Nothing more than symbolic foot stamping and finger wagging can be done now, correct? It’s all just been a baroque tea dance, as usual, to convince the hoi polloi that ‘serious things were being done’.

The Hill
“Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell’s (R-Ky.) office told Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer’s (D-N.Y.) staff on Wednesday that the GOP will not agree to reconvene the Senate before Jan. 19 to allow an impeachment trial while President Trump is still in office.”

It would require unanimous consent to reconvene before 1/19.

Did anyone really think that Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley were going to allow that to happen?

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rj
AKA
Vreemac, Moth of the Future

Trump will be impeached. Wasn't that the goal?

They can impeach him after his term ends and if he is convicted in the Senate, he cannot run again and he loses his protection and other benefits.

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vision63
Trump will be impeached. Wasn't that the goal?

Removal from office is the goal but yeah this is the start. He can still be tried and convicted and banned from future public office and then indicted for sedition after he leaves office.

Just getting started.

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rjmacs
It would require unanimous consent to reconvene before 1/19.

Did anyone really think that Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley were going to allow that to happen?

Thought I read that since 9/11, Mitch and Shumer (majority and minority leaders) could call the Senate back to session without unanimous consent.

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wave rider

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rjmacs
It would require unanimous consent to reconvene before 1/19.

Did anyone really think that Ted Cruz and Josh Hawley were going to allow that to happen?

Thought I read that since 9/11, Mitch and Shumer (majority and minority leaders) could call the Senate back to session without unanimous consent.

Correct, that dates to 2004. But McConnell has to agree to it and he clearly doesn't want to.

^^^That Mitch is such a party pooper!

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=wr=

Even with Democratic majority rule next month the Senate does not yet have enough people that want to convict. Republicans will spend their time not defending Trump necessarily but claiming the nation needs to forgive and forget. Or at least forget. All under the aegis of, “healing.”

It remains to be seen whether or not that sentiment will fester or whether conviction grows. I am less convinced momentum can be gained.

The prime opportunity to do what is called for was immediate removal from office. We’re now at compromise. Where that will finally land will likely be painful to Trump and his followers. There will be some measure of justice, if we are not truly slaves to our old ways like a bug frozen in amber.

But we have failed utterly in seizing a once in a lifetime opportunity to shatter the chains of a cancerous lineage of political pantomime. We may well visit this place again.

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Lemon Drop

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vision63
Trump will be impeached. Wasn't that the goal?

Removal from office is the goal but yeah this is the start. He can still be tried and convicted and banned from future public office and then indicted for sedition after he leaves office.

Just getting started.

I wanted him impeached to punish him. I "knew" we could accomplish that. Removal could only be a remote aspiration. I don't think people understood the dual aspects of the process. Or knew about it but chose to not think about it. I don't understand why people can't soberly move through processes, realistically.

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vision63

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Lemon Drop

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vision63
Trump will be impeached. Wasn't that the goal?

Removal from office is the goal but yeah this is the start. He can still be tried and convicted and banned from future public office and then indicted for sedition after he leaves office.

Just getting started.

I wanted him impeached to punish him. I "knew" we could accomplish that. Removal could only be a remote aspiration. I don't think people understood the dual aspects of the process. Or knew about it but chose to not think about it. I don't understand why people can't soberly move through processes, realistically.

Realistically, we have been poisoned. Poisoned and put into a tragic slumber where a disgusting level of insanity has been normalized.

Realistically, here’s what should have happened in a sane America.

• The insurrection should have been handled like what it was.
• Personnel should have completed their evacuation or sequestration to their secure locations.
• While this was occurring, overwhelming force should have been brought in and readied.
• Simultaneously, law enforcement should have cleared the surrounding area.
• The National Guard should have then cleared the Capitol, and every single individual arrested and, at a minimum, booked and charged before release. Every single one.
• Trump should have been given only one ‘courtesy’. Make a public statement unequivocally directing those attacking the Capitol to, without resistance, let authorities take them into custody. We’re Trump to cooperate to that small extent, he would be allowed to stay out of handcuffs.
• Regardless, impeachment or 25th or 14th amendment proceedings should have begun as first order of business the next day.

On national media. “ I know your pain”. “We love you, you're very special.” Those were Trump’s messages to these domestic terrorists.

And now, we are left sitting with a twisted, corrupted little man still at the helm of our country, “punished” with the second application of a “Naughty Boy!” label after he’s wiped his a** with the first one.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2021 05:11PM by Blankity Blank.

I hate to be the rules guy, but I think it is important to understand that our system makes it hard to act instantaneously.

First, as long as the VP and the cabinet are unwilling to take action there is literally nothing that can happen to the guy with the President title. And even this process is fraught. Handcuffs and demands, as just as they might be, simply cannot happen. Even if he shoots someone.

Second, the Congress also has rules about its process. They can do things by 'unanimous consent' but if one person objects they have to go through the hoops. There are defined waiting periods and defined processes that cannot be changed instantly. For example, anything appearing on the Floor has to have a Rule set by the Rules Committee. This takes a day or two (unless unanimous consent happens.) This is to prevent undemocratic surprises.

The House passed a resolution one week after the event which is faster than light in Congressional terms. Even though the next day they had their plan and the day after that the had the written document it still needed the Rules Committee.

One other thing: I will bet any money that we are only hearing the beginnings of just how much %$#-ery went down. Panic buttons? Tours? I bet when the Bidens get access to the WH email and phone logs we will see much worse. Anyone think Ted Cruz' staff was not talking to these guys.

The new Senate will now get subpoena power to look at these things. Waiting may very well be better in terms of where this is going.

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numbered
I hate to be the rules guy, but I think it is important to understand that our system makes it hard to act instantaneously.

No one is talking about ‘Impeached and convicted in half an hour or it’s free’. But nine times out of ten the most pernicious roadblocks are people, not rules. There are usually procedural workarounds to push things through.

Look at the electoral certification process. Typical years as short as 20-40 minutes. This year was expected to go on for many hours because of the insistence of some making futile objections to slates. And then, lo and behold, even that was trimmed down greatly on the fly after the attack made some members rethink their obstructive behavior.

True, there are safeguards and bumpers built into the process, but it still has a healthy degree of susceptibility to ‘where there’s a will, there’s a way’.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/13/2021 07:57PM by Blankity Blank.

It's better this way. I am pretty sure that with a former-President-Trump to convict, instead of a current-President-Trump, there will be more Republicans ready to jump on board since they won't feel like they have to kiss his ring. Also there's more time for more damning evidence to come out.

And to me, the best part is: Trump is now the only President in history to be impeached twice. Remember being a little kid and all anybody told you about Andrew Johnson was he was Lincoln's VP when Abe died and the only President who ever got impeached? Well, that is how Trump will be remembered and I would hope that his record will stand for a very very long time maybe forever. His legacy is a dumpster fire and I like it like that.

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$tevie
It's better this way. I am pretty sure that with a former-President-Trump to convict, instead of a current-President-Trump, there will be more Republicans ready to jump on board since they won't feel like they have to kiss his ring.

I think what is more important and more meaningful to enable Republicans to jump ship is the elimination of Trump's Twitter account.

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AllGold

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$tevie
It's better this way. I am pretty sure that with a former-President-Trump to convict, instead of a current-President-Trump, there will be more Republicans ready to jump on board since they won't feel like they have to kiss his ring.

I think what is more important and more meaningful to enable Republicans to jump ship is the elimination of Trump's Twitter account.

Agree.

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