Took my wife's 2015 Toyota RAV/4 to the dealership for 55K mile service.

"It's going to take a while, we have to replace the coolant, brake fluid, transmission fluid, AWD differential fluid".

" No, you do not according to the maintenance schedule. Please follow that. Inspect and let me know. Don't do anything other than oil change and tire rotations. Give me the report."

Angry typing later, and I signed the order and am sitting here in their waiting room "working".

Not coming back here.

sad, but so true

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!#$@@$#!

Quod suus via crustulum saxum

Whatever you do, don't look at their standard hourly rate, not only for your own safety, but for the sake of innocent bystanders.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2023 05:15PM by Acer.

yes, but at least their techs are getting a decent piece piece of that pie.

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!#$@@$#!

Quod suus via crustulum saxum

ah, the results of the car buying market tanking

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Hurts like a bastid...

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mrbigstuff
ah, the results of the car buying market tanking

doesn't that imply that 'stealships' are a new thing? This has ALWAYS been the case.

Brake fluid? That’s unusual unless you are changing master cylinder or the brake lines IMHO. Differential fluid is typically changed at 100K unless you went off-roading and the differential was submerged.

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Acer

I must have seen this before because I remember the ID-10T

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Forrest
Brake fluid? That’s unusual unless you are changing master cylinder or the brake lines IMHO. Differential fluid is typically changed at 100K unless you went off-roading and the differential was submerged.

if you listen to the car talk shows on AM radio . They recommend changing brake fluid because it is hydroscopic . Especially on new cars .

thanks Acer. I need to have my mech check the blinker fluid..

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!#$@@$#!

Quod suus via crustulum saxum

I recall going to my stealership’s body shop after a fender bender some time ago. The arrogant master was going over with his student how to maximize profits — right in front of me. The estimate came to $2,000. I took it down the street to Maaco and had it done for $250.

Why does toyota make their cars so hard to work on? I can change the oil on my VW from the engine bay.

Also -

Man walks into dealership, man surprised by high prices, recommendations of unnecessary work.


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I guess I'd hope to find an unnecessarily well run jiffy lube or similar. I doubt indy shops would make time to change oil unless you're an established customer at this point.

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srf1957

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Forrest
Brake fluid? That’s unusual unless you are changing master cylinder or the brake lines IMHO. Differential fluid is typically changed at 100K unless you went off-roading and the differential was submerged.

if you listen to the car talk shows on AM radio . They recommend changing brake fluid because it is hydroscopic . Especially on new cars .

This. Regular brake fluid changes are an important maintenance item. IIRC, the interval is 20K miles between changes on my 2014 Infiniti QX70. I just had it done recently and the difference absolutely was noticeable.

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It is what it is.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2023 06:07PM by N-OS X-tasy!.

The original post mirrors my last experience at a Honda dealer. I asked them to do an oil change and tire rotation. They wrote the order for a more expensive maintenance “package” with a lot of things I didn’t want. I was finally able to get just what I wanted but it cost $60 more than had I gone to my usual garage. My sense is that they believe they should be the one to chose what your vehicle needs done, even if it means overruling the owner. Never again.

My next car will be an EV, and it can't come soon enough. I look forward to buying a product for which maintenance is not a major profit center.

I believe the term you want here is Hygroscopic.

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Hurts like a bastid...

I went to a national chain muffler/brake shop (Monro) because my normal independent mechanic couldn't get me in within the window I needed the car. I was not in a position to shop around.I might have saved money going to the dealer, the bill was huge for a brake job. They used to be at least mid-tier pricing, but not anymore.

I think there's class action suit in there somewhere for car repairs in general. These places charge for four hours of work even if they spend 90 minutes on it, because that's what the computer says the time it "should" take.

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hal

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mrbigstuff
ah, the results of the car buying market tanking

doesn't that imply that 'stealships' are a new thing? This has ALWAYS been the case.

this is true, but I think the $5k and $10k markups on top of the usual prices were going to their heads

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Hurts like a bastid...

some years ago, my spouse took her Silverado to the local dealer for a engine light issue. With modern OBD, the problem was narrowed down a lot.
It was some kind of vacuum issue. All dealers and most mechs subscribe to a service database that points to likely causes of OBD errors.
The dealer picked the most expensive, but last on the list to try 1st.
$700.
It was a faulty gas cap. $30 at our non-dealer mech.
Though she may buy another Chevy, it won't be locally bought.

I was livid and wanted her to go back. But it's her vehicle and she was willing to accept the "lesson". That was the last time she took it to a NY thief.

After that, I used the dealer rater database to find a dealer to lease from. The dealership changed hands and sank to the bottom of the list.

In my most recent car shop, I found that almost no dealers here in the longylund boonies, have a good rating, no matter what make.
Sure, some people do alright, but it seems not the majority.

Seems NNJ, SNJ, W Ct and Westchester have the highest rated dealers and service depts for many makes, that are the closest.

Those 4 areas have one thing in common, rich folk.

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!#$@@$#!

Quod suus via crustulum saxum

My perspective is different (I own a transmission and driveline shop).

The fluids in your car have a finite life. There is no such thing as “lifetime” fluids.

As mentioned, brake fluid is hygroscopic, and should be changed every 2 years. Coolant should also be flushed every 2 years.

The other fluids - transmission, transfer case, differentials should be changed. We advise every 50k miles. The maintenance makes a huge difference, and is much cheaper than rebuilding/replacing any of those items.

I believe that manufacturers do car owners a disservice by not addressing maintenance for anything except engine oil. I see the results of that deferred/undone maintenance every day, and the costs of ignoring that maintenance, too.

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cbelt3
"It's going to take a while, we have to replace the coolant, brake fluid, transmission fluid, AWD differential fluid".

" No, you do not according to the maintenance schedule. Please follow that."

…and that's why nobody works on my cars but me. Two 2017 Mazda cars with a combined 75,000 miles and only maintenance has been required so far. If they require repairs at some point I'll do that too.

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cbelt3
Took my wife's 2015 Toyota RAV/4 to the dealership for 55K mile service.

"It's going to take a while, we have to replace the coolant, brake fluid, transmission fluid, AWD differential fluid".

" No, you do not according to the maintenance schedule. Please follow that. Inspect and let me know. Don't do anything other than oil change and tire rotations. Give me the report."...

Looks like they were going to do the 60,000 mile recommended service. Cooling system and transmission fluid changes are often done at 60k. Not sure about the differential or the brake fluid.

The maintenance guide is kind of vague on the subject, using the word "inspect" in a few places where really it's time for a full change.

Check the forums here for advice as to appropriate maintenance: [www.rav4world.com]

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/19/2023 06:19AM by Tiangou.

My only complaint about my local Nissan dealer was that they instituted a "Diagnostic Fee" at some point.

Me dropping it off for an oil change. "There's a weird noise coming from the left front tire. Could you look and see if there's anything obviously wrong?"

Them: "Sure, but there will be a $120 diagnostic fee."

They used to just look and say, "Yeah, your brake pads need to be replaced." and I would say "Do it."

I've been saying it for a decade but I would NEVER let a woman walk into the repair portion of a new car dealership solo. The "repair advisors" are worse than the soulless sales guys. And all those guys should die of bloody ass cancer as it is.

cbelt3 needs to find an independent local shop.

mine does everything short of major transmission & engine work.

as for brake fluid, per discussion on other forums the reality is it rarely gets fully replaced...normally just topped-off when new pads are needed.

Anyone have a link to a general guide to periodic auto maintenance? I don't trust the guide my dealer gave me because I think it recommends the gold standard maintenance schedule rather than what is generally considered necessary and practical.

The vehicle's owner's manual should be available somewhere and have specific recommendations as to what services are required and when, for that vehicle.

I assume that's where cbelt got his information about what was recommended at that time.

If I had trouble getting what I wanted from a dealer or any mechanic, it would be time to back out and look elsewhere.

Maybe someone else can confirm it, but I believe in CA we get to see a written work order with estimate in advance of signing.

No other work can be done unless authorized in advance.

I've only used a dealer for service maybe four or five times, for warranty work only.

That was enough to send me looking for an independent mechanic, and I've found a good one.

I hope the shop stays in business a good long while.


This brings up a C-22 about eVs.

They need less maintenance than ICE mobiles, but how many indie mechanics can work on them?

Or, more pointedly, what work could an indie wrench be expected to perform, other than maybe rotate tires?

And that could be done where the tires were purchased.

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RAMd®d
The vehicle's owner's manual should be available somewhere and have specific recommendations as to what services are required and when, for that vehicle.

Yes. Always follow the maintenance schedule specified in the owner's manual.

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RAMd®d
If I had trouble getting what I wanted from a dealer or any mechanic, it would be time to back out and look elsewhere.

Absolutely.

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RAMd®d
Maybe someone else can confirm it, but I believe in CA we get to see a written work order with estimate in advance of signing.

No other work can be done unless authorized in advance.

That is correct.

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It is what it is.

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Ammo
The original post mirrors my last experience at a Honda dealer. I asked them to do an oil change and tire rotation. They wrote the order for a more expensive maintenance “package” with a lot of things I didn’t want. I was finally able to get just what I wanted but it cost $60 more than had I gone to my usual garage. My sense is that they believe they should be the one to chose what your vehicle needs done, even if it means overruling the owner. Never again.

Yep. I took our CRV in for a warranty repair (first repair ever on Honda's going back to 1986!). Unfortunately my wife answered the phone when the service manager called with several things that "needed doing"--none of which were part of the recommended services. That was a pretty expensive warranty repair!

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Ammo
Anyone have a link to a general guide to periodic auto maintenance? I don't trust the guide my dealer gave me because I think it recommends the gold standard maintenance schedule rather than what is generally considered necessary and practical.

It depends on model. More so than even that, however, is to read a model-specific forum for very acute instances of maintenance and what parts to monitor.

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Hurts like a bastid...

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Ammo
Anyone have a link to a general guide to periodic auto maintenance? I don't trust the guide my dealer gave me because I think it recommends the gold standard maintenance schedule rather than what is generally considered necessary and practical.

Owner's Manual in your glove compartment is your best resource. Just remember, there's Required Maintenance (manufacturer) and Recommended Maintenance (stealership). And as mentioned, various owners' forums are out there to hear from others who own and care for what you have.

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wurm

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Ammo
Anyone have a link to a general guide to periodic auto maintenance? I don't trust the guide my dealer gave me because I think it recommends the gold standard maintenance schedule rather than what is generally considered necessary and practical.

Owner's Manual in your glove compartment is your best resource. Just remember, there's Required Maintenance (manufacturer) and Recommended Maintenance (stealership). And as mentioned, various owners' forums are out there to hear from others who own and care for what you have.

My owner’s manual does not list recommended maintenance by milage. The vehicle provides reminders to have service “packages” that are due at regular intervals, but you are forced to take the dealer’s word for what you need to have done. I didn’t explain it well, but that’s what I meant in my original post.

What happens when the owners manual/manufacturer does not specify maintenance, or a la BMW and Mercedes in the 00’s, claimed that transmission and other fluids are “lifetime fill”, leading to deferred maintenance, failed components and class action lawsuits?

Sometimes you have to use common sense, and, sometimes, the dealer is not lying to you.

The worst thing you can do for the systems in a motor vehicle is pretend that maintenance is unnecessary (even on EV’s).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/21/2023 07:59AM by Cary.