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Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 20, 2006 12:20PM
[www.sun-sentinel.com]
[www.insideedition.com]

... while I've often made the case here that the female teachers who sleep with male students should absolutely be held accountable for their actions-- in this case, I'm thinking, true, it probably wasn't in good judgment to be doing this on the side.

Yet, she didn't do anything illegal, nor did she break any rules, and it is pretty ridiculous that she has to supplement a teacher's measly income with that of a model, which is obviously much better. It makes a ridiculous statement about how we value things in our society.

Also of course there's again the gender double-standard: if this was a guy we were talking about, I doubt it would have caused anywhere near such a stir. (As it turns out, I had a male teacher in high school who had also been a male model-- the girls were all in love with him, and the guys all made jokes about it, but certainly he didn't lose his job over it...)




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/20/2006 12:21PM by PeterB.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Jp!
Date: May 20, 2006 01:40PM
I don't mind the swimsuit pics, but these pics are NSFW and Not Suitable for teaching kids???

[www.totallycrap.com]

I think those pics would distract students/parents.

Plus, she could make more money being a model/stripper/wh**e probably. smiling smiley
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 20, 2006 01:58PM
Jp!, I would say those are only borderline NSFW-- there really isn't any obvious nudity there, and as she says, everything is covered-- or at least not quite discernable (it looks like some of them have been Photoshopped). And anyway, I would feel differently about it if they were true nudes, e.g., Playboy-type.

I do agree that they are not suitable for teaching kids, because of the distraction factor... one thing is that you would have thought that, since she was modeling prior to becoming a teacher, they would have looked at her stuff before they hired her. Also, it's different if someone has done something before they took the job, versus them doing it WHILE they're doing the job... my understanding is that these were done before, but I'm not sure.

It sort of begs the bigger question, of whether a woman who was-- say-- a Victoria's Secret model, who modeled lingerie but didn't do any real nudes-- should be allowed to be a teacher. On the one hand, you could say "no" because it would be a distraction, but on the other hand women model for all sorts of reasons, not the least of which is the bucks; and what someone does in their private life isn't really anyone's business but her own.

More discussion here: [wizbangblog.com]




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: May 20, 2006 01:58PM
Got it bad
Got it bad
Got it bad
I'm hot for teacher



It is what it is.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Jp!
Date: May 20, 2006 02:03PM
The aureolas are exposed in those pics. I'd like to see some in public do that.

No...I REALLY WOULD! smiling smiley
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Paul F.
Date: May 20, 2006 02:09PM
I'll bet she has 100% attendance from the male students...

And their 100% attention in class.



Paul F.
-----
A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand. - Lucius Annaeus Seneca c. 5 BC - 65 AD
----
Good is the enemy of Excellent. Talent is not necessary for Excellence.
Persistence is necessary for Excellence. And Persistence is a Decision.

--

--

--
Eureka, CA
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 20, 2006 02:20PM
Jp!, they seem to be Photoshopped out slightly, look carefully (in the ones where she is wearing a body stocking, you should be seeing a LOT more-- typical for shots of that type that they Photoshop things). And anyway, the thing about the breast -- you cannot show the nipple. Anything else is usually fair game-- tops, bottoms, sides, etc.; even pasties. As she says, everything that's legally supposed to be covered is covered.

In some parts of the U.S., even showing the nipple in a public space is legal.

And again, I really wouldn't say that these are porn. More like something you would see in a lingerie or bikini catalog.

(Warning, NSFW)
[en.wikipedia.org]
[en.wikipedia.org]
[en.wikipedia.org]




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/20/2006 02:22PM by PeterB.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: bfd
Date: May 20, 2006 03:12PM
Rules for teachers in 1915

1. You will not marry during the term of your contract.

2. You are not to keep company with men.

3. You must be home between the hours of 8 p.m. and 6 a.m. unless attending a school function.

4. You may not loiter downtown in ice cream stores.

5. You may not travel beyond city limits unless you have the permission of the chairman of the board.

6. You may not ride in a carriage or automobile with any man unless he is your father or brother.

7. You may not smoke cigarettes.

8. You may not dress in bright colors.

9. You may under no circumstances dye your hair.

10. You must wear at least two petticoats.

11. Your dresses must not be any shorter than two inches above the ankle.

12. To keep the school room neat and clean, you must:

* sweep the floor at least once daily
* scrub the floor at least once a week with hot, soapy water
* clean the blackboards at least once a day
* start the fire at 7 a.m. so the room will be warm by 8 a.m.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Seacrest
Date: May 20, 2006 03:20PM
I grew up in the wrong era.





I am not Ryan Seacrest, and I do not approve this message.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Jp!
Date: May 20, 2006 04:24PM
You GREW UP?
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Jimmypoo
Date: May 20, 2006 04:46PM
no wonder she couldn't afford to live on her teacher salary.

Someone has to pay for those rubber bag implants.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 20, 2006 05:53PM
bfd, jeeeeeez, are those rules for teachers, or for nuns? Hard to believe how far we've come, and how much times have changed. (Also goes to show how much attitudes toward women have changed-- I like rule #6, clearly women are property to be transported from place to place!)




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: the_poochies
Date: May 20, 2006 07:55PM
BEST

TEACHER

EVER
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: RgrF
Date: May 21, 2006 01:44AM
The fact that a woman with her obvious physical attributes WANTS to teach says a lot for her. She didn't get handed her teaching credentials at "Bada Bing"..

She has class.



"Who's more foolish - the fool or the fool that follows him?" - Obi Wan Kenobi
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: bernadette
Date: May 21, 2006 01:50AM
Quote
RgrF
The fact that a woman with her obvious physical attributes WANTS to teach says a lot for her. She didn't get handed her teaching credentials at "Bada Bing"..

She has class.

What RgrF said.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Pops
Date: May 21, 2006 05:12AM
Quote
bfd
Rules for teachers in 1915...

Conversation I had with my principal when I was a first year teacher in 1971, central New York State. I was single and thought to grab a good sandwich on a Friday after a long day. On Monday:

She: "Mr. xxx, our teachers do not eat dinner at the Tavern in town."
Me: "Uhh, I don't understand."
She: "They serve alcohol there."
Me: "But I had a soda with my sandwich. Is there a problem?"
(That was a bad idea, as the tone of voice changed quickly.)
She: "You DO want to teach at our school, don't you?"


1971 in good old liberal New York, 'bout 60 miles from the Woodstock Festival at Bethel!
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: RgrF
Date: May 21, 2006 05:20AM
The 70's in upstate New York was as liberal as western Mass, Central Conn or anywhere in the South.

The locals despised the whole Woodstock thing, did they not ?



"Who's more foolish - the fool or the fool that follows him?" - Obi Wan Kenobi



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/21/2006 05:23AM by RgrF.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 21, 2006 10:40AM
Right guys, I mean I do realize that teachers are typically held to a higher standard than for other professions. To some extent, this does make sense, as they're essentially guiding and molding our young people (who will become future citizens), so they're acting as role models.

On the other hand, teachers aren't saints, and shouldn't be expected to be. I don't see why a woman who (let's say) did modeling for a Victoria Secret's type outfit-- so long as she didn't do porn-type nudes-- shouldn't be allowed to become a teacher if she so desires (and is qualified). As I said, a lot of women do the modeling for the money. If I recall correctly, there was some flap some years back that Vanna White (of "Wheel of Fortune") had done lingerie modeling early on in her career-- and this was her exact statement about it, that at the time, she was hungry and needed the money. (Admittedly, she's not a teacher though.)

And I quite agree, it does say something about her that, given she could make tons of money modeling, she wanted to become a teacher. And she was apparently dressing down and conservatively for teaching, so clearly she knew what the boundaries were (and was keeping things separate as best she could).




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/21/2006 10:44AM by PeterB.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: bernadette
Date: May 21, 2006 02:05PM
Quote
PeterB
Right guys, I mean I do realize that teachers are typically held to a higher standard than for other professions. To some extent, this does make sense, as they're essentially guiding and molding our young people (who will become future citizens), so they're acting as role models.

On the other hand, teachers aren't saints, and shouldn't be expected to be. I don't see why a woman who (let's say) did modeling for a Victoria Secret's type outfit-- so long as she didn't do porn-type nudes-- shouldn't be allowed to become a teacher if she so desires (and is qualified). As I said, a lot of women do the modeling for the money. If I recall correctly, there was some flap some years back that Vanna White (of "Wheel of Fortune") had done lingerie modeling early on in her career-- and this was her exact statement about it, that at the time, she was hungry and needed the money. (Admittedly, she's not a teacher though.)

And I quite agree, it does say something about her that, given she could make tons of money modeling, she wanted to become a teacher. And she was apparently dressing down and conservatively for teaching, so clearly she knew what the boundaries were (and was keeping things separate as best she could).

An example? I would have thought the best example in America would have to be the one given by the Commander in Chief. I don't remember Bill Clinton being such a great example. I've totally ignored GWBs example value as I don't believe he has any.
Also, what a teacher does in private is nothing to do with the school, unless they're going to pay her for her own time as well.
If they did maybe she wouldn't have to "moonlight".
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: bfd
Date: May 21, 2006 02:50PM
Education has always been about maintaining the status quo. Radical reformers at times will try to push things to a kid-centric or an educational change arena, but they are typically shut down quickly. No Child Left Behind Act is the most recent of these attempts at shutting down education as a change agent in society.

It's no wonder that a hot little number in Florida (of all places) would be denounced. If she doesn't already have tenure, she will not likely be rehired next year.

Of course, it goes without saying that this year's graduating teachers in the Class of '06 still needed lectures about appropriate classroom apparel prior to beginning their practice teaching. Showing skin, thong, and boob may be OK on a university campus, in fact, in some ways it's encouraged, but it's still not OK for teachers…



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/21/2006 02:51PM by bfd.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 21, 2006 02:56PM
Quote
bernadette
Quote
PeterB
Right guys, I mean I do realize that teachers are typically held to a higher standard than for other professions. To some extent, this does make sense, as they're essentially guiding and molding our young people (who will become future citizens), so they're acting as role models.

On the other hand, teachers aren't saints, and shouldn't be expected to be. I don't see why a woman who (let's say) did modeling for a Victoria Secret's type outfit-- so long as she didn't do porn-type nudes-- shouldn't be allowed to become a teacher if she so desires (and is qualified). As I said, a lot of women do the modeling for the money. If I recall correctly, there was some flap some years back that Vanna White (of "Wheel of Fortune") had done lingerie modeling early on in her career-- and this was her exact statement about it, that at the time, she was hungry and needed the money. (Admittedly, she's not a teacher though.)

And I quite agree, it does say something about her that, given she could make tons of money modeling, she wanted to become a teacher. And she was apparently dressing down and conservatively for teaching, so clearly she knew what the boundaries were (and was keeping things separate as best she could).

An example? I would have thought the best example in America would have to be the one given by the Commander in Chief. I don't remember Bill Clinton being such a great example. I've totally ignored GWBs example value as I don't believe he has any.
Also, what a teacher does in private is nothing to do with the school, unless they're going to pay her for her own time as well.
If they did maybe she wouldn't have to "moonlight".

bernadette, I'm not sure what you are getting at. I don't believe the President should in any way be taken as a role model of anything (except of how to be a successful politician). I don't understand why you brought that particular political issue into this discussion, as it is not relevant here.

And certainly, even if you take someone to be a role model, I'm not sure that that applies to what they do outside the job-- if you are looking specifically for a "moral" role model, then you ought to look at people who work in "moral" occupations-- e.g., clergy, philosophers, and ethicists.

Teachers act as role models to our youth mostly because they are directly exposed to them, and are day-to-day molding their minds, just as their parents are (but the parents are obviously the more impactful role models). The role that the teachers play is largely (should largely be) that education and learning are good things. (Of course, there are other sorts of "role models"-- such as professional athletes-- where the message given to the youth is quite different.)

And agreed, what they do on their own time is generally not relevant-- so long as it isn't illegal or doesn't affect their job performance -- I think the latter issue is possibly one aspect in this case. The "moral" argument is something else; I do think it would be naive to believe that we don't hold teachers to a higher standard than for other professions, though.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Webster J. Duck
Date: May 21, 2006 02:59PM
I wouldn’t have gotten any sleep. I would have beat my junk like it owed me money. But then again, the Sears underwear catalog can do that to most post-pubescent boys, so I’m not really sure it’s fair to blame anything save biology.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 21, 2006 06:06PM
Webster, that's part of my point too. Is it her fault that she looks the way she does? Should she have to be ugly (or at least average-looking) in order to teach, because it's too distracting for the male students? (Aren't they at least somewhat responsible for their own behavior?)

When I was a student (back in the mists of prehistory), it was clear that you were in school to LEARN. Not to slack off, not to screw around, not to ogle your teachers, and certainly not to try to bang them. If you didn't do the work, you failed the class, and that was it. It didn't matter if you said your teacher was too distracting, too ugly, too hard on you, whatever. These days though, we give students a lot of power over things-- far too much. I think a lot of this is parents being too lenient and not properly disciplining their children, so they're overindulged, spoiled, and allowed to get away with anything; and come to expect to be "served" as "customers" in the educational system. (While to some extent there's validity to this view, the lack of respect toward the teachers is truly appalling...)




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Jp!
Date: May 21, 2006 07:42PM
It's her fault she looks the way she does IN THE PICTURES.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 21, 2006 11:11PM
Quote
Jp!
It's her fault she looks the way she does IN THE PICTURES.

True, but... that was part of my question too. Should the pictures disqualify her from being a teacher? (Again, not clear if they were taken before, or during, her tenure as a teacher... my understanding is "before".)




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Kiva
Date: May 22, 2006 01:48AM
who the hell cares. The hypocrisy is sickening. The most popular T.V. show in america is about a bunch of slutty half-dressed housewives and this is a problem? This country is so sexually repressed, it's a joke.

As long as she's wearing proper work attire and is a good instructor, she can do whatever the heck she wants..

kiva



----------------------
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Pops
Date: May 22, 2006 06:34AM
Quote
PeterB
... that was part of my question too. Should the pictures disqualify her from being a teacher? (Again, not clear if they were taken before, or during, her tenure as a teacher... my understanding is "before".)

Well, in the 35 years since my little conversation about "values", I've been on many interview "committees" (a joke for letting teachers think their input is valuable), and I can not imagine any circumstance where a prospective teacher would be selected or hired if those photos were available to the people in charge of hiring.

Right or wrong, it still is a profession where image is considered a major part of the job requirement. And I'm not totally averse to that view, as regards the job place especially. I wore a tie long after it was "required". I felt it helped establish a more formal relationship and attention from kids, who were, in the late 70s and 80s often having "friendship" relationships with mom and dad. I didn't and don't think it terribly appropriate for female teachers to flashing too much skin and wearing skimpy clothing at work.

After work, another matter. BTW, 34 years ago, I married the school librarian, and let me tell you - once she let her hair down and got out from behind the card catalog....
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: May 22, 2006 10:01AM
And in Afghanistan, under the Taliban:
1) Complete ban on women's work outside the home, which also applied to
female teachers, engineers, and most [other] professionals. (Only a few
female doctors and nurses were allowed to work in some hospitals in Kabul.)

2) Complete ban on women's activity outside the home unless accompanied
by a mahram (a close male relative, such as a father, brother, or husband).

3) Ban on women dealing with male shopkeepers.

4) Ban on women being treated by male doctors.

5) Ban on women studying at schools, universities, or any other educational
institution. The Taliban converted girls' schools into [madrassas for boys].

6) Requirement for women to wear a long veil (burqa), which covered them
from head to toe.

7) Women not clothed in accordance with Taliban rules, or [found] traveling
unaccompanied by a mahram, were subjected to beating and verbal abuse.

8) Whipping of women in public for having non-covered ankles.

9) Public stoning of women accused of having sex outside marriage.

10) Ban on the use of cosmetics. (Many women with painted nails
have had their fingers cut off).

11) Ban on women talking or shaking hands with non-mahram males.

12) Ban on women laughing loudly. (No stranger should hear a woman's voice.)

13) Ban on women wearing high heel shoes, which would produce sound
while walking. (A man must not hear a woman's footsteps.)

14) Ban on women riding in a taxi without a mahram.

15) Ban on women's presence at public gatherings, on radio, or on television.

16) Ban on women playing sports, or even entering a sports centre or club.

17) Ban on women riding bicycles or motorcycles, even with their mahrams.

18) Ban on women wearing brightly colored clothes. In Taliban terms,
these were 'sexually - attracting colours'.

19) Ban on women gathering for festive occasions such as the Eids,
or for any recreational purpose.

20) Ban on women washing clothes in public places, or next to rivers.

21) Modification of all place names which included the word 'women'.
For example, 'women's garden' has been renamed 'spring garden'.

22) Ban on women appearing on the balconies of their apartments or houses.

23) Compulsory painting of all windows, so that women cannot be seen
from outside their homes.

24) Ban on male tailors taking women's measurements, or sewing women's clothes.

25) Ban on female public baths.

26) Ban on males and females traveling on the same bus. Public buses were designated 'males only', or 'females only'.

27) Ban on flared pants, even under a burqa.

28) Ban on the photographing or filming of women.

29) Ban on women's pictures printed in newspapers and books,
or hung on the walls of houses and shops.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: bernadette
Date: May 22, 2006 10:21AM
Quote
Pops
Quote
PeterB
... that was part of my question too. Should the pictures disqualify her from being a teacher? (Again, not clear if they were taken before, or during, her tenure as a teacher... my understanding is "before".)

Well, in the 35 years since my little conversation about "values", I've been on many interview "committees" (a joke for letting teachers think their input is valuable), and I can not imagine any circumstance where a prospective teacher would be selected or hired if those photos were available to the people in charge of hiring.

Right or wrong, it still is a profession where image is considered a major part of the job requirement. And I'm not totally averse to that view, as regards the job place especially. I wore a tie long after it was "required". I felt it helped establish a more formal relationship and attention from kids, who were, in the late 70s and 80s often having "friendship" relationships with mom and dad. I didn't and don't think it terribly appropriate for female teachers to flashing too much skin and wearing skimpy clothing at work.

After work, another matter. BTW, 34 years ago, I married the school librarian, and let me tell you - once she let her hair down and got out from behind the card catalog....

And that's exactly what I'm saying Pops. At school the woman IS dressed appropriately, but in her own time... that's her business.
Someone mentioned role models so I used President Clinton as an example of a role model, or rather someone who could have been a better role model.
Visiting dignitaries and Heads of State show the President respect because he is a leader of powerful nation and I think he has a moral obligation to those who elected him.
But I think the same about public figures in any country.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: incognegro
Date: May 22, 2006 03:26PM
agree w/Kiva. double standards, a weird mix of suppression yet blatant sexuality... we live in a conflicted, mixed-up country.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Seacrest
Date: May 22, 2006 04:28PM
What this thread really needed was less talk, and more pics.





I am not Ryan Seacrest, and I do not approve this message.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 22, 2006 04:55PM
Seacrest, more pics than you could take, here: [www.usanbt.com]

incognegro, yes, that's a big part of the problem. Add to the mix that we're talking South Florida in this case, where women normally wear what others might consider somewhat revealing clothing, even in the classroom-- quotation from the first article I linked to:

"Her case says a lot about South Florida and its hypocrisies.

Here in the sandy sub-tropics, we worship the barely clad human body. But let a teacher show off the same amount of skin as you'd see any day at the beach, and you have a potential scandal on your hands.

It is true that Chevillar -- in her eight poses on the Web site of the heretofore unknown U.S.A. National Bikini Team -- doesn't exactly recommend herself as a serious lecturer on the Treaty of Versailles or the Spanish conquests.

On the other hand, no one thinks less of the professionalism of male firefighters for showing off their torsos on calendars."

And from all accounts, she was dressing pretty conservatively/professionally in the classroom-- buttoned down blouses, long skirts, etc.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/22/2006 04:58PM by PeterB.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Pops
Date: May 22, 2006 05:05PM
Quote
bernadette
And that's exactly what I'm saying Pops. At school the woman IS dressed appropriately, but in her own time... that's her business.

Oh, I'm fully in agreement with you. smiling smiley It just doesn't actually work out that way if you're a young teacher without the job security of tenure.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/22/2006 05:11PM by Pops.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: May 22, 2006 09:46PM
And now I'm in a middle aged memory haze of my 6th grade music teacher, who was perhaps all of 26, had the face of an angel, and a body.. well- like the young lady in the articles in question. And that dress she'd wear with the little peekaboo cutout right between...

Well, needless to say I paid perfect attention in class. But I don't remember a thing she said. I barely remember what her face looked like....

More unfortunately, all of my fantasies of her ended up shattering because I couldn't identify the damn song she was playing at the time.
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Grateful11
Date: May 23, 2006 12:02PM
Another NSFW link:

[www.break.com]

She was featured in my FHM email from the UK.



Grateful11
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: incognegro
Date: May 23, 2006 03:23PM
those pics are safer than 50s Playboy centerfolds!

try this:
[www.youtube.com]

CLASS DISMISSED!
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Grumpyguy
Date: May 25, 2006 03:11PM
she would make a lot more money in porn than in teaching or realestate. Nice @#$%& to boot.



Bryan
______________________________________________________
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Location: Cincinnati
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Re: Too hot to teach?
Posted by: Jimmypoo
Date: May 27, 2006 10:16PM
Sorry if I misse one along the way --- but for anyone in FL, you already know that you are inundated with that kind of material on billboards, especially in South Florida, where she is teaeching.

Also -- she was teaching high school, and in Boca Raton, I can guarantee you that there were dozens of rubber @#$%& in the high school already. And they weren't even 18 years old.

This crap they put her through was about power and intimidation. They are probably very fortunate they came to the decision they did - because they would have been sued otherwise, costing the county hundreds of thousands, if not several million, because a few people didn't appreciate the fact that she could also spend her time, WHERE HER STUDENTS MIGHT ALSO GO, during the summers, at the nude beach in Hollywood, just down the road.

It's a load of crap.
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