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5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 21, 2022 05:50AM
Again, black on black violence with illegal hand guns. Wrong agenda, no news coverage

June 19, 2022 District of Columbia Washington 14th St and U St NW
2334936 June 19, 2022 Michigan Detroit 18501 Healy St
2334620 June 19, 2022 South Carolina Walterboro 1109 Rivers St
2334512 June 19, 2022 Florida Miami US-1 and SW 22nd Ave
2334374 June 19, 2022 Michigan Grand Rapids Griggs St SE and Division St
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Tiangou
Date: June 21, 2022 06:13AM
The Juneteenth celebration shooting in DC was all over the news.

There's no evidence that it was "black on black" violence.

There's nothing disclosed to the public to indicate that illegal handguns were used. It was reported that a gun was confiscated from someone before the shooting and some of the cops there that day were on the scene quickly when the shooting began because they were there to deal with that gun. It has not been reported that they have the weapon used in the attack.

They don't know who the shooter was. There is a reward for information leading to the arrest of the shooter.

It was one of several shootings in DC this weekend. Visitors frequently bring in guns. Gun violence is a big problem in the region. The DC government is very pro-gun-control, but Congress and the right-wing of the SCOTUS have conspired to prevent them from regulating firearms to any significant extent. This is a strong motivator for DC statehood and a powerful argument for term-limits on Supreme Court justices.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2022 06:23AM by Tiangou.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 21, 2022 06:30AM
Police know it's gang on gang violence. dozens of people and no one saw nothing
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 21, 2022 06:31AM
Also 4 events in Chicago where only 3 people got shot, just missed the mass shooting threshold of 4
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Tiangou
Date: June 21, 2022 06:35AM
Quote
Mr645
Police know it's gang on gang violence. dozens of people and no one saw nothing

Wow.

That's a series of wrongful assumptions.



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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: pdq
Date: June 21, 2022 07:43AM
…and because it’s black on black violence, it doesn’t count? I don’t get your argument.

The fact it doesn’t make a big splash on the news is not unusual. There have been ~250 so far this year; more than one a day. If they all made the front page, there would be no room for other news.

That’s the sorry state we’re in. We have waaaay too many guns, that are waaaay too easy to obtain through legal or illegal means.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: June 21, 2022 08:18AM
Mass media coverage is typically designed to produce attention, reaction, and above all, the ability to sell advertising.

Like this image from Cleveland. The streets are on fire ! No, not the river.. the streets !
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: June 21, 2022 08:31AM
Perhaps this anti-Black antagonist has a solution to his perceived problem? It's like Fox, long on cherry-picked accusations but non-existent in solution to their gripes.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: zachdog
Date: June 21, 2022 09:51AM
Bullets don't see race.

The proliferation of guns on our streets certainly impacts some communities more than others, but the greater impact upon society results in domestic terrorism, regardless of the race of the criminal pulling the trigger.

I taught in an all-black school. Some of these students experienced gun violence at a percentage higher than the predominantly white schools in the neighboring school district. This is terribly unfortunate, but that particular neighborhood had more crime than neighboring ZIP codes. However, they will never recover from being frightened by loud noises and people openly carrying weapons. Writing them off because they were already inundated by crime would be a stain upon democracy, where "all [people] are created equal" and deserve "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

If the OP has a solution to this horrible gun epidemic, I'm all ears.

My solution? Ban assault weapons (this is something Reagan backed), force background checks for all purchases (sure, even for family members, as we all have a crazy Uncle Ted who shouldn't be carrying), and the right for gun violence victims to sue manufacturers and gun stores.

Blaming people of color isn't a solution (btw, the word "gangs" is a dog whistle).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2022 09:54AM by zachdog.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Speedy
Date: June 21, 2022 10:34AM
Quote
Steve G.
Perhaps this anti-Black antagonist has a solution to his perceived problem? It's like Fox, long on cherry-picked accusations but non-existent in solution to their gripes.

Someone has an agenda. Is that agenda more about guns or race? Difficult to say.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: NewtonMP2100
Date: June 21, 2022 10:51AM
.....there was one in Harlem.....college basketball player was killed [ they think it might be gang related ].....



_____________________________________

I reject your reality and substitute my own!
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: hal
Date: June 21, 2022 10:59AM
there is news coverage of all of those shootings - maybe not on foxnews
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: deckeda
Date: June 21, 2022 11:35AM
Quote
pdq
…and because it’s black on black violence, it doesn’t count? I don’t get your argument. …

It’s very simple: “Don’t talk about when Whites kill. Talk about when Blacks kill.”

It’s couched in terms that imply progressives look the other way when minorities commit crimes. Minorities are “always” the problem.

And his racism is plain.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Rolando
Date: June 21, 2022 11:37AM
Quote
pdq
…and because it’s black on black violence, it doesn’t count? I don’t get your argument.

See my comment on the drive by in San Antonio



San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

"I don’t want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it." - Billy Graham 1981

"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 21, 2022 04:10PM
Quote
zachdog
Bullets don't see race.

The proliferation of guns on our streets certainly impacts some communities more than others, but the greater impact upon society results in domestic terrorism, regardless of the race of the criminal pulling the trigger.

I taught in an all-black school. Some of these students experienced gun violence at a percentage higher than the predominantly white schools in the neighboring school district. This is terribly unfortunate, but that particular neighborhood had more crime than neighboring ZIP codes. However, they will never recover from being frightened by loud noises and people openly carrying weapons. Writing them off because they were already inundated by crime would be a stain upon democracy, where "all [people] are created equal" and deserve "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

If the OP has a solution to this horrible gun epidemic, I'm all ears.

My solution? Ban assault weapons (this is something Reagan backed), force background checks for all purchases (sure, even for family members, as we all have a crazy Uncle Ted who shouldn't be carrying), and the right for gun violence victims to sue manufacturers and gun stores.

Blaming people of color isn't a solution (btw, the word "gangs" is a dog whistle).

1)Assault weapons are already tightly controlled, and never used in violence. If you mean medium powered semi automatic rifles with metal or plastic stocks instead fo wood, I don't see how the cosmetic attributes of a gun affect how deadly it is.
2) Background checks are good, we need to keep weapons from the hands of criminals and those wishing to do harm. Making good people helpless does not make bad people harmless
3) I never said anything about race or skin color, but the mass shootings I referred to were involving minorities and several, the ones where I could find data on, were thought to be either gang related or retalitory gun violence. Minorities, I mean non Caucasian, white folks.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 21, 2022 04:31PM
Quote
zachdog
Bullets don't see race.

If the OP has a solution to this horrible gun epidemic, I'm all ears.

.

I certainly can't say my ideas are a perfect solution, but I think several ideas would help.

1) better background checks, While a smaller percentage, some mass shootings are committed by people who legally purchased guns. Ex. Las Vegas.

2) Background checks when transferred a gun from one person to another. I think a way to get support for this would be a federal fund to pay a dealer $15 per transfer so it costs the gun owner nothing.

3) Raise the age for possession of a semi automatic rifle or shotgun to 21.

4) significantly greater punishment for using a gun to commit a crime or for a criminal in possession of a gun. Chicago for example, far too many shootings are committed by known felons already on bond for violent gun crime. use a gun criminally? No bond.

5) Stop electing liberal, no nothing anti gun government officials who use the AR-15 as their focus and draw attention from real solutions. The AR-15 is nothing special. It's a medium powered semi auto rifle. Looks mean, but functions no different than any other semi auto rifle. It's like putting stickers on your Chevy Malibu and calling it a NASCAR. It may resemble the race car but it is not. The AR-15 may resemble the M-16 or M4 military weapon, but it is not. A majority of hunting rifles are far more powerful and deadly. God forbid the next school shooter uses a 12 gauge rifle.

6) Deal with mental health, deal with the reason people decide to murder oder innocent people. As long as killers want to kill, they will find a way. It's not realistic to expect 300 million guns to disappear anytime soon. And hand guns are used in over 80% of mass shootings. We need to address what causes people to want to kill others, or themselves.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 21, 2022 05:03PM
Quote
Mr645
1)Assault weapons are already tightly controlled, and never used in violence. If you mean medium powered semi automatic rifles with metal or plastic stocks instead fo wood, I don't see how the cosmetic attributes of a gun affect how deadly it is.

Rare, but claiming "never" demonstrates a, perhaps conscious, avoidance of facts...

"The Madison County shooter who critically wounded one deputy and injured another in a shootout with law enforcement Thursday was equipped with two fully automatic rifles..."

"The gun that was used in Houston's East Side shootout with police appears to have been illegally modified to operate as an automatic weapon."

"Phillips and Matasareanu... firing weapons illegally modified to enable fully-automatic fire."

"...the modification is a simple process of changing out a portion of the trigger mechanism that controls the rate of fire. Add a high-capacity magazine, and a handgun or 'sporting-rifle', like the AR-15, can be a deadly threat to officers and anyone near the gunfire"


Quote
Mr645
2) ...Making good people helpless does not make bad people harmless.

False dilemma – two alternative statements are given as the only possible options when, in reality, there are more.


Quote
Mr645
3) I never said anything about race or skin color, but the mass shootings I referred to were involving minorities and several, the ones where I could find data on, were thought to be either gang related or retalitory gun violence. Minorities, I mean non Caucasian, white folks.


facepalm "Never"?!? XXX Go back and read your own OP!...

Quote
Mr645
Again, black on black violence with illegal hand guns.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/21/2022 05:04PM by DeusxMac.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: zachdog
Date: June 21, 2022 06:05PM
DeusxMac, thank you for your thoughtful reply. I agree and appreciate how you unpacked these claims.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Speedy
Date: June 21, 2022 06:29PM
Quote
zachdog
DeusxMac, thank you for your thoughtful reply. I agree and appreciate how you unpacked these claims.

Agreed. You are giving pdq a run for his money on taking apart these types of ridiculous dissembling claims.



Saint Cloud, Minnesota, where the weather is wonderful even when it isn't.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 21, 2022 06:32PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Mr645
1)Assault weapons are already tightly controlled, and never used in violence. If you mean medium powered semi automatic rifles with metal or plastic stocks instead fo wood, I don't see how the cosmetic attributes of a gun affect how deadly it is.

Rare, but claiming "never" demonstrates a, perhaps conscious, avoidance of facts...

"The Madison County shooter who critically wounded one deputy and injured another in a shootout with law enforcement Thursday was equipped with two fully automatic rifles..."

"The gun that was used in Houston's East Side shootout with police appears to have been illegally modified to operate as an automatic weapon."

"Phillips and Matasareanu... firing weapons illegally modified to enable fully-automatic fire."

"...the modification is a simple process of changing out a portion of the trigger mechanism that controls the rate of fire. Add a high-capacity magazine, and a handgun or 'sporting-rifle', like the AR-15, can be a deadly threat to officers and anyone near the gunfire"


Quote
Mr645
2) ...Making good people helpless does not make bad people harmless.

False dilemma – two alternative statements are given as the only possible options when, in reality, there are more.


Quote
Mr645
3) I never said anything about race or skin color, but the mass shootings I referred to were involving minorities and several, the ones where I could find data on, were thought to be either gang related or retalitory gun violence. Minorities, I mean non Caucasian, white folks.


facepalm "Never"?!? XXX Go back and read your own OP!...

Quote
Mr645
Again, black on black violence with illegal hand guns.


"Fully automatic weapons used to shoot Madison County deputies called 'extremely rare'" Good job carefully editing the headline. The percentage of automatic assault weapons used in crimes is 0%.

Modifying semi automatic weapons to fire faster the ndesigned is now illegal thanks to President Trump. The only modern president to be successful in passing anti gun laws. If gun laws mattered, you should have voted for Trump in 2020.

What law do we need to stop people from using guns illegally or illegally modifying guns?
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: pdq
Date: June 21, 2022 08:47PM
How about reducing the number of guns, like other countries have successfully done?

That would be effective.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 03:19AM
Jamaican's draconian gun laws haven't made a significant difference. In fact, the murder rate is skyrocketing.

[news.yahoo.com] wasn't even a gun. people use what they have. this qualifies as a mass knifing murder. 5 dead.

[jamaica-gleaner.com] 4 killed, a mass shooting. other shootings mentioned in the article, same day.

These 2 articles, and all these murders are just since the weekend.

[en.wikipedia.org] Jamaican gun laws

"Dean Weingarten (Army Research, Development, Testing, and Evaluation) argued that gun violence kept rising since the government passed draconian laws on gun control.[2] John R. Lott Jr. (Crime Prevention Research Center) made the same observation.[16][17]"

[www.washingtonpost.com]

[www.foxnews.com]

what likely is the big difference, is the people. The culture and the community set the expectations of decent behavior, and the people follow. [time.com]
The Philippines have ready access to illegal firearms, but they behave quite differently.

"For now, though, powerful social factors continue to have a restraining effect on indiscriminate violence. Philippine academic Raymund Narag, a criminology associate professor at Southern Illinois University and a former prisoner himself, says mass shootings in his native country are in part deterred by hiyâ, a Tagalog word meaning shame or embarrassment. Avoidance of hiyâ, and sparing one’s family and community from it, is often described as a core Philippine value.

“It reflects on you, and reflects on your family,” Narag says. “When I was jailed, our entire clan felt humiliated.”"

"Narag says the strong ties of Philippine kinship mean troubled individuals are more likely to be identified before they become mass shooters. He contrasts that with the situation in the U.S., where he presently lives and teaches.

“Here, if you have problems, you have to go to a health professional,” he tells TIME. “You’ll divulge everything there. You don’t talk to your neighbors—sometimes you don’t talk to your own parents—because [there isn’t] an engaged culture where one’s problem is everyone’s problem.”

Jose Antonio Clemente, a professor of social psychology at the University of the Philippines, says community is everything. “At an early age, we are trained to give importance to our families and our relationships,” he says. “Maybe at some point we’re also taught to value our community, since there are a lot of communities that are very close-knit because of the high population density.”"



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2022 04:11AM by Racer X.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 22, 2022 05:33AM
Quote
pdq
How about reducing the number of guns, like other countries have successfully done?

That would be effective.

Find the 5 Infinity stones and ask Mr. Stark to make a glove. Snap, fixed.

The result every time the government talks about banning guns is people buy more guns.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 22, 2022 05:36AM
the government of Michael Manley attempted to restore order by granting broad new law enforcement powers in the Suppression of Crime Act and the Gun Court Act. This allowed the police and the military to work together in a novel way to disarm the people: soldiers could seal off entire neighborhoods and police could systematically search the houses for weapons without a warrant.

Something like this could never, should never take place in the USA.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 22, 2022 08:06AM
Quote
Mr645
the government of Michael Manley attempted to restore order by granting broad new law enforcement powers in the Suppression of Crime Act and the Gun Court Act. This allowed the police and the military to work together in a novel way to disarm the people: soldiers could seal off entire neighborhoods and police could systematically search the houses for weapons without a warrant.

Something like this could never, should never take place in the USA.

Manley left office 30 years ago!

"Michael Norman Manley ON OCC (10 December 1924 – 6 March 1997) was a Jamaican politician who served as the fourth Prime Minister of Jamaica from 1972 to 1980 and from 1989 to 1992. Manley championed a democratic socialist program,[1] and has been described as a populist. According to opinion polls, he remains one of Jamaica's most popular prime ministers."

"While the violent political culture was not invented by Seaga or Manley, and had its roots in conflicts between the parties from as early as the beginning of the two-party system in the 1940s, political violence reached unprecedented levels in the 1970s. Indeed, the two elections accompanied by the greatest violence were those (1976 and 1980) in which Seaga was trying to unseat Manley."
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 22, 2022 08:39AM
Quote
Racer X
Jamaican's draconian gun laws haven't made a significant difference. In fact, the murder rate is skyrocketing.

[news.yahoo.com] wasn't even a gun. people use what they have. this qualifies as a mass knifing murder. 5 dead.

[jamaica-gleaner.com] 4 killed, a mass shooting. other shootings mentioned in the article, same day.

These 2 articles, and all these murders are just since the weekend.

[en.wikipedia.org] Jamaican gun laws

"In September 2015, the [Jamaican] government launched the "Get the guns" campaign (similar to a gun buyback program): 130 illegal weapons and 1,500 rounds of ammo were collected in two months. All through 2015, 584 illegal firearms were collected by the police. A majority originated from the United States. Obama's decision to apply stricter gun laws was seen as a positive decision to reduce the Jamaican black market of firearms."

Quote
Racer X
"Dean Weingarten (Army Research, Development, Testing, and Evaluation) argued that gun violence kept rising since the government passed draconian laws on gun control.[2] John R. Lott Jr. (Crime Prevention Research Center) made the same observation.[16][17]"

[www.washingtonpost.com]

[www.foxnews.com]

Interested readers should familiarize themselves with who Lott (the author in the links) actually is.
[en.wikipedia.org]


Quote
Racer X
what likely is the big difference, is the people. The culture and the community set the expectations of decent behavior, and the people follow. [time.com]
The Philippines have ready access to illegal firearms, but they behave quite differently.

That was some exercise in Cherry Picking. The very first sentence in this linked Time article starts "Mass shootings are a result of a confluence of factors, but at the heart of the problem are guns..."

"...the Philippines is one of the deadliest places in Asia when it comes to firearm homicides."

"“I think it’s just a matter of time, [before a mass shooting]” says Gerry Caño, Dean of the School of Criminology and Criminal Justice at Cagayan de Oro College. “I think our authorities and the public safety practitioners are just waiting for that time to happen, considering that Philippine culture is greatly influenced by the West, particularly the United States.”
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: pdq
Date: June 22, 2022 08:44AM
…and Jamaica remains the 82nd most armed country in the world (from Racer’s Wikipedia link).

Do all those guns make a difference?

Quote

Guns are involved in 80% of [murders in Jamaica].

Yup, you can kill people with other things, but 4 times out of 5, it’s a gun, even in a country with “draconian gun laws”. So where do those guns come from?

Well, you know.

Quote

A majority originate from the United States.

Of course they do.

But it’s those people, not the guns.

RollingEyesSmiley5
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: pdq
Date: June 22, 2022 08:48AM
Quote
DeusxMac
Interested readers should familiarize themselves with who Lott (the author in the links) actually is.
[en.wikipedia.org]

Indeed. Sock puppet Lott.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Tiangou
Date: June 22, 2022 09:55AM
[www.nytimes.com]

Other Countries Had Mass Shootings. Then They Changed Their Gun Laws.

Britain, Australia, Canada, New Zealand, Norway: All had a culture of gun ownership, and all tightened restrictions anyway. Their violence statistics now diverge sharply from those of the U.S....

[T]he record is clear, confirmed by reams of studies that have analyzed the effects of policies like Britain’s and Australia’s: When countries tighten gun control laws, it leads to fewer guns in private citizens’ hands, which leads to less gun violence — and to fewer mass shootings...

American gun control activists often cite Australia’s sweeping buybacks. Though no country rivals the United States’ gun ownership rate, which is more than double that of second-place Yemen, Australia has had similar cultural and political affinities for gun ownership.

Despite this, after a mass shooting in 1996 in which a gunman killed 35 people in the town of Port Arthur, authorities successfully imposed sweeping new restrictions.

The nationwide buyback ultimately took between one in five and one in three privately held guns out of circulation. This mostly targeted guns like semiautomatic rifles and many shotguns that, under new laws, were no longer permitted.

The country also reframed gun ownership from being an inherent right, as it is in only a handful of countries like the United States, to becoming a privilege that citizens had to affirmatively earn.

Australia’s would-be gun owners now face a national registry, a 28-day wait period and a licensing process that requires demonstrating a valid reason for owning a gun.

Since then, mass shootings have effectively disappeared in Australia. What was once an almost annual event has only happened once since the reforms, with a 2018 attack that left seven dead.

But the greater impact may have been on other forms of violence. A 2011 survey of crime and suicide data concluded that the program “seems to have been incredibly successful in terms of lives saved.”

Australia’s gun-related homicide rate subsequently halved, as did the rate of firearm suicides, the study found. Non-firearm homicides and suicides did not increase. Subsequent research confirmed these findings.


(Much more when you follow the link.)



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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 01:58PM
In the Philippines, they manufacturer their own firearms. And actually sell them around the world.

Life in prison for firearm offenses in Jamaica isn't stopping people. Maybe they should try and find out why people are committing the crimes in the first place. Just a thought.



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: RgrF
Date: June 22, 2022 02:28PM
Gun control laws, all enacted after mass murders, became effective in the UK, Australia, Norway and Canada, why does anyone think they won't be here?
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 22, 2022 02:50PM
Quote
Racer X
Maybe they should try and find out why people are committing the crimes in the first place. Just a thought.

You keep trotting out this “question”, but never even offer an explanation as to “how”, let alone an answer to “why”.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 02:53PM
I have given my thoughts here multiple times. You just never read them. That's on you, not me.



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 02:54PM
Quote
RgrF
Gun control laws, all enacted after mass murders, became effective in the UK, Australia, Norway and Canada, why does anyone think they won't be here?

And even stiffer laws in Jamaica didn't work.



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 22, 2022 03:06PM
Quote
Racer X
I have given my thoughts here multiple times. You just never read them. That's on you, not me.

Sorry if I’ve missed them. With you having used the words “gun” or “guns” in 307 Political Rants posts in the last 12 months, could you please point me to those that give your “hows” and “whys”.
TIA
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 03:59PM
2 or 3 weekends ago, I think on a Sunday was the latest.

and all the laws in the world won't matter if they aren't enforced

[changewashington.org]

[www.seattletimes.com]

"Last March, Federal Way police responded to an altercation in an apartment parking lot involving a man pointing a loaded gun.

They arrested the suspect, searched his car, and found multiple handguns and narcotics in the rear seats, where three children had been riding. The man told cops he had been released from federal prison just days prior.

At Blake Kirvin’s first appearance hearing, King County prosecutors asked for $100,000 bail. Besides Kirvin posing a danger to the community, they argued that he was unlikely to return to court if released because of his nine warrants since 2009.

A King County District Court temporary judge released him with only his promise he would come back to court. Kirvin was picked up hours later by U.S. Marshalls on a federal probation violation."

the whole OP-Ed is a real WTF? read.



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2022 04:17PM by Racer X.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 22, 2022 06:28PM
Quote
Racer X
2 or 3 weekends ago, I think on a Sunday was the latest.

smiley-signs006 XXX Nope, wanna guess again?

This time, try actually linking to your statement(s); if one exists.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 06:55PM
not my job to do your research.



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/22/2022 07:01PM by Racer X.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 22, 2022 08:55PM
Quote
Racer X
not my job to do your research.

Not my job to back up your claims.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 09:05PM
never said it was.



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 22, 2022 09:27PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Racer X
not my job to do your research.

Not my job to back up your claims.

Quote
Racer X
never said it was.

Do know how you reach that conclusion.
You claim you made statements on a topic, but you don't know when, and apparently can't provide proof yourself that you did make the statements, then you tell other it's "their job" to find your proof for you. nuts smiley
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 09:32PM
So, even draconian, life in prison penalties for firearms violations aren't stopping them in Jamaica.

"Firearms Act
Main article: Firearms Act (Jamaica)

The Firearms Act regulates the ownership and use of firearms and ammunition. It was first passed in 1967, and has been subsequently amended.

The Firearms Act prohibits ownership of any artillery, automatic firearm, grenade, bomb or other like missile. Law states that the applicants must have good reason to apply for firearm license without defining what constitutes a good reason, leaving it at the discretion of authority.

Firearm licences in Jamaica require a background check, inspection and payment of a yearly fee, and can make legal gun ownership difficult for ordinary citizens.[12][13] The new judicial procedures of the Gun Court Act were designed to ensure that firearms violations would be tried quickly and harshly punished.[4]

Firearm owners who do not wish to travel with their firearms are not allowed to leave them at home. They are obligated by law to deposit them at the local police station for safekeeping. Some airports also have a gun safe-keeping service. Storage costs $300/month ($500 for shotguns). Those found in violation of this law risk a maximum fine of $200,000 and a maximum sentence of 12 months in jail.[14]
Gun Court
Main article: Gun Court

The Gun Court was established by Parliament in 1974 to combat rising gun violence, and empowered to try suspects in camera, without a jury. The Supreme Court, Circuit Courts, and Resident Magistrate's Courts function as Gun Courts whenever they hear firearms cases. There is also a Western Regional Gun Court in Montego Bay. Those convicted by the Gun Court are imprisoned for life in a dedicated prison compound at South Camp in Kingston. Until 1999, the Gun Court sessions were also held in the same facility."

[en.wikipedia.org]



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Steve G.
Date: June 22, 2022 09:38PM
[mynorthwest.com]
Dori: Another local judge releases suspect considered ‘a danger to the community’
Mar 31, 2022, 5:48 PM | Updated: Apr 1, 2022, 8:13 am


Monson is married with three daughters and lives in Lake Forest Park, Washington. He has variously described himself as "right-leaning", "center right", and "libertarian", and said he voted for Bob Barr in the 2008 presidential election.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 22, 2022 11:48PM
And people wonder why I don't trust the legal system and law enforcement here locally to keep people safe. The judge KNEW even possession of a firearm was another instant felony, and a parole violation.

Catch and Release is supposed to be just fish, not felons.



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Racer X
Date: June 24, 2022 12:25AM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Racer X
not my job to do your research.

Not my job to back up your claims.

Quote
Racer X
never said it was.

Do know how you reach that conclusion.
You claim you made statements on a topic, but you don't know when, and apparently can't provide proof yourself that you did make the statements, then you tell other it's "their job" to find your proof for you. nuts smiley

sunday, june 4th 7pm. I told you when within a few hours. "2 or 3 weekends ago, I think on a Sunday was the latest. "



********************************************
“A sword never kills anybody; it is a tool in the killer's hand.” Seneca the Younger

The police have no duty to respond. See Castle Rock v. Gonzales, 545 U.S. 748 (2005) or Warren v. District of Columbia[1] (444 A.2d. 1, D.C. Ct. of Ap. 1981)

Judge Lee wrote that “we cannot jettison our constitutional rights, even if the goal behind a law is laudable." 9th Circuit Court of Appeals

[www.youtube.com]
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 24, 2022 08:31AM
Quote
Racer X
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Racer X
not my job to do your research.

Not my job to back up your claims.

Quote
Racer X
never said it was.

Do know how you reach that conclusion.
You claim you made statements on a topic, but you don't know when, and apparently can't provide proof yourself that you did make the statements, then you tell other it's "their job" to find your proof for you. nuts smiley

sunday, june 4th 7pm. I told you when within a few hours. "2 or 3 weekends ago, I think on a Sunday was the latest. "

1. "june 4th" was a Saturday on my planet.

Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
Racer X
Maybe they should try and find out why people are committing the crimes in the first place. Just a thought.

You keep trotting out this “question”, but never even offer an explanation as to “how”, let alone an answer to “why”.

2. Are you claiming your 7:00pm June 4th post is YOUR explanation of "why people are committing the crimes in the first place"?

If you are, please point out below WHERE you think you've done so. (NOTE: just saying you have doesn't count as actually having done so.)

Quote
Racer X
I've posted reasonable steps for root causes frequently, most recently, this afternoon.

Control access? Lock them up when not in use. It's that easy. When it comes to a disturbed teen who can use tools, you need a good pistol "vault" or an actual safe. Dad had a small safe for his, his dad's, and mom's dad's coin collections. So dad locked up the rifle bolts. Then they are just clubs. EVERY SINGLE PISTOL I have purchased since the late '90s new, or used with the original factory shipping package, had either a lockable hard plastic case, or a lock of some sort for the pistol itself, and almost every rifle had a lock of some sort. Won't defeat a teen with tools, but will stop a kid. So really, no parent has a legit excuse for a little kid getting to it. If it isn't with you, lock it up. Not in mommies purse across the house. And for @#$%& sake, not left in a car/truck. To me, that's negligent.

I've never studied the numbers across other countries, but other countries have mass knifings and other anti-social actions that I imagine have similar root causes. They are likely far better about managing those root causes than we are.
[forums.macresource.com]

I've pointed out your lack of response to this question before, and you keep claiming you have, but never actually do.
[forums.macresource.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 26, 2022 09:11AM
How do you protect your family with 3 men burst in to your home? "Wait gentlemen, let me go open my gun safe before you attack me and my family"
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Acer
Date: June 26, 2022 10:06AM
Quote
Mr645
How do you protect your family with 3 men burst in to your home?

How often does this happen? I mean an invasion where the perps are intent on bodily harm. Not just taking my TV while I sleep upstairs. Data would be very helpful. A gun in the home is its own safety risk, especially one not in a gun safe. It can be a target for thieves, it can be found by a young family member who does not understand it, it might go off accidentally as I fondle it. I must measure the risk the presence of a gun presents against the risk that my home will be invaded in such a manner where a gun at the ready would save my life. I need more information to assess the relative risk here.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/26/2022 10:07AM by Acer.
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: Mr645
Date: June 26, 2022 03:27PM
Quote
Acer
Quote
Mr645
How do you protect your family with 3 men burst in to your home?

How often does this happen? I mean an invasion where the perps are intent on bodily harm. Not just taking my TV while I sleep upstairs. Data would be very helpful. A gun in the home is its own safety risk, especially one not in a gun safe. It can be a target for thieves, it can be found by a young family member who does not understand it, it might go off accidentally as I fondle it. I must measure the risk the presence of a gun presents against the risk that my home will be invaded in such a manner where a gun at the ready would save my life. I need more information to assess the relative risk here.

There were an estimated 267,988 robberies nationwide in 2019. The estimated number of robberies decreased 4.7 percent from the 2018 estimate and decreased 18.3 percent from the 2015 estimate.
[ucr.fbi.gov]

[www.forbes.com]
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Re: 5 mass shootings Sunday
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: June 26, 2022 04:05PM
Quote
Mr645
There were an estimated 267,988 robberies nationwide in 2019. The estimated number of robberies decreased 4.7 percent from the 2018 estimate and decreased 18.3 percent from the 2015 estimate.
[ucr.fbi.gov]

And AGAIN you fail to read your own links! You’re batting a thousand!

“The estimated robbery rate of 81.6 per 100,000 inhabitants…” That’s only 0.0816% of the population!

“Among the robberies for which the UCR Program received weapon information in 2019, strong-arm tactics were used in 44.8 percent, firearms in 36.4 percent, and knives or cutting instruments in 8.5 percent. Other dangerous weapons were used in 10.3 percent of robberies in 2019.”

Quote
Mr645
https://www.forbes.com/advisor/home-improvement/home-burglary-facts-and-stats/

This link is about BURGLARY, not “robberies”. That you don’t know the difference, is not at all surprising. facepalm
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