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Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: mattkime
Date: January 05, 2025 11:13PM
I've removed an ancient toilet, replacing it with something relatively modern and efficient. The rough in distance is approximately 15" - yeah, its annoying. I'd like to move the flange 3" toward the wall, which will preserve a remaining inch between the toilet and the wall. The flange is made of cast iron and there's about 6" between my basement ceiling and the bell on the piece it connects to. I'm pretty sure I can make the PVC work if the desired bit of cast iron was gone.

I already have the replacement toilet with the standard 12" rough in. I've moved it from elsewhere in the house - this was our last toilet to replace since buying the house. Yes, I could get a 14" rough in toilet but it would still be 2" from the wall. I'm trying this path for now.

Perhaps I can get a soil pipe cutter into that space or perhaps not. I can find out by giving home depot $25. The alternative would be cutting further down BUT thats a junction piece that receives a bathroom sink and shower. I lean toward cutting out less pipe but I really just want to figure out the easier path.


[www.homedepot.com]

Anyway, I guess I'm interested in hearing any advice that I might be taking the wrong path OR failing that, your prayers.

Now, the pics - a wider shot and a closer shot. Both are essentially directly below the flange, which I wish to move to the left. There's plenty to ignore as well - the copper supply lines, the romex which I THINK goes to an outdoor outlet.


I'm having trouble finding a convenient way to resize images -

[imgur.com]







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/05/2025 11:15PM by mattkime.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Speedy
Date: January 05, 2025 11:45PM
You are a lot more ambitious than me. I would call a plumber.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: JoeH
Date: January 06, 2025 12:46AM
Simple solution, get a toilet that matches the rough in. Otherwise get a plumber. I have experience cutting cast iron pipe and I wouldn't attempt doing it in a location with that mess of pipes. And if you haven't used a soil pipe cutter and have experience with one, you run a good chance of breaking more of that pipe than you want. And who put an electrical line right through the middle of all that? A plumber may mutter under their breath while doing the job there, but will have the experience to avoid collateral damage.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: special
Date: January 06, 2025 01:10AM
My prayers.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Bernie
Date: January 06, 2025 04:55AM
I had a hanging toilet in my Mothers that I wanted gone. Called for estimates.

In the grand scheme of things JoeH is spot on.




Staunton, Virginia
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: mattkime
Date: January 06, 2025 06:42AM
Quote
JoeH
And if you haven't used a soil pipe cutter and have experience with one, you run a good chance of breaking more of that pipe than you want.

I'll engage with this because its something I'm particularly skeptical about - at very least, it appears that you attach the cutter to the pipe you want to cut, roughly where you want to cut it. How is something else damaged?



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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Grateful11
Date: January 06, 2025 06:50AM
Quote
mattkime
Quote
JoeH
And if you haven't used a soil pipe cutter and have experience with one, you run a good chance of breaking more of that pipe than you want.

I'll engage with this because its something I'm particularly skeptical about - at very least, it appears that you attach the cutter to the pipe you want to cut, roughly where you want to cut it. How is something else damaged?

Have you ever worked with much cast iron of any kind because it's very unpredictable in almost any state. It's not like steel you're not actually cutting it you're scoring it and hoping it cracks where you want it to.



Grateful11
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Michael
Date: January 06, 2025 07:25AM
The deal I made with my wife decades ago when I first wanted to do a I'm-not-qualified-to-do-it task was that if she wasn't happy with the outcome, I'd hire a pro. That one (and others since) turned out fine.

In this case, I'd first seriously consider just building the wall behind the toilet out by several inches, finishing it and then putting the 12" toilet back in place, 1" from the new wall. We have a 2" bumpout across half the wall in a bathroom because the concrete wall foundation was put in a slightly wrong place. It's never bothered me and I get bothered pretty easily.

If I decided to not build out the wall, I'd rent the tool and give it a shot. The worst that happens is you hire a plumber to finish/fix it. And that will give the plumber a story to tell to his/her colleagues!

Edit: I had forgotten the Sawzall options that Cary and macphanatic mentioned. I'd start there if I was going to cut out the cast iron.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2025 08:43AM by Michael.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Fritz
Date: January 06, 2025 07:30AM
NFW. this is a job for super-plumber.
Unless you're under 40, in great shape, have endless patience and a good vocabulary of 4 letter words and combinations.
It won't be cheap, (depending on your area) but less than an oopsie clean up of the waste pipe.
On the other hand, film the process, so others will learn for your "experience" and you'll have a funny (after the fact) story to tell the next boys nite out.

Short experience story, when I was refurbing my 1st house, my 40 yo very experienced county plumber came to do look at what I was talking about. 1st word out of his mouth started with F and rhymed with firetruck. He wore that word that day.

YMMD, but thoughts and prayers.



"one door closes and another window opens"
Vlad the Impailer.

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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: MikeF
Date: January 06, 2025 07:31AM
How ancient was the toilet and cast iron? You risk cracking it with just a little unnecessary side force. Is the current toilet flange level with the existing floor or is there some room between the flange and floor? They make toilet flange offset extenders. My recommendation is for the plumber -- you don't want to deal with the consequences if something goes wrong.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: special
Date: January 06, 2025 07:35AM
Quote
mattkime
...


I'm having trouble finding a convenient way to resize images -




Just modify the [i-m-g] tag to [i-m-g size=800]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2025 07:36AM by special.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Acer
Date: January 06, 2025 07:37AM
Three inch deep box, as high as the back of the toilet, to provide a shelf for decoration or sundries and give the toilet back its built-in look.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Cary
Date: January 06, 2025 07:46AM
I would use a reciprocating saw and a 9 in. Diamond Grit Reciprocating Saw Blade for Cast Iron Cutting: Blade, and use a Fernco to join the new PVC to the old cast iron...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2025 09:22AM by Cary.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: macphanatic
Date: January 06, 2025 07:46AM
If you have to cut cast iron pipe, buy the Diablo sawzall blade for cast iron. It will cost between $15 and $20. It cuts cast iron like butter. I wouldn't use the old style cutter as you're likely to crack the cast iron.

In which direction are you trying to move in the pictures? It looks like you have two threaded drain lines going into the elbow that would need to be addressed. On top of that, I wonder about structural issues based upon the 3 pieces of 2x coming from the right with the left ends unsupported, one of which is notched for the copper pipe.

Based upon what I'm seeing in the photo, I would leave everything alone and buy a toilet with the correct rough-in. Moving the closet flange looks like it might lead to a major domino effect of modifications.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: C(-)ris
Date: January 06, 2025 08:11AM
I wouldn't touch cast iron plumbing unless you are fully prepared to have to rip it all out and replace with PVC. It is unpredictable where it will crack when moving it around even on the best days with experienced plumbers.



C(-)ris
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: special
Date: January 06, 2025 08:38AM
It goes without saying, but make sure you don't do enough damage that you end up without any working toilets in the house. That would be a crappy situation to be in.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: chopper
Date: January 06, 2025 08:41AM
I'm impressed that you'd attempt this. My 100 year old plumbing looks like this ... luckily a good friend is a plumber and accepts cash for things he can handle during lunch or at the end of the day.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: mattkime
Date: January 06, 2025 08:54AM
Quote
special
It goes without saying, but make sure you don't do enough damage that you end up without any working toilets in the house. That would be a crappy situation to be in.

part of the reason I'm willing to work on this is _nothing_ we're looking at is anything we depend upon. Lies strictly in "nice to have"



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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: Acer
Date: January 06, 2025 11:20AM
More "not what you asked for" advice:
14" rough-in toilets are a thing:

[www.homedepot.com]
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: jh
Date: January 06, 2025 01:20PM
Get a plumber.

A plumber dropped a cast iron toilet drain line that ran from one end of the house bathroom to the stack on another end. It was replaced with PVC. For some reason my BIL who was there with the plumber while I was at work told him I would break it up and remove from the crawl space. That's another story. You would be amazed as what is in toilet cast iron drains installed 70 years ago. Breaking up the pipe was a mess. Wife refused to let me in the house until I changed clothes in our storage building. She told me to just throw the old clothes away.

if it is feasible I would have a plumber replace as much of the stack with PVC if you are planning on doing some cutting, etc.

Daughter's house has all PVC drains except for the stack--cast iron. It started leaking and I just had the plumbers replace the stack. Good thing as some previous owner was digging around the pipe immediately outside the foundation must have broken the top of the cast iron pipe leading to the sewer. He evidently though placing a crushed Coke can on the broken part and covering with dirt would solve his plumbing problems.

Looks like you have some galvanized type of drain pipe(s) also. Depending on what goes in them and how old they may be they sometimes rust. One of mine did.

Unless you are sure you know what you are getting into---get a plumber.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2025 01:21PM by jh.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: mattkime
Date: January 06, 2025 03:34PM
I'm thinking about getting a quote.

The tool I rented didn't fit.


---

Plumber is 2 weeks out. Gives me some time to think about it.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2025 04:41PM by mattkime.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: January 06, 2025 06:37PM
For some reason my BIL who was there with the plumber while I was at work told him I would break it up


Did BIL help with the break up?






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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: macphanatic
Date: January 07, 2025 07:50AM
If you run PVC through areas that are regularly occupied spaces, consider covering them with sound deadening materials. Cast iron waste pipes are pretty quiet, PVC not so much. Nothing like sitting in a living room with company and hearing someone pee in the 2nd floor toilet.
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Re: Is there a plumber in the house? Cast iron pipe and moving a toilet flange
Posted by: clay
Date: January 07, 2025 09:46AM
Quote
macphanatic
If you run PVC through areas that are regularly occupied spaces, consider covering them with sound deadening materials. Cast iron waste pipes are pretty quiet, PVC not so much. Nothing like sitting in a living room with company and hearing someone pee in the 2nd floor toilet.

so true!
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