advertisement
Forums

 

AAPL stock: Click Here

You are currently viewing the 'Friendly' Political Ranting forum
Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 18, 2016 05:56PM
Because 'Palestinian dignity' demands terror attacks against civilians, right, Bernie?
At Least 20 Wounded in Jerusalem Bus Blast Caused by Bomb
read more: [www.haaretz.com]
Jerusalem mayor, Israel Police spokesperson confirm explosion was terror attack, caused by bomb; Two people are seriously wounded, six people are moderately wounded.

At least 20 people were injured, two seriously, when a bomb exploded on a bus in Jerusalem on Monday. The Shin Bet security service confirmed that the incident was a terror attack.
--
The blast occurred at about 5:50 P.M. on Moshe Baram Street, near Hebron Road, in southwest Jerusalem. It is the first bombing attack in Jerusalem since the second intifada ended in 2005. An explosion tore through the bus on the number 12 line, which then set another bus – which was empty at the time – on fire. A Jerusalem Police spokesperson said that most of those hurt by the blast were passengers on the No.12 bus.

“Based on a professional investigation by police demolitions experts, it appears that a bomb went off in the back of the bus, which caused injuries to passengers and the bus to catch fire. In addition, another bus and a private vehicle nearby were also damaged,” the spokesperson said.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: pdq
Date: April 18, 2016 06:11PM
Steve, g_d forbid that this kind of terrorism would be the beginning of a third intifada...but terrorism seems to thrive where hope is extinguished.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 18, 2016 06:44PM
Yeah, sure. When terrorists hit your local shopping mall, you'll be there to make excuses for them, too? No matter how you try to rationalize it, it was bombing civilians in local buses.

April 17,1986, at London's Heathrow Airport, a bomb was discovered in the bag of Anne-Marie Murphy, a pregnant Irishwoman about to board an El Al jetliner to Israel; she'd been tricked into carrying the bomb by her Jordanian fiance, Nezar Hindawi.

April 17, 1996, A Palestinian suicide bomber struck a Tel Aviv restaurant during Passover, killing nine people.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2016 06:51PM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: April 18, 2016 06:53PM
Aww, Steve.

You were holding back the crazy so well.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: max
Date: April 18, 2016 07:54PM
And of course, Bernie Sanders said nothing about supporting Palestinian terrorism, SteveG's giant straw construct....




~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"We know that no one ever seizes power with the intention of relinquishing it. Power is not a means, it is an end.
One does not establish a dictatorship in order to safeguard a revolution;
one makes the revolution in order to establish the dictatorship."
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 18, 2016 08:09PM
Quote
Onamuji
Aww, Steve.

You were holding back the crazy so well.
Too bad you couldn't hold back on the rationalizations and personal pique.

How come Bernie (and you for that matter) doesn't say, let's tell the Palestinians they have to come and negotiate like they managed to in the past (and then walked away...ask Bill Clinton).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2016 08:12PM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: mattkime
Date: April 18, 2016 09:27PM
where's the bernie quote? i don't see it.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 18, 2016 10:15PM
(REUTERS) Democratic debate at the Brooklyn Navy Yard in New York April 14, 2016.

Bernie Sanders went on offense during Thursday’s Democratic primary debate, criticizing Hillary Clinton for “barely mentioning” the Palestinian people during her speech before the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, the nation’s most powerful pro-Israel group, last month.

Sanders, the independent senator from Vermont, and Clinton, the former secretary of state, largely agree about the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. They both believe Israel has the right to exist as a Jewish and democratic state and that the Palestinian people should have a state of their own.

On Thursday, Sanders doubled down on his past argument that Israel’s invasion of Gaza in 2014 in response to rocket attacks was “disproportionate,” said the U.S. and Israel need “to treat the Palestinian people with respect and dignity” and argued that the U.S. “cannot continue to be one-sided.” While each of these comments is a bold thing to say on a Democratic primary debate stage, the real historic moment was the exchange between the two candidates over how Clinton talks about Palestinians and whether the U.S. grovels to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu too frequently.

“I read Secretary Clinton’s speech before AIPAC. I heard virtually no discussion at all about the needs of the Palestinian people,” Sanders said. “Of course Israel has a right to defend itself, but long-term, there will never be peace in that region, unless the United States plays an even-handed role, trying to bring people together and recognizing the serious problems that exist among the Palestinian people ... There comes a time when, if we pursue justice and peace, we are going to have to say that Netanyahu is not right all of the time.”

Bernie neglects to mention decades of genocidal hate and terror directed against Israel by the poor Palestinians. He also neglects to acknowledge that at least twice since 2000, after almost closing an agreement, the Palestinians walked away. The lack of anything resembling elections or democratic processes and the unbelievably corrupt Fatah 'leadership' has led to Palestinians being victimized by their own heroes for decades. (And that's not even counting the homicidal fanatics of Hamas killing anyone they care to in Gaza....Oh, and they fired 10,000 missiles at israeli civilians purely because 'Jews must drown in a river of blood').

That's what Bernie declines to mention. The Palestinian 'leaders' have shown themselves unable to negotiate, govern or deliver anything that has benefited any Palestinians except themselves. Bernie, and a whole lot of others, have done absolutely nothing to address this catastrophe among the Palestinians. Instead they talk about 'dignity'. Let the Palestinians elect responsible leaders and negotiate in good faith. That will do more for their 'dignity' than any weepy political posturing.




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2016 10:17PM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: April 18, 2016 10:33PM
Here's a funny picture:


Isn't that cute!



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 18, 2016 10:44PM
If Sanders really cared for the Palestinians, he would be calling for them to form actual political parties (not neo-Stalinist entities like Fatah or kill-crazed religious cabals like Hamas) and help them hold actual free elections, something unheard of by Bernie...or you Omi.
They did have an election once, ten years ago...and then the gangster parties shot up the landscape and shut down any illusion of representative democracy. Abbas is now in the tenth year of his four year term. Maybe Bernie thinks the Palestinians like it that way? What a crummy thought.

The Israelis have witnessed the duplicity, hate-mongering and dictatorial control of the corrupt and cowardly Fatah and Hamas leadership exploiting and manipulating the Palestinians for decades on end. they are disgusted. that is why a opportunistic lout like Netanyahu can put together a coalition and form a government.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2016 10:51PM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: max
Date: April 18, 2016 11:14PM
Still nothing on Sanders supporting Palestinian terrorism, SteveG?.....


Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: davester
Date: April 18, 2016 11:19PM
For once, I agree with Max.



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: April 18, 2016 11:25PM
Yeah, whenever he talks about the Palestinian conflict, all that Bernie ever seems to dwell upon is peace, economic stability, civil liberties and self-determination.

How un-American. He must truly hate democracy.


[takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com]

Like his rivals, Mr. Sanders, in his speech, emphasized a long-standing American commitment to “work tirelessly to advance the cause of peace as a partner and as a friend to Israel.”

But unlike the others, he also stressed that “to be successful, we have also got to be a friend not only to Israel, but to the Palestinian people” and noted that “in Gaza unemployment today is 44 percent and we have a poverty rate which is almost as high.”

He endorsed a negotiated two-state solution as the only chance for peace and declared that such an outcome “will require compromises on both sides.” That means an unconditional recognition of Israel’s right to exist, an end to all attacks against Israel, and a renunciation of violence by Hamas and Hezbollah, Mr. Sanders said.

Peace also must mean benefits for the Palestinians, including security, self-determination, civil rights, economic wellbeing, an end to Israel’s occupation of the West Bank and an end to the blockade of Gaza, he said.

Senator Sanders strongly condemned rocket attacks by Hamas against Israel, but he also faulted the Israeli counter attacks in the last Gaza war that killed nearly 1,500 civilians and wounded thousands more.

On MSNBC, he was even more blunt, arguing that “the overreaction and the destruction of Gaza went too, too far” and that “we just cannot be 100 percent supportive of people like Netanyahu and ignore the rest of the region.”








Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2016 11:26PM by Onamuji.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: April 19, 2016 01:17AM
Reuters as a source??

I thought Steve G. hated Reuters. confused smiley
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Black
Date: April 19, 2016 08:53AM
Quote
Onamuji
Yeah, whenever he talks about the Palestinian conflict, all that Bernie ever seems to dwell upon is peace, economic stability, civil liberties and self-determination.

How un-American. He must truly hate democracy.


[takingnote.blogs.nytimes.com]

Like his rivals, Mr. Sanders, in his speech, emphasized a long-standing American commitment to “work tirelessly to advance the cause of peace as a partner and as a friend to Israel.”

But unlike the others, he also stressed that “to be successful, we have also got to be a friend not only to Israel, but to the Palestinian people” and noted that “in Gaza unemployment today is 44 percent and we have a poverty rate which is almost as high.”

He endorsed a negotiated two-state solution as the only chance for peace and declared that such an outcome “will require compromises on both sides.” That means an unconditional recognition of Israel’s right to exist, an end to all attacks against Israel, and a renunciation of violence by Hamas and Hezbollah, Mr. Sanders said.

Peace also must mean benefits for the Palestinians, including security, self-determination, civil rights, economic wellbeing, an end to Israel’s occupation of the West Bank and an end to the blockade of Gaza, he said.

Senator Sanders strongly condemned rocket attacks by Hamas against Israel, but he also faulted the Israeli counter attacks in the last Gaza war that killed nearly 1,500 civilians and wounded thousands more.

On MSNBC, he was even more blunt, arguing that “the overreaction and the destruction of Gaza went too, too far” and that “we just cannot be 100 percent supportive of people like Netanyahu and ignore the rest of the region.”

The man is clearly insane.




New forum user map 8/2015: [www.zeemaps.com]
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 19, 2016 10:13AM
I suppose we should 'understand' and rationalize the motives for Timothy McVeigh as well? He was in an 'ideological fighter against oppression', just like the Jerusalem bombers.

April 19, 1995, a truck bomb destroyed the Alfred P. Murrah Federal Building in Oklahoma City, killing 168 people.


wikipedia source:
McVeigh declared that:
It also stands to reason that anyone who sympathizes with the enemy or gives aid or comfort to said enemy is likewise guilty. I have sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic and I will. And I will because not only did I swear to, but I believe in what it stands for in every bit of my heart, soul and being. I know in my heart that I am right in my struggle. I have come to peace with myself, my God and my cause. Blood will flow in the streets, Good vs. Evil. Free Men vs. Socialist Wannabe Slaves. Pray it is not your blood, my friend.


The only thing that makes VcVeigh different from the Jerusalem bomber is the Jerusalem terrorist has large well-financed support structure and knows he will be wildly praised and his family financially supported if he should get caught.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2016 10:18AM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 19, 2016 10:24AM
Where is Bernie's pledge to fight for democracy and against massive tyranny, moral
perversity and corruption of the 'leaders' continually taking the Palestinian people into disaster? That's what the Palestinian people need.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2016 10:25AM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 19, 2016 12:01PM


What they do for a living. Hamas 'Heroes' ride around in Toyotas versus Israelis manning tech startups.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: August West
Date: April 19, 2016 12:44PM
nuts smiley



“There comes a point where we need to stop just pulling people out of the river. We need to go upstream and find out why they’re falling in."
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Manlove
Date: April 19, 2016 02:22PM
Is what disproportionate?

[www.dci-palestine.org]
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: $tevie
Date: April 19, 2016 03:54PM
This foaming at the mouth about Palestinians is really not becoming.

A person can be sympathetic to the Palestinians' situation without desiring that they be able to destroy Israel. Life is not black and white. I doubt so very much that Sanders wishes to see Israel pushed into the sea and if you would calm down you would, too.



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 19, 2016 05:19PM
Quote
$tevie
This foaming at the mouth about Palestinians is really not becoming.

A person can be sympathetic to the Palestinians' situation without desiring that they be able to destroy Israel. Life is not black and white. I doubt so very much that Sanders wishes to see Israel pushed into the sea and if you would calm down you would, too.

I am sympathetic to the Palestinian's situation. They have been victimized, led to commit murder, robbed blind and denied their own state by an unelected corps of corrupt, one-party 'Leadership'. How about if the world gives the Palestinians a break and allow them to emerge as a democracy from beneath the thumb of the greedy incompetents who have exploiting them for decades.


PS- You don't think it's strange that according to Bernie '1500 Gaza civilians were killed', but not one member of Hamas. Really, not a single member of Hamas? Just those poor (human shield) Palestinian civilians. What a distorted load of garbage.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2016 05:31PM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Onamuji
Date: April 19, 2016 07:07PM
Quote
Steve G.
I am sympathetic to the Palestinian's situation. They have been victimized, led to commit murder...

Most of them victimized. Few of them murderers.

Congrats. You've perfectly illustrated the meaning of the word "bigot."



Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 19, 2016 08:44PM
Quote
Onamuji
Quote
Steve G.
I am sympathetic to the Palestinian's situation. They have been victimized, led to commit murder...

Most of them victimized. Few of them murderers.

Congrats. You've perfectly illustrated the meaning of the word "bigot."

See you next time there's an election in Palestinia. Keep making those excuses. You are apparently committed to keep their gangster leaders in power forever. Better still, why not travel on over and start preaching about democracy, freedom of speech and behavior on street corners. You'll be dead in a week.
In Gaza, they'll just shoot you on the spot.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2016 08:46PM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: April 20, 2016 09:18AM
Quote
Steve G.
Quote
Onamuji
Quote
Steve G.
I am sympathetic to the Palestinian's situation. They have been victimized, led to commit murder...

Most of them victimized. Few of them murderers.

Congrats. You've perfectly illustrated the meaning of the word "bigot."

See you next time there's an election in Palestinia. Keep making those excuses. You are apparently committed to keep their gangster leaders in power forever. Better still, why not travel on over and start preaching about democracy, freedom of speech and behavior on street corners. You'll be dead in a week.
In Gaza, they'll just shoot you on the spot.

What does sympathy for Palestinians have to do with supporting their leadership? I support Israel's right to exist but I hardly back Bibi and the gaggle of hatemongering bigots in his reactionary coalition.



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 20, 2016 09:34AM
Sanders refuses to address the real problem. Instead he retreats to the standard position of the Euro-Left, "all things evil spring from the Zionist Jews". The rest of the chaotic Middle East doesn't exist for them.

Do you think the Palestinian leadership has shown ANY sense of responsibility towards their subjects?
Netanyahu deserves no support from the Israeli electorate and should be turned out.
But the horrendous Fatah and Hamas gangs have no inclination to give up their power, graft and fanaticism. And since democracy and elections are completely missing from the Palestinian society, they will continue to feast on their victims. (Abbas in in the 10th year of his 4 year term.)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/20/2016 09:39AM by Steve G..
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: rjmacs
Date: April 20, 2016 09:53AM
How do we help the Palestinians develop a functioning democracy?



rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 20, 2016 10:18AM
Quote
rjmacs
How do we help the Palestinians develop a functioning democracy?

Start encouraging our European allies, the UN and our own diplomats to start talking about it in public. Right now, the Europeans (and us) just write the leadership checks and say nothing.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Is this 'disproportionate', Bernie?
Posted by: neophyte
Date: April 20, 2016 10:37AM
Quote
rjmacs
How do we help the Palestinians develop a functioning democracy?

"We" urge Tunisia to instruct Hamas on how to create a functioning democracy based on the Tunisian model. "We" offer monetary assistance only. This requires diplomacy and negotiation at the executive level. Who's got the diplomatic chops to do this?
Options:  Reply • Quote
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login

Online Users

Guests: 89
Record Number of Users: 186 on February 20, 2020
Record Number of Guests: 5122 on October 03, 2020