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Karen du jour
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 12, 2021 05:59PM
This is a lot. Connected to current road/air rage general national nervous breakdown?

[twitter.com]

This is 2 women in a Victoria Secret after the same pair of free panties, I guess. One tries to hit the other, then realizes she is being recorded.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: July 12, 2021 06:58PM
It’s like a giant 4 year old!
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: July 12, 2021 07:04PM
WHAT.

THE.

@#$%&.



It is what it is.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: PeterB
Date: July 12, 2021 07:59PM
Over a pair of free panties???

Jeezo.

I know VS has nice stuff, but really...

And yeah, we might be seeing more and more of this kind of thing (plus road rage incidents, shootings, etc.), as peoples' undealt-with stress finally simmers, approaches the boiling point, and ultimately explodes.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Ted King
Date: July 12, 2021 08:15PM
It's a pretty ugly thing to see a person go from such a strong feeling of entitlement to feel free to unjustifiably physically threaten another person to realizing she was caught to faking that she was the one who was being assaulted as a way to flip the blame but then when the clerk says "yeah, no", she slips into horror that that ploy not only didn't work but now she looks ridiculous and actually, I think, spends a moment feeling ashamed but quickly falls back on entitlement mode - I'm entitled to demand you stop filming my humiliation! Her yelling, "Get away from me" as she is chasing the person that is filming her is sort of the perfect finishing scene to this farce.

The person filming certainly had good sober reason to keep filming but I think she also got a kick out of getting it on video. If so, I don't blame her a bit for that.



e pluribus unum
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: p8712
Date: July 12, 2021 08:15PM
Yikes. Stress, anger, entitlement, and mental illness combined I would assume. The only thing I hate about videos like this is we cannot objectively see what happened, not that would really matter to provoke a reaction like this.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: space-time
Date: July 12, 2021 08:27PM
I hope these people have mental issues... if they don't and this is who they really are, God Help Us!
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: wave rider
Date: July 12, 2021 08:29PM
Creepy and unsettling.



=wr=
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: July 12, 2021 08:29PM
Quote
space-time
I hope these people have mental issues... if they don't and this is who they really are, God Help Us!

…help the people who live with them! wall smiley
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: p8712
Date: July 12, 2021 08:31PM
I just realized I only saw the second part of the video. I went back and watch the first part. Dang. That’s objective enough for me.

How many other times has she pulled this kind of crap in her life? Many, many times I would imagine.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 12, 2021 08:56PM
What I find odd and sad is that throughout this 10 minute meltdown, no bystander tries to deescalate the situation. One woman asks the person recording to stop, which was not at all helpful.

She's the same age as my kids. I would have tried to get her to calm down, get someplace else and call someone to get her. Not out of sympathy but just to calm it down.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: July 12, 2021 09:23PM
Quote
PeterB
I know VS has nice stuff, but really...

Actually, VS hasn't had nice stuff for quite some time now, according to the Ladies of Reddit.



It is what it is.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: space-time
Date: July 12, 2021 09:35PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
PeterB
I know VS has nice stuff, but really...

Actually, VS hasn't had nice stuff for quite some time now, according to the Ladies of Reddit.

Don’t spoil his pantysies, please!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/12/2021 09:35PM by space-time.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: July 12, 2021 09:36PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
What I find odd and sad is that throughout this 10 minute meltdown, no bystander tries to deescalate the situation. One woman asks the person recording to stop, which was not at all helpful.

People today literally be crazy. No one in their right mind wants to get mixed up with crazy.



It is what it is.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: p8712
Date: July 12, 2021 10:39PM
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
Lemon Drop
What I find odd and sad is that throughout this 10 minute meltdown, no bystander tries to deescalate the situation. One woman asks the person recording to stop, which was not at all helpful.

People today literally be crazy. No one in their right mind wants to get mixed up with crazy.

I would not approach this woman at all, unless she were physically attacking me or someone else. I would assume a shopping mall has some kind of security force.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: PeterB
Date: July 12, 2021 11:11PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
What I find odd and sad is that throughout this 10 minute meltdown, no bystander tries to deescalate the situation. One woman asks the person recording to stop, which was not at all helpful.

She's the same age as my kids. I would have tried to get her to calm down, get someplace else and call someone to get her. Not out of sympathy but just to calm it down.

Yes, I noticed that too, but I think it's a result of bystander syndrome, where (especially nowadays) people feel compelled to record events on social media, rather than actually get involved and stop or mediate a situation. [sites.psu.edu]

Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
PeterB
I know VS has nice stuff, but really...

Actually, VS hasn't had nice stuff for quite some time now, according to the Ladies of Reddit.

Personally, I wouldn't know, I haven't stepped into one of their stores for years... I am only going based on their apparent popularity with women (and men).




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Fritz
Date: July 13, 2021 08:35AM
wow. must be a Flack outtake or a real X-File



!#$@@$#!

If there are spelling issues, please pardon, Owen the cat is sitting on my keyboard.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 13, 2021 09:07AM
Quote
p8712
Quote
N-OS X-tasy!
Quote
Lemon Drop
What I find odd and sad is that throughout this 10 minute meltdown, no bystander tries to deescalate the situation. One woman asks the person recording to stop, which was not at all helpful.

People today literally be crazy. No one in their right mind wants to get mixed up with crazy.

I would not approach this woman at all, unless she were physically attacking me or someone else. I would assume a shopping mall has some kind of security force.

Of course you can't assess without being there, but based on the video she doesn't seem that intimidating, just making a lot of noise. I've dealt with far more out of control people than this one, I think I would have tried to help her calm down.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: July 13, 2021 10:36AM
I wonder what kind of child this woman was, you know, back when she was actually a child.





Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody matters or nobody matters.

When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men except
by believing all possible evil of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Ombligo
Date: July 13, 2021 10:37AM
I don't buy that she was out of control, I think she was well aware of her actions and was playing it out to get what she wanted.



“No persons are more frequently wrong, than those who will not admit they are wrong.”
-- François de La Rochefoucauld

Growing older is mandatory. Growing up is optional.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: July 13, 2021 10:52AM
I don't buy that she was out of control, I think she was well aware of her actions and was playing it out to get what she wanted.


I agree.

A childhood device, the temper tantrum.

I suppose one could argue that childhood tantrums are 'out of control' actions but I've seen an immediate change in behavior when some people's kids are placated.

Ticks me off.

The other extreme does likewise— the parent(s) allowing the kid to throw a tantrum in a public place while the adult ignores them and goes about their personal business.

So I wonder what this woman's childhood was like.





Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody matters or nobody matters.

When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men except
by believing all possible evil of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: July 13, 2021 02:33PM
.....panties......sniff.....sniff.....??



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Ammo
Date: July 13, 2021 04:02PM
IMO, serious mental illness (or maybe drugs).



Where is there dignity unless there is also honesty? - Cicero

Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a battle you know nothing about. —Wendy Mass
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: kj
Date: July 13, 2021 07:19PM
First, as someone who has spent most of his life being paid to de-escalate and otherwise handle people having problems like that, she is not just a Karen. She has some sort of diagnosis. Her frontal lobe is the size of a pea.

Second, I wouldn't get involved in that situation under any circumstances, short of protecting my own physical well-being. Everyone in that store should literally just go out the door, and security or law enforcement should be called. My feeling is that she could peg someone, but you don't know unless you have a lot of history with her.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: July 13, 2021 09:09PM
I'm surprised at the surprise. I've seen this kind if behavior in public. This is someone with a real problem. Clinical problem. Maybe being in a city where you'd see people with more mental health issues than in the suburbs?
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 13, 2021 09:45PM
More details including the police reports are out now.

White woman Abigail told the police she freaked out because she was afraid of losing her job and apartment if Black woman posted the video of Abigail trying to shove her over a pair of panties. Police explained to Abigail that said lady had every right to record events in the store.

She was immediately calm when the cops got there, no more shrieking. Told them she was fine , did not need any medical attention, and drove herself home. They saw no need to follow up with her. That's exactly what I'd expect as she appeared to be acting during her tantrum.

I see an emotionally unstable, immature young white woman who caused a scene. Imagine a Black teen acting this way in a store, cops with guns would be there in 3 minutes. I see nothing to indicate she's recieved a mental health diagnosis. No way to know that, wrong to assume it.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Blankity Blank
Date: July 13, 2021 11:51PM
I can’t imagine anyone but a white soccer mom getting away from the situation without a mandatory psych evaluation or hold. She was literally apoplectic.





National Suicide Prevention Hotline tel:1-800-273-8255

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: kj
Date: July 14, 2021 12:07AM
If you've ever worked in a group home, that's EXACTLY what it looks like. If she was just putting on an act, or is completely normal in every other way, that would be nothing short of miraculous. Have you ever, ever, seen a normal adult act like that?

No one should have to endure behavior like that, but I'm not exactly ready to contribute to the videographer's 50k gofundme account either. The whole thing looks like a mess, but the only person in the video I feel bad for is the lady working there having to put up with both of them.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: kj
Date: July 14, 2021 12:25AM
Quote
Blankity Blank
I can’t imagine anyone but a white soccer mom getting away from the situation without a mandatory psych evaluation or hold. She was literally apoplectic.


I've seen crap tons of people do worse things than that, and "get away with it". I'm not sure any of them were soccer moms (most of them were dudes).
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Blankity Blank
Date: July 14, 2021 12:34AM
Oh I have every sympathy for the woman recording.

Too many years, too many generations of immediately being assumed to be the one doing wrong, the threat, the one ‘out of control’ no matter the evidence. When she says she is filming to protect herself, she has both feet on solid ground.

The other woman lit a fuse with her wildly erratic behavior and deserves no quarter from the person most likely to become collateral damage if she doesn’t protect herself from police presence once they arrive.

Quote
kj
I've seen crap tons of people do worse things than that, and "get away with it". I'm not sure any of them were soccer moms (most of them were dudes).

Just for clarity’s sake, it’s a lot, but have you had a chance to watch all the segments? There are six or seven regarding her behavior, including on the phone frantically telling police the Black woman is threatening her and very badly faux ‘fainting’.



National Suicide Prevention Hotline tel:1-800-273-8255

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/14/2021 12:47AM by Blankity Blank.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 14, 2021 08:15AM
Quote
Blankity Blank
Oh I have every sympathy for the woman recording.

Too many years, too many generations of immediately being assumed to be the one doing wrong, the threat, the one ‘out of control’ no matter the evidence. When she says she is filming to protect herself, she has both feet on solid ground.

The other woman lit a fuse with her wildly erratic behavior and deserves no quarter from the person most likely to become collateral damage if she doesn’t protect herself from police presence once they ’.


Yes to all this. This is the reason for the huge outpouring of support for her GoFundMe, people are sick of this mess. She can use that to hire an excellent attorney and sue Victoria's Secret. I suspect they will find a pattern of discrimination against Black customers.

Had she not recorded what happened, and been backed up by store employee witnesses, the white woman's story of victimhood would have been believed. No question. Been working for hundreds of years. She wss ready to claim she had been threatened and harassed when in fact she was the aggressor.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Fritz
Date: July 14, 2021 08:32AM
Karen was auditioning for a "mentally ill" 2 yo.
I call b.s.
By next week she'll have "talk" show.



!#$@@$#!

If there are spelling issues, please pardon, Owen the cat is sitting on my keyboard.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: PeterB
Date: July 14, 2021 08:50AM
Quote
Lemon Drop
More details including the police reports are out now.

White woman Abigail told the police she freaked out because she was afraid of losing her job and apartment if Black woman posted the video of Abigail trying to shove her over a pair of panties. Police explained to Abigail that said lady had every right to record events in the store.

She was immediately calm when the cops got there, no more shrieking. Told them she was fine , did not need any medical attention, and drove herself home. They saw no need to follow up with her. That's exactly what I'd expect as she appeared to be acting during her tantrum.

I see an emotionally unstable, immature young white woman who caused a scene. Imagine a Black teen acting this way in a store, cops with guns would be there in 3 minutes. I see nothing to indicate she's recieved a mental health diagnosis. No way to know that, wrong to assume it.

Followup questions:

1) It just occurs to me, is it legal to video someone inside a store like this? I know photography/video in general is legal in public spaces, but this is a business, and obviously the person filming didn't have the permission of the business owners to record inside their store.

2) If she did shove her over the panties (and presumably she was recorded doing it), that's assault, and shouldn't she (Abigail) be arrested for that?

3) Where was store security (or even just the store management) when this was all happening?

4) Who called the police?

5) Abigail's behavior is beyond bizarre. If all of this is recorded, it should be fairly obvious to police that she is at best highly manipulative, and at worst in need of serious MH care. While it's not the job of the police to give out MH treatment, they should/could have charged her with disturbing the peace, which might have eventually led to a MH assessment. No doubt she would have been, had the races of the women in question been flipped.




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/14/2021 08:50AM by PeterB.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Ted King
Date: July 14, 2021 08:58AM
Quote
Lemon Drop

Had she not recorded what happened, and been backed up by store employee witnesses, the white woman's story of victimhood would have been believed. No question. Been working for hundreds of years. She wss ready to claim she had been threatened and harassed when in fact she was the aggressor.

Smart phones that can record video are one of the best things that have happened for black people in America.



e pluribus unum
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Lux Interior
Date: July 14, 2021 09:05AM
Quote
Ted King
Smart phones that can record video are one of the best things that have happened for black people in America.

And the worst for UFO & Bigfoot aficionados.

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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Janit
Date: July 14, 2021 09:10AM
Quote
Blankity Blank
Oh I have every sympathy for the woman recording.

Too many years, too many generations of immediately being assumed to be the one doing wrong, the threat, the one ‘out of control’ no matter the evidence. When she says she is filming to protect herself, she has both feet on solid ground.

The other woman lit a fuse with her wildly erratic behavior and deserves no quarter from the person most likely to become collateral damage if she doesn’t protect herself from police presence once they arrive.

Quote
kj
I've seen crap tons of people do worse things than that, and "get away with it". I'm not sure any of them were soccer moms (most of them were dudes).

Just for clarity’s sake, it’s a lot, but have you had a chance to watch all the segments? There are six or seven regarding her behavior, including on the phone frantically telling police the Black woman is threatening her and very badly faux ‘fainting’.

Can you provide a link to the other segments?
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Robert M
Date: July 14, 2021 10:01AM
Hi everyone,

You might find this article about the incident on truthorfiction.com an interesting read:

[www.truthorfiction.com]

Robert
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Blankity Blank
Date: July 14, 2021 10:54AM
Quote
Janit
Quote
Blankity Blank
Just for clarity’s sake, it’s a lot, but have you had a chance to watch all the segments? There are six or seven regarding her behavior, including on the phone frantically telling police the Black woman is threatening her and very badly faux ‘fainting’.

Can you provide a link to the other segments?

A very good list of links is provided in Robert M’s post directly above.



National Suicide Prevention Hotline tel:1-800-273-8255

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: p8712
Date: July 14, 2021 11:30AM
Quote
Robert M
Hi everyone,

You might find this article about the incident on truthorfiction.com an interesting read:

[www.truthorfiction.com]

Robert

Thanks, I like full context.

Quote

Ukenta concludes the second video by saying “I guess she’s gone now,” but began filming for a brief video she titled “Karen Goes Crazy Part 3 (Security acts oblivious.)” In that clip, Ukenta speaks with a security guard who professes not to know to whom she is referring as he asks about the incident.

In “Karen Goes Crazy Part 4,” a four-minute long video, Ukenta reiterates to a police officer that Elphick attacked her, and she requests that Elphick be asked to leave the Short Hills Mall. The police officer claims he does not have the ability to ask Elphick to leave.

I find that hard to believe.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: JoeH
Date: July 14, 2021 12:10PM
Quote
p8712
Quote
Robert M
Hi everyone,

You might find this article about the incident on truthorfiction.com an interesting read:

[www.truthorfiction.com]

Robert

Thanks, I like full context.

Quote

Ukenta concludes the second video by saying “I guess she’s gone now,” but began filming for a brief video she titled “Karen Goes Crazy Part 3 (Security acts oblivious.)” In that clip, Ukenta speaks with a security guard who professes not to know to whom she is referring as he asks about the incident.

In “Karen Goes Crazy Part 4,” a four-minute long video, Ukenta reiterates to a police officer that Elphick attacked her, and she requests that Elphick be asked to leave the Short Hills Mall. The police officer claims he does not have the ability to ask Elphick to leave.

I find that hard to believe.

No, not hard to believe. Someone from the store or mall would have had to ask her to leave. Then the officer could enforce that request.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 14, 2021 12:36PM
Quote
PeterB
Quote
Lemon Drop
More details including the police reports are out now.

White woman Abigail told the police she freaked out because she was afraid of losing her job and apartment if Black woman posted the video of Abigail trying to shove her over a pair of panties. Police explained to Abigail that said lady had every right to record events in the store.

She was immediately calm when the cops got there, no more shrieking. Told them she was fine , did not need any medical attention, and drove herself home. They saw no need to follow up with her. That's exactly what I'd expect as she appeared to be acting during her tantrum.

I see an emotionally unstable, immature young white woman who caused a scene. Imagine a Black teen acting this way in a store, cops with guns would be there in 3 minutes. I see nothing to indicate she's recieved a mental health diagnosis. No way to know that, wrong to assume it.

Followup questions:

1) It just occurs to me, is it legal to video someone inside a store like this? I know photography/video in general is legal in public spaces, but this is a business, and obviously the person filming didn't have the permission of the business owners to record inside their store.

yes, it is legal to film someone in public. The police confirmed to Abigail that Ukenta had the right to record what was happening. Abigail could have left at any time.

2) If she did shove her over the panties (and presumably she was recorded doing it), that's assault, and shouldn't she (Abigail) be arrested for that?

It is only a couple of seconds on the video but it looks as though Abigail swings clumsily and misses. UKenta did not accuse her of actually hitting her, just of trying to.



3) Where was store security (or even just the store management) when this was all happening?

the store staff was right there with these two ladies but they are mostly our of frame. They called their internal crisis management team, and mall security

4) Who called the police?

ABIGAIL. Thats what earns her the Karen badge. Then Ukenta followed up with police and saw that the report contained errors.

5) Abigail's behavior is beyond bizarre. If all of this is recorded, it should be fairly obvious to police that she is at best highly manipulative, and at worst in need of serious MH care. While it's not the job of the police to give out MH treatment, they should/could have charged her with disturbing the peace, which might have eventually led to a MH assessment. No doubt she would have been, had the races of the women in question been flipped.

MY UNDERSTANDONG OF MENTAL HEALTH HOLDS IS THAT THEY ARE USED WHEN A PERSON IS A DANGER TO THEMSELVES OR OTHERS. THAT WASN'T THE CASE HERE. DISTURBING THE PEACE ONLY WOULD NOT RESULT IN A MENTAL HEALTH HOLD.

If I got something wrong above please correct.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: PeterB
Date: July 14, 2021 12:58PM
1) It's legal to film someone in public, but this wasn't a public space -- since it's a place of business, it's owned by the business and should be considered as private property. I'm no lawyer though... the fact that it's a business that invites the public in, may make it a public space.

2) Swinging clumsily and missing is still assault.

3) If they called the crisis management team and security, that should be documented somewhere and in the police report too.

4) Yes, if true, I'd agree that that's pretty much the definition of a Karen.

5) Based on the behavior in the video, she could easily have been considered to be disturbing the peace. Yelling and screaming and making a scene for no good reason...




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: AllGold
Date: July 14, 2021 01:30PM
Quote
PeterB
1) It's legal to film someone in public, but this wasn't a public space -- since it's a place of business, it's owned by the business and should be considered as private property. I'm no lawyer though... the fact that it's a business that invites the public in, may make it a public space.

You are correct on the second part. But regardless, only the property owner/management not the customers have the right to limit behavior of other customers. Even so, all they can do is ask you to leave. Then if you don't comply it becomes trespassing.



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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: kj
Date: July 14, 2021 01:33PM
Quote
Blankity Blank
Oh I have every sympathy for the woman recording.

Too many years, too many generations of immediately being assumed to be the one doing wrong, the threat, the one ‘out of control’ no matter the evidence. When she says she is filming to protect herself, she has both feet on solid ground.

The other woman lit a fuse with her wildly erratic behavior and deserves no quarter from the person most likely to become collateral damage if she doesn’t protect herself from police presence once they arrive.

Quote
kj
I've seen crap tons of people do worse things than that, and "get away with it". I'm not sure any of them were soccer moms (most of them were dudes).

Just for clarity’s sake, it’s a lot, but have you had a chance to watch all the segments? There are six or seven regarding her behavior, including on the phone frantically telling police the Black woman is threatening her and very badly faux ‘fainting’.

I believe I have, but I can't say for sure, at this moment. I have seen minorities do much worse, and not have any consequences at all, so I think it would be more accurate to say a minority would be more likely to have more severe consequences behaving like that. It is inaccurate to say "only a white soccer mom would get away with that". Lots of people get away with worse than that. And I would bet actual money this lady is not a soccer mom, nor does she broadly represent the larger group of soccer moms. I don't think it has anything to do with "Karens". This lady is nuts.

I still believe there is something seriously wrong with this person, so I don't like that the lady is snickering and talking to other people like she can't hear her. I personally would not exacerbate the problem by doing that. I understand it, but it's neither necessary, nor helpful. I agree that getting video of the situation is a good idea, and don't see anything wrong with that.

I'm not sure about the gofundme. I'm going to wait for more info.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Ombligo
Date: July 14, 2021 01:56PM
Public vs private.. Media Law 101 for photojournalists.

A store open to the public may limit onsite photography. What that means is that a store can request you leave if they see you with a camera. However, they can not confiscate your equipment or any images you already took.

When I was working if we needed a photo of something inside Walmart (or wherever), the photographer would carry the bare minimum, usually a camera and one lens, and would not seek out an employee for permission. Go straight to what you need photos off, start shooting. Within a very few minutes, a store employee will ask you to leave. Don't argue, just leave.

If permission is asked and denied, then nothing can be shot. So better to seek forgiveness.



“No persons are more frequently wrong, than those who will not admit they are wrong.”
-- François de La Rochefoucauld

Growing older is mandatory. Growing up is optional.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: July 14, 2021 02:07PM
'teeny-tiny internet blip get international attention'
I can find a dozen of her walking around Penn Station area...and much more violent.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Blankity Blank
Date: July 14, 2021 02:36PM
Quote
kj
I believe I have, but I can't say for sure, at this moment. I have seen minorities do much worse, and not have any consequences at all, so I think it would be more accurate to say a minority would be more likely to have more severe consequences behaving like that. It is inaccurate to say "only a white soccer mom would get away with that". Lots of people get away with worse than that. And I would bet actual money this lady is not a soccer mom, nor does she broadly represent the larger group of soccer moms. I don't think it has anything to do with "Karens". This lady is nuts.

I can easily and happily agree to disagree on most of that (She is definitely nuts). Regional and even generational differences alone could plausibly provide different life experiences that would support both viewpoints, let alone a myriad of other factors.

Quote

I'm not sure about the gofundme. I'm going to wait for more info.

Not at all unreasonable.



National Suicide Prevention Hotline tel:1-800-273-8255

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: p8712
Date: July 14, 2021 02:40PM
What would you do with a Karen



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/14/2021 02:40PM by p8712.
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 14, 2021 04:21PM
Quote
Ombligo
Public vs private.. Media Law 101 for photojournalists.

A store open to the public may limit onsite photography. What that means is that a store can request you leave if they see you with a camera. However, they can not confiscate your equipment or any images you already took.

When I was working if we needed a photo of something inside Walmart (or wherever), the photographer would carry the bare minimum, usually a camera and one lens, and would not seek out an employee for permission. Go straight to what you need photos off, start shooting. Within a very few minutes, a store employee will ask you to leave. Don't argue, just leave.

If permission is asked and denied, then nothing can be shot. So better to seek forgiveness.

Interesting, but I don't think this is relevant to this situation. You are talking about photography for commercial purposes.

This woman recorded a potential crime against herself, and that recording is now official evidence in an investigation. I haven't seen anyone including the police suggest that she had no right to make this recording.

A retail store in a mall is a public accommodation, people in those spaces have many rights.

The police have launched an internal investigation into how their officers responded.
[www.nj.com]
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Re: Karen du jour
Posted by: N-OS X-tasy!
Date: July 14, 2021 05:49PM
Quote
Ombligo
If permission is asked and denied, then nothing can be shot. So better to seek forgiveness.

One of life's most profound truths.



It is what it is.
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