advertisement
Forums

 

AAPL stock: Click Here

You are currently viewing the 'Friendly' Political Ranting forum
Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: hal
Date: July 28, 2021 01:26PM
No real surprises here, but it still hurts to see it...

[www.kcra.com]

Non-traffic stops

• Black people experienced non-traffic stops 5.7 times as often as white people per year on average, and Latinos experienced non-traffic stops 1.3 times as often as white people per year on average (taking into account the population size of each group)

• Once stopped, Black people were 59.7% more likely to be searched than white people, and Latinos were 21.5% more likely to be searched than white people

• Searches of Black people and Latinos produced contraband less frequently than in searches of white people

Traffic stops

• Black people make up 13.1% of the population of Sacramento but made up 38% of all people who experienced traffic stops

• Latinos make up 28.3% of the population of Sacramento and made up 23% of all people who experienced traffic stops

• White people make up 33.1% of the population of Sacramento but made up 29% of all people who experienced traffic stops

• Once stopped, Black people were searched 2.7 times as often as white people, and Latinos were 87% more likely to be searched than white people

Use of Force

• The total number of use-of-force incidents per year decreased 27.4% between 2014 and 2019

• Black people were subjected to force 4.5 times as often as white people per year on average, taking into account the population size of each group

• Latinos were subjected to force at approximately the same rate as white people per year on average, taking into account the population size of each group
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 28, 2021 01:40PM
The response to these types of revelations has become hands off. Now we have utter mayhem in these streets. Nobody is going to stop these guys. The politicians like to point to data that "proves" that crime rates are flat when we know better.

Racism is wrong. But allowing criminals to run roughshod over us isn't good.

Even your former Senator (Boxer) was assaulted and robbed near Jack London Square the other day. It's out of control.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: bfd
Date: July 28, 2021 02:00PM
The obvious (to anyone paying attention) increase in the crime rate one of the things that's going to make it tough for Newsom to gather support among independent voters this September, and they could well be the ones who determine what happens in the Governor's office. Newsom could well be going the way of Gray…

Crime and criminality is definitely out of control. The daily police blotter here is overflowing with random shootings, hit and run (with death) accidents, robberies in broad daylight, etc. This shouldn't be the norm. Wrist slaps and "probation" seem to be the currently popular approach.

Whether a crackdown on crime is the answer shouldn't be a question. It's just who is being cracked down upon
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: hal
Date: July 28, 2021 02:23PM
We don't need a 'crack down' but the whole don't call the cops for 'minor' crimes has gone horribly wrong. YT is full of vids of people and groups of people casually packing up HUGE packs of stolen goods and walking out the front door - how did that become ok?

HOWEVER - reporting the actual numbers in the OP is important. Talking to Latinos I knew re their commute from Yuba City to Rancho Cordova... they would get pulled over once a week for nothing.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 28, 2021 03:32PM
They're not going to do anything. It's just going to get worse. The political climate isn't right for stopping it.

But look at NYC, the exact guy everybody claimed they didn't want to be mayor is mayor. Mr stop and frisk. The same fate will befall any politician that allows this to continue.

The people sitting on the floor in their houses in order to be less of a target for random shootings don't care about studies that show this and that. We're talking Black and Latino people. People that care strongly about unfairness and racism. They care more about their immediate safety.

My friend Sandi is interviewed in this clip: [youtu.be]
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: hal
Date: July 28, 2021 03:44PM
So let me get this straight. You don't appreciate seeing this kind of evidence publicized because it won't lead to any change and will in fact just get people angrier and lead to more violence?

is that right? Honestly, I'm not sure I'm following your thinking here...
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: July 28, 2021 03:47PM
What is a “non-traffic stop”? Stopping pedestrians?
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 28, 2021 03:57PM
Quote
hal
So let me get this straight. You don't appreciate seeing this kind of evidence publicized because it won't lead to any change and will in fact just get people angrier and lead to more violence?

is that right? Honestly, I'm not sure I'm following your thinking here...

Really. Who are they hipping with that information? NOW we know cops stop minorities. Before this, who knew??
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: pdq
Date: July 28, 2021 04:09PM
FWIW, murders started going up last year:



Not-so-fun fact; the murder rate in the darkest days of the Great Depression (the early 30’s) was near the top of that seen in the 20th century (and is way below that now).

Desperate, unemployed people do desperate things when they have nothing to lose.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/28/2021 04:21PM by pdq.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: pdq
Date: July 28, 2021 04:16PM
Some more stuff from a recent study of 34 US cities:







I don’t think this is new to 2021, or due to a sudden desire to coddle criminals, unless that just happened to coincide with the pandemic.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 28, 2021 04:17PM
Quote
pdq
FWIW, murders started going up last year:



Not-so-fun fact; the murder rate in the 30’s was near the top of that seen in the 20th century (and way below that now).

Desperate, unemployed people do desperate things when they have nothing to lose.

'86 to '92 on that chart was the historic crack epidemic. That's what made the Crime Bill possible.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: hal
Date: July 28, 2021 06:56PM
Quote
vision63
Quote
hal
So let me get this straight. You don't appreciate seeing this kind of evidence publicized because it won't lead to any change and will in fact just get people angrier and lead to more violence?

is that right? Honestly, I'm not sure I'm following your thinking here...

Really. Who are they hipping with that information? NOW we know cops stop minorities. Before this, who knew??

This info helps me and others that just assume that this @#$%& happens elsewhere - not in MY nice little city. You seem to be assuming that this will not be news to anyone - I disagree.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: RgrF
Date: July 28, 2021 11:15PM
It's not hard to understand why folks, when they see cops stop being cops because they don't like the rules or training they are sworn to uphold, then decide it's better to lay off police behavior.

Police have long used their unions and "Blue Flu" tactics to counter any legitimate interest the public has in overseeing police behavior. Keep the public afraid and we'll get to do things our way.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: space-time
Date: July 29, 2021 06:36AM
Quote
DeusxMac
What is a “non-traffic stop”? Stopping pedestrians?


I was curious about that too. Maybe these are cars that were stopped for being on a watch list (lapsed insurance, lapsed registration, etc) but were not stopped for traffic violations.

the traffic stops were those cars that were speeding or didn't stop at the stop/red light.

My uneducated guess.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: pdq
Date: July 29, 2021 08:32AM
Quote
DeusxMac
What is a “non-traffic stop”? Stopping pedestrians?

Dunno, but a broken-tail-light stop have gotten people killed. Well, Black people killed.

Quote

Castile, 32, was a longtime elementary school cafeteria worker who family members described as loving and laid-back…Although he had no serious criminal record, The Associated Press examined records that show he was pulled over around 50 times in recent years in the Minneapolis-St. Paul area, typically for minor offenses such as driving on a suspended license or without proof of insurance, speeding, driving without a muffler or not wearing a seat belt… A faulty brake light gave the 29-year-old officer [Yanez, who shot him seven times] justification to pull Castile over.

Of those, I’d guess only speeding counts as a “traffic stop”.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 29, 2021 11:11AM
Quote
hal
Quote
vision63
Quote
hal
So let me get this straight. You don't appreciate seeing this kind of evidence publicized because it won't lead to any change and will in fact just get people angrier and lead to more violence?

is that right? Honestly, I'm not sure I'm following your thinking here...

Really. Who are they hipping with that information? NOW we know cops stop minorities. Before this, who knew??

This info helps me and others that just assume that this @#$%& happens elsewhere - not in MY nice little city. You seem to be assuming that this will not be news to anyone - I disagree.

Police corruption has been the number one issue in America for years now. It's not like people don't know. Whether it happens in your community or not, it happens and everybody knows it does.

It's just one of a thousand data points that people use to fuel the narrative that the police are corrupt and need to be more tightly controlled. Not only controlled, but to change the very nature of policing. That they're so untrustworthy, that we must demand that they actually not even function as police.

You may say, "what's so wrong with that? Something has to change."

We are responding. Cities like Los Angeles, Berkeley, Oakland, San Francisco, San Jose and probably Sacramento have given criminals the impression that they can do whatever they want, commit any crime and get away with it. They know that the police have been ordered to step back their scrutiny and they flout it.

The varying forces in those cities battle it out over what to do. You have the side that hate the police in general and you have the side that love the police in general. Then you have the middle. So who sways them? The side with the best "narratives" for the moment.

Look at what we have. Rampant, out of control crime that Republican are using to defeat Democrats. We know what side succeeded.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: July 29, 2021 02:59PM
I was curious about that too. Maybe these are cars that were stopped for being on a watch list (lapsed insurance, lapsed registration, etc) but were not stopped for traffic violations.

the traffic stops were those cars that were speeding or didn't stop at the stop/red light.




A traffic stop is the act of police stopping vehicles for a violation of traffic laws of a given state.

.

A traffic stop may be lawful or unlawful.

In most if not all states, a broken tail light and expired registration are just two of many lawful reasons to effect a traffic stop.

Speeding, failure to obey posted signs or signals, failure to signal for a turn or lane change, or an other number of traffic infractions are lawful reasons to effect a traffic stop.

Criminal actions such as exhibition of speed, negligent operation, are also lawful reasons to affect a traffic stop.

I'm not sure what this 'watch list' is that you're referring to.

Insurance violations wouldn't be on it as that's only determined after a traffic stop.

The only 'watch list' I'm familiar with is what was commonly called a 'hot sheet' is some departments, which lists descriptions of stolen vehicles.

That's really old school.

In line up, usually the duty Sgt. would put out any activity that need promulgation – robberies, burglaries, Amber alerts, etc, and you take notes.

Expired insurance was never one of those.


To that end, illegal car stops are wrong.

Legal car stops based on race is wrong.

Not making legal car stops on any race because of politics is wrong.


Stats with out context are just numbers.

Jumping to conclusions based on numbers is wrong.

Objective investigation of fact-based allegations, not numbers, is right.





Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody matters or nobody matters.

When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men except
by believing all possible evil of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: July 29, 2021 03:03PM
You have the side that hate the police in general and you have the side that love the police in general. Then you have the middle. So who sways them? The side with the best "narratives" for the moment.

QED





Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody matters or nobody matters.

When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men except
by believing all possible evil of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: July 29, 2021 06:35PM
Quote
RAMd®d
I was curious about that too. Maybe these are cars that were stopped for being on a watch list (lapsed insurance, lapsed registration, etc) but were not stopped for traffic violations.

the traffic stops were those cars that were speeding or didn't stop at the stop/red light.




A traffic stop is the act of police stopping vehicles for a violation of traffic laws of a given state.

.

A traffic stop may be lawful or unlawful.

In most if not all states, a broken tail light and expired registration are just two of many lawful reasons to effect a traffic stop.

Speeding, failure to obey posted signs or signals, failure to signal for a turn or lane change, or an other number of traffic infractions are lawful reasons to effect a traffic stop.

Criminal actions such as exhibition of speed, negligent operation, are also lawful reasons to affect a traffic stop.

I'm not sure what this 'watch list' is that you're referring to.

Insurance violations wouldn't be on it as that's only determined after a traffic stop.

The only 'watch list' I'm familiar with is what was commonly called a 'hot sheet' is some departments, which lists descriptions of stolen vehicles.

That's really old school.

In line up, usually the duty Sgt. would put out any activity that need promulgation – robberies, burglaries, Amber alerts, etc, and you take notes.

Expired insurance was never one of those.


To that end, illegal car stops are wrong.

Legal car stops based on race is wrong.

Not making legal car stops on any race because of politics is wrong.


Stats with out context are just numbers.

Jumping to conclusions based on numbers is wrong.

Objective investigation of fact-based allegations, not numbers, is right.

Yes, but the question was; what is a “non-traffic stop”?
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: Sacramento police release report showing racial inequities in pull-overs, use of force
Posted by: RAMd®d
Date: July 30, 2021 10:29AM
Yes, but the question was; what is a “non-traffic stop”?



The question should be 'what are they calling a non-traffic stop'?

It could be a ped-stop or a car stop not based on a traffic infraction, dunno.

Either of those could be based on an individual ped or a driver or passenger in a vehicle being known to police such as having a warrant out for their arrest or being a parolee or on probation.

Being with a parolee or someone on probation can be problematic based on suspicionless search conditions of their parole/probation, so know who you roll with.

Another possibility might be reasonable suspicion of criminal activity — cars stopping to talk to individuals in areas known for drug dealing or prostitution or circumstances suggesting possible drug dealing or solicitation.

Vehicles repeatedly passing by businesses know to be targets or potential targets of burglary, or vehicles possibly matching a description of those being used in the commission of a crime could also be cause for reasonable suspicion and a car stop.

Maybe you're just trying to enjoy a hot dog and you see a car idling in front of a bank with an obviously agitated driver discarding numerous cigarette butts onto the street.

Now you're in a quandary.

Is it a car stop if you're not in a car, and/or if the car is already stopped?

Is it a car stop because it's a littering violation, or is it a non-stop because it's in front of a bank, or is it two- two- two stops in one?

If you're a CHP, then it's a car stop, because the CHP always gets their ticket.

There was a great CHP reference in the last episode of the last season of Bosch.

Made me laugh.

Those are my could be/maybes.





Your boos mean nothing to me, I've seen what you cheer for.

Insisting on your rights without acknowledging your responsibilities isn’t freedom, it’s adolescence.

We are a government of laws, not men.

Everybody matters or nobody matters.

When a good man is hurt,
all who would be called good
must suffer with him.

You and I have memories longer than the road that stretches out ahead.

There is no safety for honest men except
by believing all possible evil of evil men.

We don’t do focus groups. They just ensure that you don’t offend anyone, and produce bland inoffensive products. —Sir Jonathan Ive

An armed society is a polite society.
And hope is a lousy defense.

You make me pull, I'll put you down.

I *love* SIGs. It's Glocks I hate.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login

Online Users

Guests: 96
Record Number of Users: 186 on February 20, 2020
Record Number of Guests: 5122 on October 03, 2020