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States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Spock
Date: March 13, 2013 08:58PM
Quote

States with more gun laws have fewer gun-related deaths, according to a new study released Wednesday by Boston Children's Hospital.

[www.usatoday.com]

Well Doh !!!

This is why the malevolently evil NRA doesn't want federally funded research into gun violence. They are desperately afraid of the results.



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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Speedy
Date: March 13, 2013 09:03PM
The NRA needs to pass a law making it illegal to do this type of gunner research. The last one they passed simply wasn't broad enough, just banning the use of federal money for gunner research.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: DCrunch
Date: March 13, 2013 10:14PM
You can certainly get an unbiased study from the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: March 13, 2013 10:21PM
Chicago residents would disagree with you.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Spock
Date: March 13, 2013 10:56PM
Quote
cbelt3
Chicago residents would disagree with you.

Try reading the original JAMA paper.



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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: lafinfil
Date: March 13, 2013 11:00PM
Quote
cbelt3
Chicago residents would disagree with you.

That's what Lake County Indiana guns shows are for.

A 30 minute drive and loopholes big enough to drive an Escalade through.

[www.gunshowminute.com]



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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: March 14, 2013 07:53AM
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it. The rule of data appears to be... once it's been put into a database somewhere, it never, ever, ever gets deleted. And then someone comes up with a 'good idea' to mine it.

If I call the cops, I don't want them showing up with SWAT, killing my doggies and firing tear gas grenades into the windows.. because I'm on their database as "OMG ! Gun Owner !"
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: deckeda
Date: March 14, 2013 08:17AM
Cops have been known to do that all on their own, without any clue what you have I the house.

The government knows I own cars. I fail to see how keeping my guns a secret helps anyone.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: March 14, 2013 10:23AM
My AmazonLocalDeal this morning: discounted concealed carry class!
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: (vikm)
Date: March 14, 2013 01:20PM
Seriously, is there a real, legitimate, non-paranoid reason that some are do opposed to a nation registry for gun ownership? I've yet to hear one. I just don't understand why it's seen as a big deal.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: hal
Date: March 14, 2013 01:37PM
Quote
cbelt3
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it. The rule of data appears to be... once it's been put into a database somewhere, it never, ever, ever gets deleted. And then someone comes up with a 'good idea' to mine it.

If I call the cops, I don't want them showing up with SWAT, killing my doggies and firing tear gas grenades into the windows.. because I'm on their database as "OMG ! Gun Owner !"

If you were a cop answering a domestic disturbance call, wouldn't you want to know that there are 27 guns in the house?
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: max
Date: March 14, 2013 02:49PM
Absolutely....
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Pops
Date: March 14, 2013 03:40PM
Try checking the abortion rates in red states.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: billb
Date: March 14, 2013 04:19PM
States with more gun laws have less gun violence.......
....but
.... it does not prove that more gun laws are the reason for fewer gun deaths.


How much did this waste of ones and zeroes cost.



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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: davester
Date: March 14, 2013 10:59PM
Quote
cbelt3
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it. The rule of data appears to be... once it's been put into a database somewhere, it never, ever, ever gets deleted. And then someone comes up with a 'good idea' to mine it.

If I call the cops, I don't want them showing up with SWAT, killing my doggies and firing tear gas grenades into the windows.. because I'm on their database as "OMG ! Gun Owner !"

A database is never going to have that effect. I would say that this country desperately needs a national permanent gun ownership registry that tracks the disposition of every single gun, in much the same way that we track the disposition of every single car.



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Mac-A-Matic
Date: March 14, 2013 11:39PM
Quote
hal
If you were a cop answering a domestic disturbance call, wouldn't you want to know that there are 27 guns in the house?

It is always advantageous to hold intelligence regarding an opponent. The more data a government can amass about its people, the greater their advantage.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: DevoBill
Date: March 15, 2013 09:10AM
Serious question; What is the benefit or advantage to having fire arms registered?
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Ted King
Date: March 15, 2013 09:36AM
Quote
cbelt3
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it.

Wouldn't the national background check database contain information about people who - for whatever legal reason - are not permitted to own a gun?
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: SDGuy
Date: March 15, 2013 10:08AM
Quote
Ted King
Quote
cbelt3
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it.

Wouldn't the national background check database contain information about people who - for whatever legal reason - are not permitted to own a gun?

so - you see no difference between keeping records on convicted felons vs. keeping records on ordinary citizens who have broken no laws?
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Ted King
Date: March 15, 2013 10:17AM
Quote
SDGuy
Quote
Ted King
Quote
cbelt3
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it.

Wouldn't the national background check database contain information about people who - for whatever legal reason - are not permitted to own a gun?

so - you see no difference between keeping records on convicted felons vs. keeping records on ordinary citizens who have broken no laws?


?????

I asked about a background check database of people who for legal reasons are NOT permitted to own a gun. Such a database would NOT have information on citizens who have broken no laws - that was the point. I don't understand why you asked that question.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: SDGuy
Date: March 15, 2013 10:33AM
Quote
Ted King
Quote
SDGuy
Quote
Ted King
Quote
cbelt3
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it.

Wouldn't the national background check database contain information about people who - for whatever legal reason - are not permitted to own a gun?

so - you see no difference between keeping records on convicted felons vs. keeping records on ordinary citizens who have broken no laws?


?????

I asked about a background check database of people who for legal reasons are NOT permitted to own a gun. Such a database would NOT have information on citizens who have broken no laws - that was the point. I don't understand why you asked that question.

Ah - sorry. Now I see the point you were making.
I think what cbelt3 was addressing was the point of view espoused by davester...
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Ted King
Date: March 15, 2013 10:40AM
Quote
SDGuy
Quote
Ted King
Quote
SDGuy
Quote
Ted King
Quote
cbelt3
Find a way to do accurate national background checks without turning it into a national permanent gun ownership registry, and I'll be OK with it.

Wouldn't the national background check database contain information about people who - for whatever legal reason - are not permitted to own a gun?

so - you see no difference between keeping records on convicted felons vs. keeping records on ordinary citizens who have broken no laws?


?????

I asked about a background check database of people who for legal reasons are NOT permitted to own a gun. Such a database would NOT have information on citizens who have broken no laws - that was the point. I don't understand why you asked that question.

Ah - sorry. Now I see the point you were making.
I think what cbelt3 was addressing was the point of view espoused by davester...

It's easy to lose track of who said what when, but to be clear, I was responding to something cbelt said before davester's post so unless cbelt is clairvoyant (amongst his other many talents), I don't think he was responding to davester's post.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/15/2013 10:41AM by Ted King.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: DevoBill
Date: March 15, 2013 11:06AM
[www.nationalreview.com]

Quote

Despite spending a whopping $2.7 billion on creating and running a long-gun registry, Canadians never reaped any benefits from the project. The legislation to end the program finally passed the Parliament on Wednesday. Even though the country started registering long guns in 1998, the registry never solved a single murder. Instead it has been an enormous waste of police officers’ time, diverting their efforts from patrolling Canadian streets and doing traditional policing activities.




I want ambiguity, or possibly something else.
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Black
Date: March 15, 2013 12:31PM
Quote
cbelt3
Chicago residents would disagree with you.

Hope you were joking.

In various models, we controlled for age, sex, race/ethnicity, poverty, unemployment, college education, population density, nonfirearm violence–related deaths, and household firearm ownership.




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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: hal
Date: March 16, 2013 04:12PM
Quote
Mac-A-Matic
Quote
hal
If you were a cop answering a domestic disturbance call, wouldn't you want to know that there are 27 guns in the house?

It is always advantageous to hold intelligence regarding an opponent. The more data a government can amass about its people, the greater their advantage.

You say that like it's a negative thing... where does this paranoia come from? Do you really think that the USA is on it's way to becoming totalitarian and if so, that your little guns will be your salvation?

What a fool!
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Re: States with more gun laws have less gun violence
Posted by: Mac-A-Matic
Date: March 18, 2013 09:33AM
Quote
hal
Quote
Mac-A-Matic
Quote
hal
If you were a cop answering a domestic disturbance call, wouldn't you want to know that there are 27 guns in the house?

It is always advantageous to hold intelligence regarding an opponent. The more data a government can amass about its people, the greater their advantage.

You say that like it's a negative thing... where does this paranoia come from? Do you really think that the USA is on it's way to becoming totalitarian and if so, that your little guns will be your salvation?

What a fool!

It's a simple statement. Don't know quite how you started with the totalitarian talk.

What I know is that I prefer to gather as much intelligence as possible in order to achieve my goals.
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