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if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: October 31, 2023 08:06PM
.....20% brighter.....


........M3 Pro chip in the new 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro has 25% less memory bandwidth than the M1 Pro and M2 Pro chips......


......new M3 14-inch MacBook Pro features two Thunderbolt 3 USB-C ports, not three Thunderbolt 4 ports like the 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro models powered by M3 Pro and M3 Max chips......


New 14-Inch and 16-Inch MacBook Pros Feature 20% Brighter Displays

.....The new 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro models announced by Apple today feature 20% brighter displays for standard content, according to Apple.

Apple's tech specs for the laptops indicate that all of the latest 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro models provide up to 600 nits of peak brightness for SDR content, which is a 20% increase over the 500 nits maximum on the previous models. For HDR content, all of the models can achieve peak brightness of up to 1,600 nits, which is unchanged.

"The Liquid Retina XDR display is the world's best laptop display, with an exceptional 1000 nits sustained and 1600 nits of peak brightness for HDR content, impressive contrast ratio, vivid colors, and an outstanding viewing angle," said Apple. "SDR content is now displayed at up to 600 nits, which is 20 percent brighter than before."

The new MacBook Pro models are available to order starting today, and they will begin arriving to customers and launch in stores on Tuesday, November 7. Read our MacBook Pro announcement coverage for more details about the laptops......



...........brighter..........?!


Apple M3 Pro Chip Has 25% Less Memory Bandwidth Than M1/M2 Pro

.....Apple's latest M3 Pro chip in the new 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro has 25% less memory bandwidth than the M1 Pro and M2 Pro chips used in equivalent models from the two previous generations.

Based on the latest 3-nanometer technology and featuring all-new GPU architecture, the M3 series of chips is said to represent the fastest and most power-efficient evolution of Apple silicon thus far. For example, the 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro with M3 Pro chip is up to 40% faster than the 16-inch model with M1 Pro, according to Apple.

However, looking at Apple's own hardware specifications, the M3 Pro system on a chip (SoC) features 150GB/s memory bandwidth, compared to 200GB/s on the earlier M1 Pro and M2 Pro. As for the M3 Max, Apple says it is capable of "up to 400GB/s." This wording is because the less pricey scaled-down M3 Max with 14-core CPU and 30-core GPU has only 300GB/s of memory bandwidth, whereas the equivalent scaled-down M2 Max with 12-core CPU and 30-core GPU featured 400GB/s bandwidth, just like its more powerful 12?core CPU, 38?core GPU version.

Notably, Apple has also changed the core ratios of the higher-tier M3 Pro chip compared to its direct predecessor. The M3 Pro with 12-core CPU has 6 performance cores (versus 8 performance cores on the 12-core M2 Pro) and 6 efficiency cores (versus 4 efficiency cores on the 12-core M2 Pro), while the GPU has 18 cores (versus 19 on the equivalent M2 Pro chip).

Additionally, while the M3 chip's 16-core Neural Engine has the same number of cores as the one Apple featured in the 3nm-based A17 Pro chip that debuted in the iPhone 15 Pro series in September, it's comparatively weaker on paper in terms of maximum achievable throughput, which is measured in trillions of operations per second (TOPS).

According to Apple, the M3 Neural Engine is capable of 18 TOPS, whereas the A17 Pro Neural Engine is capable of 35 TOPS. It's hard to say for certain, but it is possible that the iPhone 15 Pro requires a higher performing Neural Engine for features like computational photography and Face ID, whereas the M3 can compensate in other areas like machine learning by utilizing its additional GPU cores.

Taken together, it's presently unclear what real-world difference these changes make to M3 performance when pitted against Apple's equivalent precursor chips in various usage scenarios, especially given that the latest processors include new Dynamic Caching memory allocation technology which ensures that only the exact amount of memory needed is used for each task.

This opaqueness is not helped by the fact that Apple advertises the power of the new M3 Pro and M3 Max chips by repeatedly emphasizing comparisons to the M1 Pro and M1 Max, rather than the more recent M2 variants, against which performance gains appear more modest. Hopefully we will learn more in time when the first thoroughgoing third-party benchmarks become available.

The new MacBook Pro models are available to order now, and they will begin arriving to customers and launch in stores on Tuesday, November 7. Be sure to check out our MacBook Pro announcement coverage for all the details........



........memory..........bandwidth..........?!


14-Inch MacBook Pro With M3 Chip Has Only Two Thunderbolt 3 Ports

.....Apple's new M3 14-inch MacBook Pro features two Thunderbolt 3 USB-C ports, not three Thunderbolt 4 ports like the 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro models powered by M3 Pro and M3 Max chips.



Apart from having fewer USB-C ports, the lack of Thunderbolt 4 support on the 14-inch MacBook Pro with the base M3 chip means it only supports one display with up to 6K resolution at 60Hz, or one display with up to 4K resolution at 120Hz over HDMI.

In comparison, like the M2 Pro chip it replaces, the M3 Pro supports up to two external displays with up to 6K resolution at 60Hz over Thunderbolt. The M3 Pro-powered MacBook Pro models also support one external display with up to 6K resolution at 60Hz over Thunderbolt and one external display with up to 4K resolution at 144Hz over HDMI.

Meanwhile, the M3 Max supports up to four external displays in the following configuration: Up to three external displays with 6K resolution at 60Hz over Thunderbolt and one external display with up to 4K resolution at 144Hz over HDMI.

Alternatively, M3 Max MacBook Pro models can support up to three external displays by connecting two displays with 6K resolution at 60Hz over Thunderbolt and one display with up to 8K resolution at 60Hz, or one display with 4K resolution at 240Hz over HDMI.

Lastly, both the M3 Pro and M3 Max also support native DisplayPort over USB-C, and one display with up to 8K resolution at 60Hz or 4K resolution at 240Hz over HDMI.

The new MacBook Pro models are available to order now, and they will begin arriving to customers and launch in stores on Tuesday, November 7. Be sure to check out our MacBook Pro announcement coverage for all the details.......



........Thunderbolt.........ports..........?!



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/31/2023 08:07PM by NewtonMP2100.
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: sekker
Date: October 31, 2023 08:14PM
I'd love to have an HDMI port on the right-hand side of my MBA15.
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: anonymouse1
Date: October 31, 2023 08:29PM
Nope. Used 14" MBP M1 for me-all the ports, two monitors, about half the price. I'm not earning my living through it, so a new one isn't worth the price.

And the gouging! $200 to upgrade from 8GB RAM to 16GB!
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: Carnos Jax
Date: October 31, 2023 08:31PM
Here's some posts from Slashdot users that may be relevant (regarding the memory bandwidth):

Quote
MachineShedFred
I don't have a dog in this fight because I'm not looking to buy a new laptop from anyone in the next 18 to 24 months, but really this isn't hard. Consider the following postulated decision flow:

1. M2 has X memory bandwidth, but usage statistics show it's almost never used because performance is bottlenecked elsewhere in the system. Thus, each part is more expensive because you're including capacity that is never used.

2. M3 development possibly made two different prototypes due to #1; one with an equal X memory bandwidth, and one with X - n memory bandwidth. These two parts were then tested to see what the difference, if any, is.

3. They discovered that only the highest core count M3 actually required X memory bandwidth, and chips with less active cores never got into using it, so having two parts with different memory bandwidth capacities makes sense.

This is how this kind of thing usually comes about - the design has been refined and instead of just putting a massive memory controller and memory on regardless of cost, they've tuned it a bit better to reduce part and fab costs and complexity in order to deliver what's needed to make the whole system perform better, but not have unused expensive capacity unless it actually can be used.

Really, it's no different than putting really fast RAM on your Ryzen CPU that doesn't get you any more performance than buying cheaper RAM that clocks 1:1 with the memory controller. Yes, technically there is more bandwidth there because the clock is higher, but it won't ever be used by the system during real operation.

I don't know why people would be bitching about having a better tuned system, other than the fact that Apple will never pass on the cost savings being realized by having a better tuned configuration in the products.

But then

Quote
gotamd
I saw a Youtube video from Snazzy Labs that discussed these points and speculated that it's due to yields from the TSMC 3NB process, which is presumably what these chips are produced on (like the A17 Pro in the new iPhone Pro 15). I'm guessing that due to poor yields, Apple finds themselves having to disable cores in quite a few of the M3-based chips, which is why we see decreased memory bandwidth and core count along with so many different variations of the chip vs. in prior generations. Does that have a performance impact? I'm sure it does. Does it make the chips perform worse than the M1 and/or M2 in any real-world benchmarks? I guess we'll find out soon.

I wonder if we'll see an M3 Macbook Air at some point. Sticking the M3 only in the iMac and 14" Pro will ensure there isn't a huge demand for it and it will also keep margins higher. Maybe the MBA will skip the M3 generation altogether, or maybe if yields of Pro and Max binned chips are bad enough and demand for the iMac and 14" MBP w/ vanilla M3 are low enough, Apple will throw an M3 refresh MBA out there.

The only thing about the M3 that currently looks appealing is AV1 decode support. My guess is that the M4 generation, still on "3nm" but maybe a better yielding version, will probably "fix" a lot of these oddities with core count and memory bandwidth on the M3 generation.

Relevant thread: [apple.slashdot.org]
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: rz
Date: November 01, 2023 11:41AM
Quote
anonymouse1
Nope. Used 14" MBP M1 for me-all the ports, two monitors, about half the price. I'm not earning my living through it, so a new one isn't worth the price.

And the gouging! $200 to upgrade from 8GB RAM to 16GB!

I may go this route as well. I don't really need a new laptop... I barely use my 10+ year old MBP. But if I do decide to upgrade, I'll probably look at something like a 14" M1 Pro MBP.
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: Bill in NC
Date: November 01, 2023 03:21PM
Bought the 14" M1 MBP 16GB/1TB as well earlier this year.

The 3 versus 4 USB ports is a nickel-and-dime move...now two different bottom case designs.
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: Rolando
Date: November 02, 2023 07:11AM
Quote
rz
Quote
anonymouse1
Nope. Used 14" MBP M1 for me-all the ports, two monitors, about half the price. I'm not earning my living through it, so a new one isn't worth the price.

And the gouging! $200 to upgrade from 8GB RAM to 16GB!

I may go this route as well. I don't really need a new laptop... I barely use my 10+ year old MBP. But if I do decide to upgrade, I'll probably look at something like a 14" M1 Pro MBP.

Before you go used....
[www.apple.com]



San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

"I don’t want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it." - Billy Graham 1981

"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: AllGold
Date: November 02, 2023 03:02PM
Quote
Rolando
Quote
rz
Quote
anonymouse1
Nope. Used 14" MBP M1 for me-all the ports, two monitors, about half the price. I'm not earning my living through it, so a new one isn't worth the price.

And the gouging! $200 to upgrade from 8GB RAM to 16GB!

I may go this route as well. I don't really need a new laptop... I barely use my 10+ year old MBP. But if I do decide to upgrade, I'll probably look at something like a 14" M1 Pro MBP.

Before you go used....
[www.apple.com]

Yes, but the Apple refurbs are still the same too-high price they've been all along.
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Re: if they asked me, I could right a book?!.....some spec info for the new MacBooks.......
Posted by: Rolando
Date: November 04, 2023 02:09PM
Quote
AllGold
Quote
Rolando
Quote
rz
Quote
anonymouse1
Nope. Used 14" MBP M1 for me-all the ports, two monitors, about half the price. I'm not earning my living through it, so a new one isn't worth the price.

And the gouging! $200 to upgrade from 8GB RAM to 16GB!

I may go this route as well. I don't really need a new laptop... I barely use my 10+ year old MBP. But if I do decide to upgrade, I'll probably look at something like a 14" M1 Pro MBP.

Before you go used....
[www.apple.com]
Yes, but the Apple refurbs are still the same too-high price they've been all along.


Damn good deal!
[slickdeals.net]
Apple MacBook Pro (Refurb w/ 1-Yr Apple Warranty): M1 Pro, 14.2" Liquid Retina XDR



San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

"I don’t want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it." - Billy Graham 1981

"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater
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