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Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: Ted King
Date: October 10, 2021 09:31AM
Manchin on Oct. 6
explaining why he is against huge chunks of the Democratic reconciliation package as it was originally proposed:

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"I've been very clear when it comes to who we are as a society, who we are as a nation," Manchin added. "I don't believe that we should turn our society into an entitlement society.

Manchin two days later:

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West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchin (D) says the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) is providing $53.5 million for the state’s broadband.

In an announcement on Thursday, Manchin said the Citynet will be given $53,513,114 from the FCC’s Rural Digital Opportunity Fund (RDOF) over the next 10 years with a goal of expanding broadband access to residents across the state.

“Affordable, reliable broadband access is vital to the success and growth of our communities across West Virginia, and the COVID-19 pandemic has shown us the importance of broadband for our everyday lives,” Manchin said.

I should say that Manchin isn't being completely hypocritical here because he thinks of "entitlement" in terms of government payments to individuals or something similar but I think that's a distinction without much of a difference.



e pluribus unum



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2021 11:28AM by Ted King.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society" except when it comes to West Virginia evidently
Posted by: deckeda
Date: October 10, 2021 10:14AM
This isn’t a hill I’d want to die on. Plenty of rural areas need better Internet, and it’s reasonable for officials to fight for theirs. He likely doesn’t consider it entitlement for the same reasons most of us don’t.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society" except when it comes to West Virginia evidently
Posted by: Ted King
Date: October 10, 2021 10:33AM
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deckeda
This isn’t a hill I’d want to die on. Plenty of rural areas need better Internet, and it’s reasonable for officials to fight for theirs. He likely doesn’t consider it entitlement for the same reasons most of us don’t.

What makes this fundamentally different from what you consider an entitlement? Yes, plenty of rural areas need better internet, but if you are of the rugged individualist set then wouldn't you say they just need pay for it themselves?

Pointing out an inconsistency doesn't amount to saying it's a hill to die on.



e pluribus unum
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society" except when it comes to West Virginia evidently
Posted by: deckeda
Date: October 10, 2021 10:57AM
Then I guess I wasn't aware Manchin would have been opposed to faster Internet for those reasons.

I understand the historical conservative argument against infrastructure investment. What I'm less clear on is why any Congressman would not advocate for their constituents to have nicer things, regardless of what they might be.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society" except when it comes to West Virginia evidently
Posted by: Ted King
Date: October 10, 2021 11:25AM
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deckeda
Then I guess I wasn't aware Manchin would have been opposed to faster Internet for those reasons.

I understand the historical conservative argument against infrastructure investment. What I'm less clear on is why any Congressman would not advocate for their constituents to have nicer things, regardless of what they might be.

I'm not saying that Manchin should be against faster internet for WV; I'm saying because he is for faster internet paid for by the government he shouldn't be waving away other potential benefits for other people on the grounds of calling those benefits "entitlements". It's government giving things to people whether you want to call it entitlements or not. Fundamentally it's just government giving things to people.

Edit: I changed the subject line of the OP because it was misleading about the point I mean to make about the use of the term "entitlement".



e pluribus unum



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2021 11:45AM by Ted King.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: davester
Date: October 10, 2021 12:03PM
This misuse of the word "entitlement" is typical of the republicans who think that it's perfectly fair to shower tax breaks on the "producers" (i.e. their billionaire donors who have been eating at the public trough for generations) and take things like medicare and social security away form the "takers" (i.e. those who have not inherited a system that makes them rich). Manchin himself seems to think that he is entitled to the massive profits he personally gets from heavily subsidized industries.



"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: bfd
Date: October 10, 2021 02:28PM


All you need to know about "entitlements" and "Senator Manchin" (his entitlement is in the background…)
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: Dennis S
Date: October 10, 2021 02:32PM
A freaking U.S. Senator doesn’t know the meaning of “entitlement.”
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: Ted King
Date: October 10, 2021 03:43PM
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Dennis S
A freaking U.S. Senator doesn’t know the meaning of “entitlement.”

To be honest, I'm not sure what kinds of government programs are designated entitlements and those that are not. I don't think subsidies, like fossil fuel company subsidies, are considered entitlements but I don't see the substantive difference between a subsidy to a company and payments for child support to a family in terms of what it means for some segment of society seemingly being dependent on government. Is such dependence a good thing or not? Manchin acts like dependence on government is a de facto bad thing when it comes to entitlement programs but why doesn't he feel the same way about coal subsidies?



e pluribus unum



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2021 03:49PM by Ted King.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: Filliam H. Muffman
Date: October 10, 2021 03:45PM
Does he want to end Social Security and Medicare? It would solve the distribution problems if we forced all those senior citizens to work driving trucks at minimum wage.

Repugs all know it is popular with their constituents and seem to be fighting it because of that... not that their constituents will remember it during the 2022 elections.



In tha 360. MRF User Map
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: $tevie
Date: October 10, 2021 05:29PM
Assclowns like Manchin think that giving money to corporations builds the economy by creating jobs to make good and services. Whereas giving money to the consumers, uh, lets them buy those goods and services and keep the corporations in business. Wait, what?



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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: vision63
Date: October 10, 2021 07:37PM
He's just who he is. He's "entitled" to how he feels.

The Democratic Party isn't like the Republican Party. It's a big tent that has to accomodate different values from radical left to moderate. Knowing this and also knowing that it's nothing new, we can't have the Senate finishes in a tie.

I don't thing anybody here really knows who Joe Manchin is. You have to "follow" every politician on your side of the aisle. They communicate multiple times every day.

He's not against Medicare. He's against expanding it until he feels like the program is solvent enough to withstand it. That's how he feels and that's something to debate.

I'm "for" the entirety of Joe Biden's proposals. But moderates simply are not. They're "for" it, but not all of it. They're not going to think that Pre-K is "infrastructure." They think fixing a bridge is.

People can protest and whine and complain, but the bills that are going to pass will be reduced. If people "still" don't want them to pass because their favorite element is gone or shrunk down, then they don't need to be "legislating." The window is closing.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2021 07:38PM by vision63.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: Ted King
Date: October 10, 2021 07:59PM
.



e pluribus unum



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2021 08:15PM by Ted King.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: mattkime
Date: October 10, 2021 09:06PM
Quote
Ted King
.

another mystery that only 'edit post' will know.



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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: pdq
Date: October 11, 2021 09:33AM
“Entitlements” have come to stand for money or goodies that other, undeserving people get. The money and goodies that I get? Well, keep your grubby government hands off my Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security (retirement AND disability)!

It’s beyond irritating that Manchin plays this game, when West Virginia is near the top of the top of those on the public tea t (number 2 out of 50 in terms of state residents’ dependency on Federal aid).



Look at all those hard-working self-sustaining deep-red states! No entitlement societies there - no sirree!

US News and World Report:

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The low-income states that receive a lot of federal spending per person are primarily in the Southeast and include Kentucky, West Virginia, Mississippi and Alabama.

With lower-than-average income levels, residents in these states contribute less through income taxes. They also receive higher-than-average levels of spending from programs such as Social Security, Medicare, social assistance grants and contracts.

Nope, no “entitlements” for us please. Just keep our well-deserved payments coming.

PS - a little old (2012), but not much changed from the way things are now:

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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: October 11, 2021 09:57AM

For decades, Manchin has profited from a series of coal companies that he founded during the 1980s.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: vision63
Date: October 11, 2021 12:46PM
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Steve G.

For decades, Manchin has profited from a series of coal companies that he founded during the 1980s.

Politico pointing this out is meaningless. They're not gonna leverage him.

Joe Manchin is just being selfish. Worried more about his prospects than the country's prospects. In 2024, he most likely won't be a Senator anymore, a Republican flip, so really, what has he got to lose by just supporting the full set of bills? Jon Tester is under the same, exact pressures as Manchin yet he's just going for it.
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Re: Manchin is against an "entitlement society"
Posted by: sekker
Date: October 11, 2021 03:53PM
I find the outlier that is democratic interesting - New Mexico.

This article suggests is because of all the military bases.

[www.lcsun-news.com]
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