[www.stripes.com]

ROME — With confirmed coronavirus cases in the U.S. hitting 5 million Sunday, by far the highest total of any country, the failure of the most powerful nation in the world to contain the scourge has been met with astonishment and alarm in Europe.

Perhaps nowhere outside the U.S. is America’s bungled virus response viewed with more consternation than in Italy, which was ground zero of Europe’s epidemic. Italians were unprepared when the outbreak exploded in February, and the country still has one of the world’s highest official death tolls at 35,000.

But after a strict nationwide, 10-week lockdown, vigilant tracing of new clusters and general acceptance of mask mandates and social distancing, Italy has become a model of virus containment.
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Much of the incredulity in Europe stems from the fact that America had the benefit of time, European experience and medical know-how to treat the virus that the continent didn’t have when the first COVID-19 patients started filling intensive care units.

Yet, more than four months into a sustained outbreak, the U.S. reached the 5 million mark, according to the running count kept by Johns Hopkins University. Health officials believe the actual number is perhaps 10 times as high — closer to 50 million — given testing limitations and the fact that as many as 40% of all those who are infected have no symptoms.

“We Italians always saw America as a model,” said Massimo Franco, a columnist with daily Corriere della Sera. “But with this virus, we’ve discovered a country that is very fragile, with bad infrastructure and a public health system that is nonexistent.”

Italian Health Minister Roberto Speranza hasn’t shied away from criticizing the U.S., officially condemning as “wrong” Washington’s decision to withhold funding from the World Health Organization and expressing amazement at President Donald Trump’s virus response.
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With America’s world-leading death toll of more than 160,000, its politicized resistance to masks and its rising caseload, European nations have barred American tourists and visitors from other countries with growing cases from traveling freely to the bloc.

Give me liberty, or give me death …



Great, you can have both!

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bfd
Give me liberty, or give me death …



Great, you can have both!

Funny how it is your choice about your body as concerns masks, but not other things, if you get my drift.

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Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)

My European colleagues and friends are astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

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sekker
My European colleagues and friends are astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

I'm here and am astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

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“No persons are more frequently wrong, than those who will not admit they are wrong.”
-- François de La Rochefoucauld

Growing older is mandatory. Growing up is optional.

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rgG

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bfd
Give me liberty, or give me death …



Great, you can have both!

Funny how it is your choice about your body as concerns masks, but not other things, if you get my drift.

their point is to reverse the question - 'how can killing babies be a right, but not a maskless existence?' If you are allowed to kill babies, I should be allowed to not wear a @#$%& mask.

Best to not engage at all...

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hal

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rgG

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bfd
Give me liberty, or give me death …



Great, you can have both!

Funny how it is your choice about your body as concerns masks, but not other things, if you get my drift.

their point is to reverse the question - 'how can killing babies be a right, but not a maskless existence?' If you are allowed to kill babies, I should be allowed to not wear a @#$%& mask.

Best to not engage at all...

Yeah, I see that now. I don’t expect clever things from the far right, so I took them literally.
If it was just their body that might get sick and die, fine, do what you will, but their body getting others sick is the point they refuse to see.

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Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)

wait!! I got it!

But what if by not wearing a mask, YOU INFECT A PREGNANT MOTHER???!!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2020 05:14PM by hal.

In addition to focusing on rapid development of vaccines, they really need to focus on greatly increasing supply of N95 masks. Time for those that wear masks to protect themselves from the people around them rather than depending those idiots to wear a mask to to prevent them from spreading.

And maybe we should setup "mask free zones" sort of like smoking sections for these like minded people to congregate. Trump properties seem like a good choice, the guests there shouldn't mind.

And mask requirements are just like no smoking restrictions, it's to protect the people around you.

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GGD
And mask requirements are just like no smoking restrictions, it's to protect the people around you.

Exactly, why is this so hard for some people to understand?

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Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)

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rgG

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GGD
And mask requirements are just like no smoking restrictions, it's to protect the people around you.

Exactly, why is this so hard for some people to understand?

oh, they understand, alright. they don't care about you. in fact, they are generally consumed by hate, especially of "liberals."

People are comfortable with what they are familiar with. Our routines have been severely jarred and any retreat to 'the past' will be pursued.

Add in those who look to authority figures telling them what they want hear. Past surveys have shown reliance on authority figures is a characteristic of the GOP group. Greater belief on gossip and rumors as opposed to 'establishment sources' drags in large numbers from elsewhere.

That being said, I can't imagine that the various populations in Europe are any more enlightened, educated or superstition-free than Americans.
Perhaps it has to do with the relationship between the people and their governments in health matters



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2020 07:37PM by Steve G..

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Ombligo

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sekker
My European colleagues and friends are astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

I'm here and am astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

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Steve G.
People are comfortable with what they are familiar with. Our routines have been severely jarred and any retreat to 'the past' will be pursued.

Add in those who look to authority figures telling them what they want hear. Past surveys have shown reliance on authority figures is a characteristic of the GOP group. Greater belief on gossip and rumors as opposed to 'establishment sources' drags in large numbers from elsewhere.

That being said, I can't imagine that the various populations in Europe are any more enlightened, educated or superstition-free than Americans.
Perhaps it has to do with the relationship between the people and their governments in health matters

Interesting point. I would argue that Europeans, who generally don't do religion, are more superstition-free than Americans, and in some cases better educated.

But your last point I think nails it. Americans are still stubborn individualists who just don't like being told what to do, especially if their "side" is not in control. We've gotten worse about that, not better, over the past 40 or so years. And we've been indoctrinated to hate government and politicians, not to look for wise leadership from government officials.
Our healthcare system is the perfect demonstration of that thinking. It's a mess because we think private, for profit companies will treat us better than our own elected government. The rest of the world just feels sorry for us now. Not a good feeling.

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sekker
My European colleagues and friends are astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

Europe has its own efforts that aren't so different from our own.

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They’ll listen to simple instruction from a central source. The only reason the Walmart here got nearly everyone in this small town to wear a mask is because they told them to do so. If anyone thinks a central authority isn’t a thing listened to they’re crazy.

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rgG

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hal

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rgG

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bfd
Give me liberty, or give me death …



Great, you can have both!

Funny how it is your choice about your body as concerns masks, but not other things, if you get my drift.

their point is to reverse the question - 'how can killing babies be a right, but not a maskless existence?' If you are allowed to kill babies, I should be allowed to not wear a @#$%& mask.

Best to not engage at all...

Yeah, I see that now. I don’t expect clever things from the far right, so I took them literally.
If it was just their body that might get sick and die, fine, do what you will, but their body getting others sick is the point they refuse to see.

A false equivalence isn’t clever, it’s ignorant. Her sign is trying to say that an abortion is just something done for no reason whatsoever, a pure random choice. In both cases she’s entirely and willfully ignorant of long term consequences.

If anyone thinks a central authority isn’t a thing listened to they’re crazy.

They've shown they will, problem comes down to who that is. Trump followers listened when he spoke and contradicted every sane piece of medical advice professionals offered.

So they do listen, it's just a matter of who's speaking.

This town is heavily Republican. They mostly didn’t do it on their own, but once the retailer mandated it they quickly fell in line, at least for that store.

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deckeda
They’ll listen to simple instruction from a central source. The only reason the Walmart here got nearly everyone in this small town to wear a mask is because they told them to do so. If anyone thinks a central authority isn’t a thing listened to they’re crazy.

Uh, they have to buy food and supplies. If the only place to get stuff tells you to wear a mask, you do it.

That's really the point. If we'd had a consistent national message from the beginning, most people would be wearing masks now. But instead our president decided to make it political, make it about "freedom!" and triggered all kinds of bad behavior. He's the one who put it in people's head that mask-wearing should be a choice, even if you're spreading a deadly disease to other people.

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samintx

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Ombligo

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sekker
My European colleagues and friends are astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

I'm here and am astounded about everything this past 3+ years...

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=wr=