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Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 19, 2022 09:44AM
Please move to a Southern state and help us change the political and social dynamics.

So wrote NYT columnist and Tennessee resident Margaret Renkl.

She's a wonderful author and I love her books, esp. about nature.

I get what she's saying but oh howdy she set off a storm in the comments.

Gifting the column if you'd like to read it.


Dear Liberals: Come On Down! [www.nytimes.com]
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Rolando
Date: July 19, 2022 11:08AM
Seems like moving to WY or Montana would be effective and get 2/4 senators.



San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

"I don’t want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it." - Billy Graham 1981

"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: rgG
Date: July 19, 2022 11:13AM
Quote
Rolando
Seems like moving to WY or Montana would be effective and get 2/4 senators.

But man is it sparsely populated in most of WY or Montana, if you are used to being in a northern city, it would be quite the adjustment, not that moving south wouldn’t be an adjustment, but at least there are more varied options.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: hal
Date: July 19, 2022 11:32AM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Please move to a Southern state and help us change the political and social dynamics.

So wrote NYT columnist and Tennessee resident Margaret Renkl.

She's a wonderful author and I love her books, esp. about nature.

I get what she's saying but oh howdy she set off a storm in the comments.

Gifting the column if you'd like to read it.


Dear Liberals: Come On Down! [www.nytimes.com]

I haven't read her books, but her writing on NYT is wonderful - she really has a gift of explaining southern attitudes in a way northerners can understand.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 19, 2022 11:40AM
Other than Red State politics, I love the South. I don't want it more homogenized than it's already becoming.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 19, 2022 11:48AM
Quote
Rolando
Seems like moving to WY or Montana would be effective and get 2/4 senators.

Beautiful Montana would be the he best shot but even there, Trump won by 16 points in 2020.

Oil and ranching politics will be tough to beat, though the cities of the state are generally blue.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 19, 2022 11:51AM
Quote
vision63
Other than Red State politics, I love the South. I don't want it more homogenized than it's already becoming.

You mean like..
Starbucks and Panera on every cormer?

Yeah, our entire country is going that way. But we're holding onto our good and original quirks pretty well.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 19, 2022 11:59AM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
vision63
Other than Red State politics, I love the South. I don't want it more homogenized than it's already becoming.

You mean like..
Starbucks and Panera on every cormer?

Yeah, our entire country is going that way. But we're holding onto our good and original quirks pretty well.

All that's there. I just really like "southerness." My family is from Louisiana and Georgia. I truly love love where you are. Especially Low Country. I love the differences between the regions of the South. A south Louisiana accent is different from a Mid-South accent.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mattkime
Date: July 19, 2022 12:38PM
Sorry, my kids need to get an education.



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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: DeusxMac
Date: July 19, 2022 12:59PM
Quote
mattkime
Sorry, my kids need to get an education.

jest smiley
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mattkime
Date: July 19, 2022 01:15PM
Quote
DeusxMac
Quote
mattkime
Sorry, my kids need to get an education.

jest smiley

Not entirely a joke. Moving to Chattanooga, TN was almost considered. I say almost because we had already decided to move to Madison, WI. It was a last ditch effort by my wife to avoid snow and be closer to her family (but still 4 hours away).



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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 19, 2022 01:37PM
Quote
vision63
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
vision63
Other than Red State politics, I love the South. I don't want it more homogenized than it's already becoming.

You mean like..
Starbucks and Panera on every cormer?

Yeah, our entire country is going that way. But we're holding onto our good and original quirks pretty well.

All that's there. I just really like "southerness." My family is from Louisiana and Georgia. I truly love love where you are. Especially Low Country. I love the differences between the regions of the South. A south Louisiana accent is different from a Mid-South accent.

I've been happy to be back home.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 19, 2022 01:38PM
Quote
mattkime
Sorry, my kids need to get an education.

Absolutely. We want that for your kids too.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: July 19, 2022 02:19PM
Quote
Rolando
Seems like moving to WY or Montana would be effective and get 2/4 senators.

yes, agree, plus you can still homestead on parts of that state, correct?
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mattkime
Date: July 19, 2022 03:22PM
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
mattkime
Sorry, my kids need to get an education.

Absolutely. We want that for your kids too.

Perhaps that statement wasn't entirely fair. When I grew up here the public education system was excellent. Its hung on reasonably well despite a gerrymandered republican state legislature for....a long time now.

Wisconsin has its problems. Other places have their problems too. In the end, I'm really not sure how much of a difference there is. Also, school rankings suck as they're almost entirely a measure of wealth.



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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: pdq
Date: July 19, 2022 05:04PM
IMHO, Madison is a great place to live and raise a family.

They used to call it something like 20 square miles of [something good, I forget] surrounded by (increasingly ugly) reality.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: rgG
Date: July 19, 2022 06:38PM
Quote
mattkime
Quote
Lemon Drop
Quote
mattkime
Sorry, my kids need to get an education.

Absolutely. We want that for your kids too.

Perhaps that statement wasn't entirely fair. When I grew up here the public education system was excellent. Its hung on reasonably well despite a gerrymandered republican state legislature for....a long time now.

Wisconsin has its problems. Other places have their problems too. In the end, I'm really not sure how much of a difference there is. Also, school rankings suck as they're almost entirely a measure of wealth.

There are some great public schools in GA and some awful ones. As you said, it is almost always directly related to the wealth of the area surrounding the school. We opted for a very good private school for our daughter. It was the best money we ever spent.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Lux Interior
Date: July 19, 2022 08:26PM
I was listening to something on the radio, where they were talking about cities losing population because of people moving to more rural areas now that remote working is more "accepted."

It made me wonder, are they liberals who are sick of the city, or conservatives, who are sick of the liberals?
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 19, 2022 08:47PM
No. It's people that feel priced out of where they live.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mattkime
Date: July 19, 2022 09:00PM
Quote
vision63
No. It's people that feel priced out of where they live.

From the people I know - its definitely this. I guess I did the same before it was cool. :-) The transition had its difficulties but it was definitely the right choice.



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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mattkime
Date: July 19, 2022 09:55PM
Quote
rgG
There are some great public schools in GA and some awful ones. As you said, it is almost always directly related to the wealth of the area surrounding the school. We opted for a very good private school for our daughter. It was the best money we ever spent.

I find this topic fascinating because I've been very surprised by the people who choose private school. I wouldn't switch to private unless I tired of fighting for what my child needed. Its something difficult to discuss directly unless you know people _really_ well.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: $tevie
Date: July 20, 2022 12:01AM
My brother and his wife, and my mother, somehow ended up in Mississippi. It's beautiful where they are, it's across the river from Memphis, it's full of kind, friendly people. Kind, friendly, Trumpy people. I would last a week maybe.



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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 20, 2022 01:29AM
Quote
$tevie
My brother and his wife, and my mother, somehow ended up in Mississippi. It's beautiful where they are, it's across the river from Memphis, it's full of kind, friendly people. Kind, friendly, Trumpy people. I would last a week maybe.

That's Delta Blues country. I have cousins in Holly Springs near there. My main cousin there taught at Rust College and really nice HBCU. I visited in January 2017 and had fun. Ate too much.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: rgG
Date: July 20, 2022 09:18AM
Quote
mattkime
Quote
rgG
There are some great public schools in GA and some awful ones. As you said, it is almost always directly related to the wealth of the area surrounding the school. We opted for a very good private school for our daughter. It was the best money we ever spent.

I find this topic fascinating because I've been very surprised by the people who choose private school. I wouldn't switch to private unless I tired of fighting for what my child needed. Its something difficult to discuss directly unless you know people _really_ well.

Yeah, my husband was a private school kid. I went only to public school. I went to 17 different schools in many different states, because of of my dad’s job. I have a unique perspective on education, as you can imagine.
I think you get out of any school what you put into it. The private school we chose for our daughter worked out well for her and for us, but she could have gotten a fine public school education, too.
She went to a public university.
She got far more out of her pre-K through 12 education than she did out of her double degree from her university education. It might be that her field of study, advertising (second degree in Spanish), didn’t really benefit from higher level education as much as other fields.
If I had to guess, she would probably want any children she would have to go to private school. It may just be what you know and if you had a positive experience.
There were kids that got very little from the same school she went to, but as I said, I think you get out of a school what you put into it. It is often more easily available to get some of the specialized things you want from some private schools though. Her school had a university level arts program: photography, painting, dance, etc., which she benefitted from greatly. They also had an EXCELLENT language program, both English and foreign. She was at at least Sophmore maybe higher in both English and Spanish when she got to university.





Roswell, GA (Atlanta suburb)
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Lemon Drop
Date: July 20, 2022 09:37AM
My two nieces got excellent public school educations in upstate South Carolina. Had all the sports and arts they wanted on top of college prep. Both got into excellent private universities and completed degrees in 3 years due to AP credits. One has a cool consulting job in DC and the other is headed to medical school.

Yes, it's what you make of it. In my experience kids of educated parents do well pretty much across the board.

I evaluate schools based on how well they serve the kids whose folks did not go to college. Every state has work to do there.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mattkime
Date: July 20, 2022 09:53AM
>It may just be what you know and if you had a positive experience.

Yes, this is what I've expected but I've been hesitant to verify.

Where I grew up, public schools had more to offer. The private schools were good at keeping out the riffraff but too small to offer AP level courses. I bet you could have gotten what you needed but it would have been a one off study with a teacher - I'm just speculating.

My public school education could have provided better guidance - if you were likely to get into the big state school they considered that a big victory and there was basically nothing more to be done. I could have paced myself better with AP courses and navigated SATs better. I wasn't interested in going to Harvard or similar but the path should have been clear. I'm also not sure if this would have changed my trajectory.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/20/2022 09:58AM by mattkime.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: mrbigstuff
Date: July 20, 2022 02:15PM
Quote
$tevie
My brother and his wife, and my mother, somehow ended up in Mississippi. It's beautiful where they are, it's across the river from Memphis, it's full of kind, friendly people. Kind, friendly, Trumpy people. I would last a week maybe.

Not to start a full-on culture war, but I don't find people from the south all that "kind," I find them polite. I think there's a huge difference.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: vision63
Date: July 20, 2022 02:36PM
Quote
mrbigstuff
Quote
$tevie
My brother and his wife, and my mother, somehow ended up in Mississippi. It's beautiful where they are, it's across the river from Memphis, it's full of kind, friendly people. Kind, friendly, Trumpy people. I would last a week maybe.

Not to start a full-on culture war, but I don't find people from the south all that "kind," I find them polite. I think there's a huge difference.

It's like when I lived in NYC. Everybody was mean, especially on my job. BUT, when I was able to get past their tough front ends, they were cream puffs.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: kj
Date: July 20, 2022 02:59PM
I'm sure there are kind people everywhere. And it's not bad when the default is polite, even when they aren't kind people. I vacillate between "most people are kind" and "most people are jerks". I guess there are other options like "everyone probably is both at times".
I had a recent car incident where I guy in his jacked up pickup (I don't like them) jumped out and helped me push my car to a gas station. Then another dude let me jump on his hotspot with my watch to text my wife. Kind, because they gave of themselves for nothing in return. I honestly believe there is something to the "poor people are often kinder" thing though.
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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: $tevie
Date: July 20, 2022 03:43PM
Quote
vision63
Quote
$tevie
My brother and his wife, and my mother, somehow ended up in Mississippi. It's beautiful where they are, it's across the river from Memphis, it's full of kind, friendly people. Kind, friendly, Trumpy people. I would last a week maybe.

That's Delta Blues country. I have cousins in Holly Springs near there. My main cousin there taught at Rust College and really nice HBCU. I visited in January 2017 and had fun. Ate too much.
Forgot about the food. I would last more than a week just visiting all the BBQ joints!



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Re: Dear liberals, come on down!
Posted by: Mr645
Date: July 24, 2022 02:46PM
Northern leftists don't like moving to the South because everyone has like 12 guns, at least 5,000 rounds of ammo and parks their pick dup in Tesla spots.
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