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Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 27, 2021 12:26PM
With the new CDC NO MASK regulations, outdoors only, no crowds, if you are vaccinated should produce the usual results. Everyone will cease wearing masks.

That means:
1) the new rule is science based.
2) will serve as an incentive to get the shots.

But let's face it, there are probably 100 million idiots who will declare the pandemic over and refuse to wear masks indoors, in close proximity outdoors, without having the Covid shots.

Though well intentioned, I think this is going to become a superspreader disaster. And that's not even counting variants and probably booster shots later this year.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/27/2021 12:49PM by Steve G..
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Re: Hey screwups: Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: GGD
Date: April 27, 2021 12:37PM
Quote
Steve G.
With the new CDC mask regulations, outdoors only, no crowds, if you are vaccinated should produce the usual results. Everyone will cease wearing masks.

That not a very clear statement and sounds like masks are required outdoors only.

Here's a description with a lot more words.

Quote

"If you are fully vaccinated and want to attend a small outdoor gathering with people who are vaccinated and unvaccinated, or dine at an outdoor restaurant with friends from multiple households, the science shows if you are vaccinated, you can do so safely unmasked," CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky said during a virtual White House briefing on Tuesday.

"Generally, for vaccinated people, outdoor activities without a mask are safe. However, we continue to recommend masking in crowded outdoor settings and venues, such as packed stadiums and concerts where there is decreased ability to maintain physical distance and where many unvaccinated people may also be present," Walensky said. "We will continue to recommend this until widespread vaccination is achieved."

[www.cnn.com]
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Re: Hey screwups: Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: April 27, 2021 12:42PM
Quote
GGD
Quote
Steve G.
With the new CDC mask regulations, outdoors only, no crowds, if you are vaccinated should produce the usual results. Everyone will cease wearing masks.

That not a very clear statement and sounds like masks are required outdoors only.

Here's a description with a lot more words.

Quote

"If you are fully vaccinated and want to attend a small outdoor gathering with people who are vaccinated and unvaccinated, or dine at an outdoor restaurant with friends from multiple households, the science shows if you are vaccinated, you can do so safely unmasked," CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky said during a virtual White House briefing on Tuesday.

"Generally, for vaccinated people, outdoor activities without a mask are safe. However, we continue to recommend masking in crowded outdoor settings and venues, such as packed stadiums and concerts where there is decreased ability to maintain physical distance and where many unvaccinated people may also be present," Walensky said. "We will continue to recommend this until widespread vaccination is achieved."

[www.cnn.com]

Thanks. I didn't understand SteveG's statement either. Written in haste perhaps?
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 27, 2021 12:46PM
Quote
Steve G.
With the new CDC NO MASK regulations, outdoors only, no crowds, if you are vaccinated should produce the usual results. Everyone will cease wearing masks.

That means:
1) the new rule is science based.
2) will serve as an incentive to get the shots.

But let's face it, there are probably 100 million idiots who will declare the pandemic over and refuse to wear masks indoors, in close proximity outdoors, without having the Covid shots.

Though well intentioned, I think this is going to become a superspreader disaster. And that's not even counting variants and probably booster shots later this year.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 27, 2021 12:47PM
I've changed it.

I figured that readers would see it as an admonition to those not observing the policy.
I was incorrect, i guess.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: btfc
Date: April 27, 2021 12:52PM
Grocery shopping last night, at least half of the other shoppers were unmasked. I was guessing that some of them were vaccinated and decided that they were over masking.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 27, 2021 01:10PM
I like the "two out of three" rule that the New York Times was pushing recently.

Whether or not you're vaccinated, if you don't have some certainty about the risk and the correct measures, fall back on this rule.

Pick any two of these three:
  • Outdoors
  • Socially Distance
  • Wear a Mask

So, if you're outdoors and don't want to wear a mask, that's fine if you can socially-distance. If you're indoors then you must both socially distance and wear a mask. If you're outdoors and someone wants to get up next to you to talk to you then put on your mask because you're not socially distancing anymore.



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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: April 27, 2021 01:11PM
"Science based." That's never stopped anyone from having preconceived notions one way or another.

I'm going unmasked out of doors when not in crowded areas. Since there really are no "crowded areas" any longer, that is a decent amount of open space. But the indoor mask mandate will not end any time soon here (or many places). Kids are still masked up when playing together.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 27, 2021 01:12PM
Quote
btfc
Grocery shopping last night, at least half of the other shoppers were unmasked. I was guessing that some of them were vaccinated and decided that they were over masking.

While my local grocery stores still have mask-mandates, they've stopped enforcing when people have their masks pulled down under their noses.

...I saw a guy double-masked with both pulled down below his nose.



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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: April 27, 2021 01:16PM
Honestly I would NOT have made this proclamation because I know people are idiots.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Acer
Date: April 27, 2021 01:18PM
Confession: We've been going generally unmasked when outdoors the entire pandemic, but keeping our masks at the ready, though, in case quarters get tight.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: April 27, 2021 01:24PM
....1,000 hail marys.......!!!



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: deckeda
Date: April 27, 2021 02:15PM
This doesn't change much. You still won't know if someone else was vaccinated nor will they know about you. So you're back to making and distancing, and they should be also.

After all, if you're outside and no one's really around, it wouldn't matter if you're vaccinated or not since the risk there is nil.

They could use stronger language, just go right up to the line of requirement: "We want you to go to ballgames, concerts, parties, and back to the office, but only if you're fully vaccinated."
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: p8712
Date: April 27, 2021 02:35PM
I will stick with a mask at least through the end of the year.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: wurm
Date: April 27, 2021 04:53PM
Quote
Sarcany
Quote
btfc
Grocery shopping last night, at least half of the other shoppers were unmasked. I was guessing that some of them were vaccinated and decided that they were over masking.

While my local grocery stores still have mask-mandates, they've stopped enforcing when people have their masks pulled down under their noses.

...I saw a guy double-masked with both pulled down below his nose.

And I saw an idiot in self-checkout with his mask pulled down below his nose and mouth. Well, at least it was covering his chin. RollingEyesSmiley5



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/27/2021 04:54PM by wurm.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: $tevie
Date: April 27, 2021 05:02PM
I worry that people will walk around without masks using the excuse "I've been vaccinated" even though they have not. I wish the CDC had kept this under their hat.



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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Ca Bob
Date: April 27, 2021 06:09PM
I think there is a point in telling people the truth. Yes, it may rebound on you when some fools extend what you told them into more risky behavior, but the damage done by lying or obscuring is to make yourself doubted and mistrusted no matter what you say.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 27, 2021 06:45PM
Quote
$tevie
I worry that people will walk around without masks using the excuse "I've been vaccinated" even though they have not. I wish the CDC had kept this under their hat.

I think the REAL problem is a significant lack of understanding of science and medical things by the general public. For example, the idea that you cannot get sick if vaccinated. Or any sort of understanding about how things are transmitted. One of my favorite YouTubes to illustrate this concept is one that someone here posted a long while back: [www.youtube.com]




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: RgrF
Date: April 27, 2021 08:20PM
Quote
PeterB
Quote
$tevie
I worry that people will walk around without masks using the excuse "I've been vaccinated" even though they have not. I wish the CDC had kept this under their hat.

I think the REAL problem is a significant lack of understanding of science and medical things by the general public. For example, the idea that you cannot get sick if vaccinated. Or any sort of understanding about how things are transmitted. One of my favorite YouTubes to illustrate this concept is one that someone here posted a long while back: [www.youtube.com]

The constant dis-unified drip of information adds up. Today MIT released a study that found social distancing (6 feet) was a fallacy. Whether factual or not this sort of thing gets weaponized by political types - types who don't give "rats ass" if people get sick or if they die but are willing to use the pandemic to further their drive for power.

The process of collecting and disseminating accurate public information is intentionally sabotaged by entities like Fox News and Murdoch publications. It's a mess out there and hard to see a way to clarify anything without first getting a handle on the disinformation channels that operate under 1st amendment protections.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Sarcany
Date: April 27, 2021 08:31PM
Quote
RgrF
The constant dis-unified drip of information adds up. Today MIT released a study that found social distancing (6 feet) was a fallacy...

Not at all.

It's nuanced. And also NOTHING WE DIDN'T ALREADY KNOW IF WE'VE ALL BEEN PAYING ATTENTION.

[www.washingtonpost.com]

The common six-foot social distancing guidance on its own may not be enough to protect people from contracting the coronavirus while spending time indoors, according to a report that examined the virus’s airborne transmission risk.

Researchers from the Massachusetts Institute of Technology argued that not all indoor settings are the same, varying by size, ventilation, air filtration, occupancy and the nature of the activity. While the core premise of the study isn’t new, the research offers more details (and a handy online risk-assessment calculator) to help people better understand what factors in a given indoor setting may increase their risk for catching the coronavirus.

“For airborne transmission, social distancing in indoor spaces is not enough, and may provide a false sense of security,” Martin Z. Bazant, an MIT chemical engineering professor and the paper’s lead author, told The Washington Post in an email...


Of course, one way to address this is to always wear a mask as well as respecting social distance when working/socializing indoors.

“Efficient mask use is the most effective safety measure, followed by room ventilation, then filtration,” Bush told The Post in an email. “And risk increases with the number of occupants and the exposure time, so one should try to spend as little time as possible in crowded indoor spaces.”

...The researchers stressed their findings do not suggest that social distancing is ineffective — only that it does not provide sufficient protection in the particular indoor circumstances calculated in their models.



Quote
RgrF
Whether factual or not this sort of thing gets weaponized by political types - types who don't give "rats ass" if people get sick or if they die but are willing to use the pandemic to further their drive for power.

Not disagreeing with that at all.



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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: RgrF
Date: April 27, 2021 08:34PM
Thought it'd been show that "Headlines Translate" nuance almost not at all.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: deckeda
Date: April 27, 2021 08:45PM
People -- usually conservatives -- demand absolutism. If you can't prove that 6ft is always required everywhere, it's as good as a lie to them.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 27, 2021 09:54PM
Yes, the problem is that part of understanding scientific / medical information is the awareness that science is (unlike religion) always to be questioned and corrected if need be-- critical thinking is part of the process. And as others have pointed out, it's rarely about absolutes or 5-second sound bites. It's messy and complicated, which is perfectly OK.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Ted King
Date: April 27, 2021 10:06PM
Quote
PeterB
Yes, the problem is that part of understanding scientific / medical information is the awareness that science is (unlike religion) always to be questioned and corrected if need be-- critical thinking is part of the process. And as others have pointed out, it's rarely about absolutes or 5-second sound bites. It's messy and complicated, which is perfectly OK.

Skepticism is an integral part of ferreting out cause and effect patterns in nature. It's so easy to see patterns that aren't there and to miss patterns that are. But skepticism does not imply that you can't come to a reasonable judgment about how much confidence you have about certain well tested hypotheses. Especially in practical application. I hear Fauci all the time talking in terms of how much confidence - or lack of - that they have in different scientific assessments.



e pluribus unum
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: April 27, 2021 10:35PM
If smoking was still allowed in restaurants, people would have a better idea about the true nature of air circulation in enclosed spaces.

Think about the times you came out a bar stinking of cigarette smoke. Now imagine those are virus-laden particles.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: April 28, 2021 03:41AM
Outdoors
Socially Distance
Wear a Mask



All three for me, for the foreseeable future.

Not a problem.



I worry that people will walk around without masks using the excuse "I've been vaccinated" even though they have not. I wish the CDC had kept this under their hat.


This is part of the reason for my above.

I don't want anybody concerned about whether or not I've been vaccinated.

Also, I am concerned that somebody who might not be ballsy enough to admit they're an anti-vacc type, might try to fly under the radar with the ploy $tevie mentioned.

Lastly, I talked to a couple of people who were accosted (with proper social distancing, for what that's worth) by self-proclaimed MaskUp vigilantes (my editorializing, not an actual thing) about not wearing a mask between their cars in a parking lot and the mall they were walking to, in spite nobody else near them, let alone six feet.

After adjusting some attitudes, they continued on their way.

Also, as I double mask, it's just more convenient to maskup before stepping out the door, and just leave them on unless I'm going to be in my car for a long period of time.

I am more and more comfortable breathing with them, the more I wear them, so there's that.

Doing box breathing at home without masks, and out and about with masks helps a lot.





Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody matters or nobody matters.

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all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

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An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: RgrF
Date: April 28, 2021 04:31AM
I've been been diagnosed COPD (thanks Winstons ciggs) and thus exempt from from masking - I still mask when outside the car.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: PeterB
Date: April 28, 2021 10:22AM
Quote
Ted King
Quote
PeterB
Yes, the problem is that part of understanding scientific / medical information is the awareness that science is (unlike religion) always to be questioned and corrected if need be-- critical thinking is part of the process. And as others have pointed out, it's rarely about absolutes or 5-second sound bites. It's messy and complicated, which is perfectly OK.

Skepticism is an integral part of ferreting out cause and effect patterns in nature. It's so easy to see patterns that aren't there and to miss patterns that are. But skepticism does not imply that you can't come to a reasonable judgment about how much confidence you have about certain well tested hypotheses. Especially in practical application. I hear Fauci all the time talking in terms of how much confidence - or lack of - that they have in different scientific assessments.

Yes, and the fact that Fauci and Walensky don't mince words -- that is, they generally don't phrase things in absolutes -- is part of what bothers some people, that they always want a simple answer to what might be very complicated questions. And the most basic answer in science is, "I don't know."




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: April 28, 2021 01:53PM
Quote
Steve G.
Though well intentioned, I think this is going to become a superspreader disaster. And that's not even counting variants and probably booster shots later this year.

At this point, I'm totally OK with the anti-vax troglodytes killing off one another. Their backwards thinking and complete repudiation of science has become an unsustainable drag upon our society and our species.



It is what it is.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: April 28, 2021 02:37PM
Quote
Ca Bob
I think there is a point in telling people the truth. Yes, it may rebound on you when some fools extend what you told them into more risky behavior, but the damage done by lying or obscuring is to make yourself doubted and mistrusted no matter what you say.

Agreed, that's something very few people seem to grasp.
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Re: Hey screwups: NO MASK=>Outdoors Only, If You're Vaccinated, No Crowds!
Posted by: C(-)ris
Date: April 28, 2021 10:16PM
Quote
Acer
Confession: We've been going generally unmasked when outdoors the entire pandemic, but keeping our masks at the ready, though, in case quarters get tight.

Yup. Never wore a mask outside. Was never in a crowd either.



C(-)ris
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