[wapo.st]

Gary LaBush remembers the first time he sat behind the wheel of an electric Ford e-transit delivery truck at the Frito-Lay distribution center in Queens. Like most first-time EV truck drivers, LaBush wondered if the vehicle was actually on. “I was like, ‘What’s going on?’” he recalled. “There was no noise — and no fumes.”

Now, LaBush trains other drivers on how to operate a fleet of 40 delivery trucks at the Frito-Lay facility. The 49-year-old, who has worked at the company for over two decades, said he would struggle if he had to return to gas. “I wouldn’t want to do it,” he said. “After being in this — it’s just night and day.”

LaBush belongs to a small but growing group of commercial medium-to-heavy-duty truck drivers who use electric trucks. These drivers — many of whom operate local or regional routes that don’t require hundreds of miles on the road in a day — generally welcome the transition to electric, praising their new trucks’ handling, acceleration, smoothness and quiet operation.

But some companies and trucking associations worry this shift, spurred in part by a California law mandating a switch to electric or emissions-free trucks by 2042, is happening too fast. While electric trucks might work well in some cases, they argue, the upfront costs of the vehicles and their charging infrastructure are often too heavy a lift.

For the United States to meet its climate goals, virtually all trucks must be zero-emissions by 2050. While trucks are only 4 percent of the vehicles on the road, they make up almost a quarter of the country’s transportation emissions.

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Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.

Aside from moving off fossil fuels to avert the carbon heating effects contributing to catastrophic climate change, a piece missing from this electrification agenda is the benefit to everyone who would interact with these vehicles. The quiet operation and lack of emissions benefits the driver and the communities these vehicles drive through.

An additional requirement that should have been integrated into the electrification push is sustainability of these vehicles. The car companies should be building these things to LAST, but if they do that, they'll lose sales, as we need to buy all these vehicles NOW and then replace them occasionally and slowly over time.

Current average annual sales is 15-16 million. We need to be buying 2-3 times that for the next decade until the ICE vehicles are gone, but then probably only buying 5-8 million annually (if not fewer.)

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g=

Local delivery routes are perfect for EV trucks. Low total miles, all in town at low speeds, they sit all night and can charge. Nothing not to like for that use case. The total cost of ownership should show a significant savings.

For commercial/industrial areas the power infrastructure is already there. 1300A 480V service is commonly available and you could easily install transformer, breaker box and chargers for 40 EV trucks.

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C(-)ris
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C(-)ris
Local delivery routes are perfect for EV trucks. Low total miles, all in town at low speeds, they sit all night and can charge. Nothing not to like for that use case. The total cost of ownership should show a significant savings.

For commercial/industrial areas the power infrastructure is already there. 1300A 480V service is commonly available and you could easily install transformer, breaker box and chargers for 40 EV trucks.

And USPS delivery should mostly be via EVs.

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Bill in NC
And USPS delivery should mostly be via EVs.

...and if I remember correctly, someone made sure that didn't happen.

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School buses would probably be a good option as well. The bus drivers would have to deal with screaming kids instead of the engine.

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macphanatic
School buses would probably be a good option as well. The bus drivers would have to deal with screaming kids instead of the engine.

kids wouldn't have to scream so loud without an ICE.

Truckers are limited to 11 hours of driving in any 24 hour period (14 total hours). That equates to a maximum of about 600 miles from terminal to terminal, even more miles in 75 MPH states. Hard to imagine trucks fast charging daily because doing so would be too hard on currently available batteries. But buy two or three trucks per driver and a reasonable charging regimen could be incorporated. That would not be economically feasible so better battery tech needs to come along before long haul trucks are practical. Or figure out a way to quickly and easily swap battery packs which is doable with a homogeneous fleet using current technology.

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Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.

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macphanatic
School buses would probably be a good option as well. The bus drivers would have to deal with screaming kids instead of the engine.

I’ve read an article where an electrified school bus required more maintenance according to the fleet manager. The manager did not elaborate.

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Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.

The Tesla Semis sure look different from what we're used to seeing.



Pepsi has a fleet of them operating out of Sacramento, CA. Gizmodo.com

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Northern California Coast

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Speedy
The manager did not elaborate.

I think you have your answer.

Some say the lack of noise from electric vehicles can pose a danger to pedestrians and other vehicles. As a precaution, I propose that all electric cars and trucks be required to play ice cream truck music while in motion.

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mattkime

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Speedy
The manager did not elaborate.

I think you have your answer.

reminds me of PC IT guys in the 90s saying that Macs req'd more service than PCs also without elaboration...

School buses are already happening. This is just Blue Bird and just Cali....

Blue Bird has delivered in California its 1,500th electric school bus

There complaints about E-buses in rural areas with long bus routes. But the use case works in urban and suburban areas...

And it continues this week

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The Los Angeles Unified School District ordered 180 electric school buses.... This school district says this latest electric school bus purchase is expected to save a yearly average of $10,000 per bus in maintenance and fuel costs compared to diesel school buses, for a total savings of $2 million annually.

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Speedy
Truckers are limited to 11 hours of driving in any 24 hour period (14 total hours). That equates to a maximum of about 600 miles from terminal to terminal, even more miles in 75 MPH states. Hard to imagine trucks fast charging daily because doing so would be too hard on currently available batteries. But buy two or three trucks per driver and a reasonable charging regimen could be incorporated. That would not be economically feasible so better battery tech needs to come along before long haul trucks are practical. Or figure out a way to quickly and easily swap battery packs which is doable with a homogeneous fleet using current technology.

That's per driver. I've seen a bunch of couples as drivers at client sites. One drives, the other sleeps. Maximizes on the road hours. The ones I've spoken with did predominantly long haul.

Pepsico is begging for more Tesla semis. They've proven to be very effective.

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MacResource User Map: [www.zeemaps.com]#

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numbered
There complaints about E-buses in rural areas with long bus routes. But the use case works in urban and suburban areas...

Actually I worked in a very rural school district with very long routes. Some kids rode 50 minutes to get to school. It is also in a very "red" part of the state. Surprisingly they got their first electric bus about 8 years ago and now have all electric busses. The only negative thing is that they had to reduce the number of mechanic positions. Who knew? Electric busses were far less problematic in cold weather than diesel busses.

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“Live your life, love your life, don’t regret…live, learn and move forward positively.” – CR Johnson
Loving life in Lake Tahoe, CA

<<many of whom operate local or regional routes that don’t require hundreds of miles on the road in a day>>>

.

kids wouldn't have to scream so loud without an ICE.

Yeah, that's why kids scream.


I propose that all electric cars and trucks be required to play ice cream truck music while in motion.


POMTL!

That would be so awesome.

I did hear an ev, Tesla I think, making an odd Jetson sound, but then I've heard several Teslas that didn't, so I don't know that what-whyfor.

BUT- If I owned an eV where that was required, I'd have a playlist of warning sounds (Close Encounters message, F-1 Lotus, Hailwood's 6-cyl Honda 250), and an ice cream jingle would be one of them!

Maybe some ultrasonic sounds to alert canines in the area?

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I am that Masked Man.

All you can do, is all you can do.

There’s trouble — it's time to play the sound of my people.

Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

I've been to the edge of the map, and there be monsters.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody counts or nobody counts.

When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men except
by believing all possible evil of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.

Chief mechanics are going to against EV for the simple reason that it would mean laying off most of their diesel mechanics. No one likes giving up their little kingdom, especially when it is filled with friends and family.

Not a good reason, but a realistic one.

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“No persons are more frequently wrong, than those who will not admit they are wrong.” -- François de La Rochefoucauld

"Those who cannot accept the past are condemned to revise it." -- Geo. Mathias

The German word for contraceptive is “Schwangerschaftsverhütungsmittel”. By the time you finished saying that, it’s too late

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Markintosh
Surprisingly they got their first electric bus about 8 years ago and now have all electric busses.

I am not surprised. I have seen complaints but they may just be political. I think the economics will win.

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Ombligo
Chief mechanics are going to against EV for the simple reason that it would mean laying off most of their diesel mechanics. No one likes giving up their little kingdom, especially when it is filled with friends and family.

Not a good reason, but a realistic one.

Same reason many IT departments don't want to switch to Macs. Anyone who has switched knows different. IBM(of all companies) has been keeping track and putting out hard data on their savings for many years now: [www.computerworld.com].

There are plenty of good reasons to keep using PCs, most of which revolve around proprietary PC based software that is the industry standard or business use functions that a Mac simply cannot perform, but none of those reasons are because they are easier to manage or cost less in the long run.

Same with EVs. There are many use cases where EVs make perfect sense and will show a large cost savings if your business falls within certain parameters. There are also plenty of use cases where an EV would be a horrible decision like over the road trucking or if you take a lot of roadtrips.

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C(-)ris
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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2024 04:45PM by C(-)ris.

Change is difficult.

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“Every great and deep difficulty bears in itself its own solution. It forces us to change our thinking in order to find it."

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C(-)ris
Local delivery routes are perfect for EV trucks. Low total miles, all in town at low speeds, they sit all night and can charge. Nothing not to like for that use case. The total cost of ownership should show a significant savings.

For commercial/industrial areas the power infrastructure is already there. 1300A 480V service is commonly available and you could easily install transformer, breaker box and chargers for 40 EV trucks.

one huge difference between IC delivery vehicles and EV delivery vehicles is that traditional friction braking on delivery vehicles is a huge wear item with heavy maintenance costs. Regenerative braking in an EV, or even in a hybrid, really cuts down on maintenance time and costs.

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"Defending your own life when in immediate danger to me is a basic right of each person. " Lemon Drop 11/17/2023 03:10 pm

Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008) Private citizens have the right under the Second Amendment to possess an ordinary type of weapon and use it for lawful, historically established situations such as self-defense in a home, even when there is no relationship to a local militia.

"The conclusion is thus inescapable that the history, concept, and wording of the second amendment to the Constitution of the United States, as well as its interpretation by every major commentator and court in the first half-century after its ratification, indicates that what is protected is an individual right of a private citizen to own and carry firearms in a peaceful manner." Right to Keep and Bear Arms: Report of the Subcommittee on the Constitution of the Committee on the Judiciary, United States Senate, Ninety-seventh Congress, Second Session. U.S. Government Printing Office. 1982. Digitized September 30, 2008.

From the NYSRPA v Bruen "Today, we decline to adopt that two-part approach. . . . Despite the popularity of this two-step approach, it is one step too many. Step one of the predominant framework is broadly consistent with Heller, which demands a test rooted in the Second Amendment's text, as informed by history."

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Numo
Some say the lack of noise from electric vehicles can pose a danger to pedestrians and other vehicles. As a precaution, I propose that all electric cars and trucks be required to play ice cream truck music while in motion.

Our 2013 Volt is quite quiet when in gear. Our 2014 ELR makes a pedestrian warning noise when in gear that sounds like a quiet ICE car idling at a traffic light. Likely the feds made a regulation change for 2014.

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Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.