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No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 09, 2022 06:51PM
These folks are really ill.

[www.washingtonpost.com]

... the chance of him being able to do it is slim, but still -- you would think that he'd be aware of how this appears (gloating?), how this will play out at the national level, and especially the consequences vis-a-vis the midterms -- and let the sleeping dogs lie for the moment.




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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: mattkime
Date: May 09, 2022 07:27PM
Quote
PeterB
... the chance of him being able to do it is slim,

Why? All they need is the presidency and a simple majority in the house and senate.
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 09, 2022 07:38PM
Quote
mattkime
Quote
PeterB
... the chance of him being able to do it is slim,

Why? All they need is the presidency and a simple majority in the house and senate.

Not happening, not after the shiznit-show that we are now seeing. 60-70% of the American public does not think that Roe should be repealed, let alone banning abortion outright. He's overplaying his hand.

Here's some more analysis. Never say never, but it would be hard: [www.cnn.com]




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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: Blankity Blank
Date: May 09, 2022 08:06PM
Quote
PeterB
Quote
mattkime
Quote
PeterB
... the chance of him being able to do it is slim,

Why? All they need is the presidency and a simple majority in the house and senate.

Not happening, not after the shiznit-show that we are now seeing. 60-70% of the American public does not think that Roe should be repealed, let alone banning abortion outright. He's overplaying his hand.

Here's some more analysis. Never say never, but it would be hard: [www.cnn.com]

I would think a year or two before Trump, many people would have said the same about SCOTUS overturning Roe v. Wade.



National Suicide Prevention Hotline tel:1-800-273-8255

I must not fear. Fear is the mind-killer. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me. And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain.
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: RgrF
Date: May 09, 2022 08:13PM
They also depend on their ability to make illegal abortion the norm just like they took the norm of 40/50 years ago (national legal abortion), turned it into a political weapon and reversed it.
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: mattkime
Date: May 09, 2022 08:26PM
Quote
PeterB
Not happening, not after the shiznit-show that we are now seeing. 60-70% of the American public does not think that Roe should be repealed, let alone banning abortion outright. He's overplaying his hand.

Since when did the republican party run on popular policy?



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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 09, 2022 09:37PM
Quote
Blankity Blank
Quote
PeterB
Quote
mattkime
Quote
PeterB
... the chance of him being able to do it is slim,

Why? All they need is the presidency and a simple majority in the house and senate.

Not happening, not after the shiznit-show that we are now seeing. 60-70% of the American public does not think that Roe should be repealed, let alone banning abortion outright. He's overplaying his hand.

Here's some more analysis. Never say never, but it would be hard: [www.cnn.com]

I would think a year or two before Trump, many people would have said the same about SCOTUS overturning Roe v. Wade.

True, but there's no telling what will happen once Roe is overturned ... there may be riots, etc.

Quote
RgrF
They also depend on their ability to make illegal abortion the norm just like they took the norm of 40/50 years ago (national legal abortion), turned it into a political weapon and reversed it.

Also true. But what's good for the goose is good for the gander. They may find that weaponizing goes both ways... when Roe gets overturned, there may be a lot of anger at the ballot box and elsewhere, and we might end up with an entirely different political landscape, one in which Roe is actually able to be codified.




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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: $tevie
Date: May 09, 2022 10:00PM
Some of them are beginning to hint that banning contraceptives is next.

These people are seriously mentally ill.



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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: RgrF
Date: May 09, 2022 10:28PM
Quote
PeterB
Quote
RgrF
They also depend on their ability to make illegal abortion the norm just like they took the norm of 40/50 years ago (national legal abortion), turned it into a political weapon and reversed it.

Also true. But what's good for the goose is good for the gander. They may find that weaponizing goes both ways... when Roe gets overturned, there may be a lot of anger at the ballot box and elsewhere, and we might end up with an entirely different political landscape, one in which Roe is actually able to be codified.

That's some alternative universe you inhabit Peter, zealots backed by huge infusions of right wing purpose driven money inhabit the other. Where do you see that coming from to oppose them?
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: Ombligo
Date: May 10, 2022 06:39AM
Quote
$tevie
Some of them are beginning to hint that banning contraceptives is next.

These people are seriously mentally ill.

That has been the long game for the truly ultra-conservative. IUD's and the morning after pill will be the first target since they work after conception.



“No persons are more frequently wrong, than those who will not admit they are wrong.” -- François de La Rochefoucauld

"Those who cannot accept the past are condemned to revise it." -- Geo. Mathias
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: May 10, 2022 08:48AM
There is so much bad info out there about Plan B, aka morning after pill or emergency contraception. This is partly the fault of the FDA, who mislabeled this product when it was first released in 2009. The anti choice crowd seized on that and haven't let go. It is often conflated with medication used to induce abortion, something very different.

Mayo clinic:

"Why it's done

Morning-after pills can help prevent pregnancy if you've had unprotected sex — either because you didn't use birth control, you missed a birth control pill, you were sexually assaulted or your method of birth control failed.

Morning-after pills do not end a pregnancy that has implanted. They work primarily by delaying or preventing ovulation.

Keep in mind that the morning-after pill isn't the same as mifepristone (Mifeprex), also known as RU-486 or the abortion pill. This drug terminates an established pregnancy — one in which the fertilized egg has attached to the uterine wall and has begun to develop."

NY Times 2012:

"Studies have not established that emergency contraceptive pills prevent fertilized eggs from implanting in the womb, leading scientists say. Rather, the pills delay ovulation, the release of eggs from ovaries that occurs before eggs are fertilized, and some pills also thicken cervical mucus so sperm have trouble swimming.

It turns out that the politically charged debate over morning-after pills and abortion, a divisive issue in this election year, is probably rooted in outdated or incorrect scientific guesses about how the pills work. Because they block creation of fertilized eggs, they would not meet abortion opponents’ definition of abortion-inducing drugs. In contrast, RU-486, a medication prescribed for terminating pregnancies, destroys implanted embryos."

[www.nytimes.com]




 
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: Ted King
Date: May 10, 2022 12:52PM
Quote
PeterB

Not happening, not after the shiznit-show that we are now seeing. 60-70% of the American public does not think that Roe should be repealed, let alone banning abortion outright. He's overplaying his hand.

Here's some more analysis. Never say never, but it would be hard: [www.cnn.com]

From that article:

Quote

"If the leaked opinion became the final opinion, legislative bodies -- not only at the state level but at the federal level -- certainly could legislate in that area," McConnell said.
"And if this were the final decision, that was the point that it should be resolved one way or another in the legislative process. So yeah, it's possible."

Sounds bad, but then later McConnell says:

Quote

Elsewhere in the interview, McConnell definitively ruled out the idea that Republicans would end the filibuster -- the custom of allowing a Senate minority to block most legislation -- in order to ban abortion. He repeated that vow that he would "never support smashing the legislative filibuster on this issue or any other," in remarks from the Senate floor on Monday.

So, functionally it is very highly unlikely it is going to happen. By keeping the legislative filibuster in place McConnell can let such a law come up for a vote if the pressure from the right gets to be really high to pass such a law, knowing that his members can vote for such a law to placate the anti-abortion activists without having to take the full brunt of actually having such a law pass - because of keeping the filibuster in place.



e pluribus unum
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 10, 2022 01:12PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
There is so much bad info out there about Plan B, aka morning after pill or emergency contraception. This is partly the fault of the FDA, who mislabeled this product when it was first released in 2009. The anti choice crowd seized on that and haven't let go. It is often conflated with medication used to induce abortion, something very different.

Mayo clinic:

"Why it's done

Morning-after pills can help prevent pregnancy if you've had unprotected sex — either because you didn't use birth control, you missed a birth control pill, you were sexually assaulted or your method of birth control failed.

Morning-after pills do not end a pregnancy that has implanted. They work primarily by delaying or preventing ovulation.

Keep in mind that the morning-after pill isn't the same as mifepristone (Mifeprex), also known as RU-486 or the abortion pill. This drug terminates an established pregnancy — one in which the fertilized egg has attached to the uterine wall and has begun to develop."

NY Times 2012:

"Studies have not established that emergency contraceptive pills prevent fertilized eggs from implanting in the womb, leading scientists say. Rather, the pills delay ovulation, the release of eggs from ovaries that occurs before eggs are fertilized, and some pills also thicken cervical mucus so sperm have trouble swimming.

It turns out that the politically charged debate over morning-after pills and abortion, a divisive issue in this election year, is probably rooted in outdated or incorrect scientific guesses about how the pills work. Because they block creation of fertilized eggs, they would not meet abortion opponents’ definition of abortion-inducing drugs. In contrast, RU-486, a medication prescribed for terminating pregnancies, destroys implanted embryos."

[www.nytimes.com]




 

The problem isn't just with emergency contraception. IUD's are thought to work not just by killing sperm, but potentially inhibiting implantation of a fertilized egg. [americanpregnancy.org]




Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)
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Re: No, it's not enough to overturn Roe... we want to nationally ban abortion
Posted by: PeterB
Date: May 10, 2022 01:13PM
Quote
RgrF
Quote
PeterB
Quote
RgrF
They also depend on their ability to make illegal abortion the norm just like they took the norm of 40/50 years ago (national legal abortion), turned it into a political weapon and reversed it.

Also true. But what's good for the goose is good for the gander. They may find that weaponizing goes both ways... when Roe gets overturned, there may be a lot of anger at the ballot box and elsewhere, and we might end up with an entirely different political landscape, one in which Roe is actually able to be codified.

That's some alternative universe you inhabit Peter, zealots backed by huge infusions of right wing purpose driven money inhabit the other. Where do you see that coming from to oppose them?

As I said, never say never... [www.axios.com]




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