough about all the work I put into ripping all my CDs, etc., that I have multiple backups. I can run it from pretty much any machine if I use the copy on an external drive. The library is also stored on at least three different machines, as well as on more than one drive in my Mac Pro. I”d be very concerned about letting Apple wreak havoc with a 26TB library. I don’t think I would risk it.



My life goes smoothly and in regular intervals



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2022 07:42AM by ka jowct.
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: davemchine
Date: June 22, 2022 08:27AM
My library is stored on a Synology DS1520+ which uses five drives.



Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
[colquhoun.info]
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: ka jowct
Date: June 22, 2022 09:11AM
Quote
davemchine
My library is stored on a Synology DS1520+ which uses five drives.

I would just keep the using Mac that is currently running the library for that purpose. I’ve read enough disaster stories about upgrades (iTunes versions or iTunes to Music) trashing libraries that I would never risk converting a library that size. It’s so big that you need another array to just have a backup.



My life goes smoothly and in regular intervals
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: davemchine
Date: June 22, 2022 12:12PM
Unfortunately iTunes doesn’t play well with non-Apple formatted drives. I did not know this until after I had switched to the Synology. I’ve been putting up with the quirks but it’s getting worse and I worry about my library getting completely scrambled. So my choices were to upgrade to either 1) a new Mac running new software or 2) drop iTunes/Apple software completely and switch to something else to manage my files. I chose number 1 but I’m nervous.



Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
[colquhoun.info]
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: mikebw
Date: June 22, 2022 12:29PM
Do you have the resources to test the process on a clone of your library first?
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: June 22, 2022 01:09PM
....chaos will......ensue.....



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: Tiangou
Date: June 22, 2022 01:14PM
Quote
davemchine
Unfortunately iTunes doesn’t play well with non-Apple formatted drives. I did not know this until after I had switched to the Synology...

What's the problem?

I'm presently hosting my music library on a QNAP.

Only trick is making sure that the volume is mounted prior to running the Music app, which I do by making it a login-item.



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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: davemchine
Date: June 22, 2022 02:25PM
QNAP allows for HFS volumes which may account for iTunes working well with it.

When hosting an iTunes library on a Synology (or any non HFS volume) odd things can happen. There are three problems.
1) iTunes does not reliably edit the metadata embedded in media files.
2) iTunes does not reliably rename or move a file when metadata is edited.
3) iTunes will confuse one tv show for another. The logic doesn’t follow but the result is a tv episode from Murder She Wrote appearing in the Dark Shadows folder. This might be an index problem rather than a non-HFS problem. I really don’t know.

There is a workaround for problem 1 and 2. I can do the edits in Subler, then performing a Get Info in iTunes, and the files will be correctly renamed and moved. But problem 3 doesn’t have a solution so I’m forced to change.



Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
[colquhoun.info]
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: davemchine
Date: June 22, 2022 02:27PM
Mike, doing a backup first is a given. I’m trying to learn as much about to expect ahead of time. Thanks.



Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
[colquhoun.info]
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: rich in distress
Date: June 22, 2022 03:35PM
I’m just going to state the obvious, but…
The iTunes from the migration data will already be pointing to the external drive array, so…
With the external array mounted, I would attempt to let migration assistant do its thing, hoping for the best.
If it doesn’t work, use backup to import music to music.app, books to books.app, etc.
Good thing you’ll only have to do this once.
I actually have to do this for my way much smaller library, so I’ll pay attention to whatever you wanna share.
Good luck!
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: John B.
Date: June 22, 2022 04:10PM
No firsthand experience, but have you tried the Synology iTunes Server application? (I have a Synology NAS and would be interested in whether their iTunes Server app is useful.)
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: Tiangou
Date: June 22, 2022 05:37PM
Quote
davemchine
QNAP allows for HFS volumes which may account for iTunes working well with it.

EXT4. Mounted via smb.

Quote
davemchine
When hosting an iTunes library on a Synology (or any non HFS volume) odd things can happen. There are three problems.
1) iTunes does not reliably edit the metadata embedded in media files.
2) iTunes does not reliably rename or move a file when metadata is edited.
3) iTunes will confuse one tv show for another. The logic doesn’t follow but the result is a tv episode from Murder She Wrote appearing in the Dark Shadows folder. This might be an index problem rather than a non-HFS problem. I really don’t know...

Never saw any behavior like that.

Did you separate the library from the files?

I did not. I moved my entire Music folder to the NAS and then held down the option key on launch to select the library on the NAS, and then mapped the appropriate path to the media files in the Music app pref's.

This is the same routine that I used successfully with iTunes in the past when I hosted my library on a Mac server.



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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: davemchine
Date: June 22, 2022 10:08PM
Tiangu, some confusion on my part. The new apps that replace iTunes work perfectly fine on any NAS. It’s only iTunes that has trouble with non-HFS volumes. This is why I am upgrading from iTunes to their new apps which apparently have no collective name making it quite confusing.

John, I did look at the iTunes server app that runs on the Synology but it was purely for serving up media rather than managing the files which is what I need (or at least desire).



Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
[colquhoun.info]
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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: Tiangou
Date: June 22, 2022 10:41PM
Quote
davemchine
Tiangu, some confusion on my part. The new apps that replace iTunes work perfectly fine on any NAS. It’s only iTunes that has trouble with non-HFS volumes...

Until a few months ago, my server was running iTunes. Now it's running Music.

After upgrading to Big Sur and Music, it automatically selected my local Music folder and put a new library in there. Pointing it back to the server worked seamlessly, just as it had with iTunes years ago when I first moved the music to my NAS and years before when I had the iTunes library hosted on a local volume on my Mac server.

I also had one of the iTunes libraries for one of my Macs on an external exFAT vol for awhile (SD card).

...I wonder whether the problem is just the file-system on your Synology NAS. Are you using BTRFS?



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Re: Upgrading from iTunes, what is going to happen?
Posted by: Fritz
Date: June 23, 2022 07:04AM
I went from a MBA 2013 on HS & iTunes to this newer MM8,1 Intel.
Music runs on the MM, but all the music is on a LAN'd MP3,1 internal (and 1 ext) drives. As it was when the MBA was my dd.
Until one (abuse not used, 2nd hand) drive failed, all was well.
Getting a (new) replacement today.

Pretty sure I made a new library on the MM rather than piss about copying the old MBA lib. It took a while, I have 86000 items for 225 days, but it's been good. Most of mine, obviously, is ALAC encoded (>500k).
Very little "full red book" encoded. Perhaps 25% 320k and some 128k that I haven't bothered to upgrade.



!#$@@$#!

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