I suddenly realized that it's October and that means new os whether you want it or not...

I had to do some googling before I found the name and verified that Apple did actually say that it was due 'In October'.

But NO ONE, I mean NO ONE has been talking about it. I miss the old days when we would be awaiting the next great software thing and JUMP to upgrade the moment we were able.

I glanced at Apple's Ventura page... scrolled a little... yawned... realized that I was only 40% through the page and just backed out. Didn't really care.

Only two of my computers will be able to run it, but both (2018 mini, 2017 imac) will have the bare minimum to run the OS. I might install on the mini, but not my imac (main computer)

are you getting pumped for Ventura?

The way things are going, each OS gets worse. They're breaking UX fundamentals now. One an example of what to do, they're now an example of what not to do.

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I'm okay with more regular and incremental (and free!) OS updates.

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Worried quite a bit about it.

Apple's messed with the installation-procedure to make it way easier to accidentally install it. Doesn't even require admin anymore if you're running Monterey.

Given the well-documented struggles they've had even making a working System Preference GUI -- and all of the related features that they're stripping out -- I have no faith that Ventura will be useful, stable, or particularly well-behaved with 3rd party software and MDM.

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My daily driver is running Catalina, and my laptop is running Monterey.

I honestly find very little difference except some software installations are harder in Monterey (like Brother printer software).

When Ventura comes out, I'll likely wait for a 0.1 update before I install. And I doubt I'll notice a major change over Monterey.

My iMac will remain in Catalina so long as the work software still works, and I am getting Apple OS security updates.

I'll stick with Big Sur

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“No persons are more frequently wrong, than those who will not admit they are wrong.” -- François de La Rochefoucauld

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<<The way things are going, each OS gets worse. They're breaking UX fundamentals now. One an example of what to do, they're now an example of what not to do.>

100%.

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hal
I suddenly realized that it's October and that means new os…I glanced at Apple's Ventura page…are you getting pumped for Ventura?

Yep!

Here's the Preview page: [www.apple.com]

Lots of great new features and functions!

Is this the version where they make a unified OS across iPhone/iPad/Mac?

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In tha 360. MRF User Map

I’m on Monterey now, and haven’t booted into MacOS on my MBP more than twice since updating. My MBP is now primarily a Windows 10 machine. Very little of my Mac software runs in Monterey, and I get messages when I boot up telling me that the rest will not function in future versions of MacOS.

I’m not out of the picture entirely though - I have an M1 Mac Mini used as a JRiver server.

Quote
Filliam H. Muffman
Is this the version where they make a unified OS across iPhone/iPad/Mac?

Sort of.

They're remaking key features in Swift, which breaks... everything.

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I haven't even moved to Catalina. Only reason I will be moving one of my systems past Mojave is compatibility with a couple online games that I am starting to have issues with running on High Sierra. So not looking forward to Ventura at all.

To be honest, Apple's approach of updating every 12 months is becoming increasingly buggy. Almost every version for the last few years has had issues upon release that look to have come from poor testing and quality control. They really should go back to having a new release about every year and a half like the earlier version of OS X were done.

Stopped at Mojave due to my MS Office 11. Now I'm considering my MacBook (Mid2011) out of date.

Eleven years is a pretty good run. When I get my next Mac (soon....) I will probably keep this one for offline use only. Maybe make the 10.7 Lion Partition the default boot.

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San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
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"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater

Still at Catalina which came with my 2019 MP, which I bought in January of 2020. I had a call with Avid support for Pro Tools Ultimate last week and asked if I should update the OS. The guy’s advice was don’t update until you absolutely have to because apps you need to do your work require it.

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JoeM

Quote
JoeM
Still at Catalina which came with my 2019 MP, which I bought in January of 2020. I had a call with Avid support for Pro Tools Ultimate last week and asked if I should update the OS. The guy’s advice was don’t update until you absolutely have to because apps you need to do your work require it.

Avid is reliably 2-3 years behind in their updates for Mac.

And they're not alone. Anyone doing audio/video work has to be careful about OS updates/upgrades, for the apps and for the plugins and for the peripheral drivers and for the iLok software.

I still know some audio guys running OS 9 because they can't afford to replace their plugins and FireWire gear.

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What's the best free way to keep an older macOS running in a VM?

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decay
What's the best free way to keep an older macOS running in a VM?

You can have one or the other. Not both. "Free" or "best."

...ARM or Intel Mac? I wouldn't try getting an old OS running on ARM at this time. We just covered that here.

Best as in simplest and most reliable: I believe that Parallels supports macOS vm installs back to Lion (and earlier if you have the server-version installer handy) on Intel Macs.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/16/2022 11:35PM by Tiangou.

Best as in simplest and most reliable


My solution will be to maintain an older Mac to run Sierra, and have another next to it running something either newer or the latest and greatest, for no other reason than to see what's what.

And I like iOS 16's Hide My Email, so I believe I'll need Monterey to use it with a desktop, instead of my 'Phone or iPad.

My M1 MBA is on Big Sur, so it might as well go to Monterey.

Ventura, why not.

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Quote
Tiangou

Quote
decay
What's the best free way to keep an older macOS running in a VM?

You can have one or the other. Not both. "Free" or "best."

...ARM or Intel Mac? I wouldn't try getting an old OS running on ARM at this time. We just covered that here.

Best as in simplest and most reliable: I believe that Parallels supports macOS vm installs back to Lion (and earlier if you have the server-version installer handy) on Intel Macs.

Intel Mac. My only M1 Mac is a work computer.

I'm trying to reduce the number of computers plugged in and running, or just taking up space & outlets. Obviously there are many options and scenarios.

Maybe I should just set up an old Mac Mini, or put the OS (Snow Leopard) on an external drive that I can boot into when needed. I have some old licensed software that won't run on 64-bit OS, and I don't care to purchase a newer license at this time.

I have VMWare Fusion 11.5.7 that I can install a VM in, too.

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Decay,

My primary machines at home and my office are running Mojave. They're both top of the line for their time 2019 iMac 27" models. They use external drives as boot drives. Over the last couple of months, I cloned the drives and scaled them down tremendously in preparation for turning them into virtual machines. That way, I can move up to a newer OS on both iMacs and still run Mojave on them.

I'm running a copy of the non-subscription version of Parallels 17 on both machines. So far, the VM with Mojave on my home machine is running nicely under Monterey. Same goes for the VM running Mojave on my Office machine. Dropbox syncs data between the actual machines and the virtual machines nicely. I haven't moved the office machine to Monterey yet but I know it's feasible now.

I figured I'm giving up running 32-bit apps normally once I move up from Mojave to Catalina, Big Sure or Monterey. So, I decided to go for Monterey and be done with it. Monterey is the last OS I can run on a 2015 MBPr, too.

Can't say I'm a huge fan of Monterey but some compatibility issues I had with iCloud and Photos under Mojave are resolved now that I upgraded the OS. Under Mojave, I constantly had issues with proper syncing of contacts. That appears to be resolved now. I had an issue with Photos and my iPhone 14 Pro (with iOS 16). Photos under Mojave wouldn't import pics and vids. This is not an issue under Monterey.

At some point, when I move to an M1, M2, Mwhatever Mac, I'll give up running the virtual machines since they won't run on them and delegate the older mac to the job at each location. This assume that nobody finds a relatively easy way to make running an Intel OS virtual machine on an M1. As Tiangou mentioned, it isn't feasible. Yet.

The bigger concern is creating a new backup system since cloning under Carbon Copy Cloner 6 doesn't work in the same manner as it did previously. It's going to be a multistep, multidrive process now.

Use CCC6 to perform a standard backup to a drive dedicated for the job. Call it a Migration Drive. Install the Mac OS on a different drive. Call it the Clone Drive. Use Migration Assistant to restore from the Migration Drive to the Clone drive. Boot from the Clone drive to ensure everything transferred and works properly.

Haven't tried that yet but will do so shortly. I'm using my home machine as the test platform for Monterey, running the virtual machine and for the aforementioned cloning method.

Robert

I upgraded from High Sierra to whatever was the latest and greatest of the summer. My motivation was to move away from what I saw as a buggy iTunes to Apple‘s newer apps Music and TV. Huge mistake. The new applications are terrible. Much worse than iTunes. I haven’t found a single operating system feature that I would consider an upgrade. I don’t think I could recommend that anyone should upgrade.

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Ukulele music I couldn't find anywhere else.
[colquhoun.info]

Dave,

I concur about the new system for managing music and managing phones. A local backup of my iPhone 14 Pro took about 5 minutes in iTunes under Mojave. It took nearly 30 minutes in the Finder under Monterey. Unacceptable.

One of the reasons I upgraded is because Photos under Mojave couldn't import new photos into the library from my 14 Pro under iOS 16. Kept getting an error. Under Monterey, Photos had a tremendous amount of trouble importing new photos from my phone to the library. It took multiple attempts to finally get them imported and it kept trying to import photos that already existed in the library. Big pain in the butt.

I suspect Apple wants us to use iCloud syncing of photos from phones to Photos. 'course, that means needing lots of storage. Will have to upgrade to the 2TB plan to make it happen at more than twice the expense of the 200GB plan.

Can't say I'm happy.

The issue is I have to be able to import Photos and not rely on iCloud to do it for me. So, I'll likely keep stabbing away at Monterey. If Apple fixes the Mojave import issue, though, I'll probably revert.

Robert

Can’t think of any reason to do it. Everything I use regularly is several OS versions back. I have one running Catalina, another on Big Sur. The others are all earlier. Sierra and High Sierra seem to be the sweet spot for my purposes.

Every release is more of a locked down PITA.

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My life goes smoothly and in regular intervals

Old people are irritating.