"Well, you know, my shotgun will do better for you than your AR-15, because you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door. two blasts and trust me, they'll be gone"....Joe Biden

Joe, if you shoot someone through your door, before they break into your house, that's called murder

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"No Comment"

That is a phenomenally irresponsible thing for a president to say.

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"Defending your own life when in immediate danger to me is a basic right of each person. " Lemon Drop 11/17/2023 03:10 pm

Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008) Private citizens have the right under the Second Amendment to possess an ordinary type of weapon and use it for lawful, historically established situations such as self-defense in a home, even when there is no relationship to a local militia.

"The conclusion is thus inescapable that the history, concept, and wording of the second amendment to the Constitution of the United States, as well as its interpretation by every major commentator and court in the first half-century after its ratification, indicates that what is protected is an individual right of a private citizen to own and carry firearms in a peaceful manner." Right to Keep and Bear Arms: Report of the Subcommittee on the Constitution of the Committee on the Judiciary, United States Senate, Ninety-seventh Congress, Second Session. U.S. Government Printing Office. 1982. Digitized September 30, 2008.

From the NYSRPA v Bruen "Today, we decline to adopt that two-part approach. . . . Despite the popularity of this two-step approach, it is one step too many. Step one of the predominant framework is broadly consistent with Heller, which demands a test rooted in the Second Amendment's text, as informed by history."

An old gun-hugger meme (but that’s no real surprise.)

[www.snopes.com]

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DeusxMac
An old gun-hugger meme (but that’s no real surprise.)

[www.snopes.com]

What's True

Biden did once say, "[If] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door."


And that is still a phenomenally irresponsible thing for a president to say, under any context.

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"Defending your own life when in immediate danger to me is a basic right of each person. " Lemon Drop 11/17/2023 03:10 pm

Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008) Private citizens have the right under the Second Amendment to possess an ordinary type of weapon and use it for lawful, historically established situations such as self-defense in a home, even when there is no relationship to a local militia.

"The conclusion is thus inescapable that the history, concept, and wording of the second amendment to the Constitution of the United States, as well as its interpretation by every major commentator and court in the first half-century after its ratification, indicates that what is protected is an individual right of a private citizen to own and carry firearms in a peaceful manner." Right to Keep and Bear Arms: Report of the Subcommittee on the Constitution of the Committee on the Judiciary, United States Senate, Ninety-seventh Congress, Second Session. U.S. Government Printing Office. 1982. Digitized September 30, 2008.

From the NYSRPA v Bruen "Today, we decline to adopt that two-part approach. . . . Despite the popularity of this two-step approach, it is one step too many. Step one of the predominant framework is broadly consistent with Heller, which demands a test rooted in the Second Amendment's text, as informed by history."

Quote
Smote

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DeusxMac
An old gun-hugger meme (but that’s no real surprise.)

[www.snopes.com]

What's True

Biden did once say, "[If] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door."


And that is still a phenomenally irresponsible thing for a president to say, under any context.

It’s telling that you will flood this forum with waves of arcane minutiae about ammunition types, gun calibers, and court cases about guns, but blatantly (self servingly) ignore pertinent contextual details about stories like this Biden quote.

That’s a phenomenally irresponsible taking-a-quote-out-of-context.

Biden, responding to someone who was asking if an AR-15 would be more useful than a simple shotgun “if the end days come” :

Quote

I did one of these town-hall meetings on the Internet and one guy said, "Well, what happens when the end days come?”

[Replied Biden], "Well, you know, my shotgun will do better for you than your AR-15, because [if] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door."

Notice he did not say at someone. He didn’t say, if you need to take someone out, fire blindly. He said if you need to keep someone away from your house (in imaginary “end days”).

A similar earlier quote from Biden:

Quote

…as I told my wife -- we live in an area that's wooded and somewhat secluded, "Jill, if there's ever a problem just walk out on the balcony here, walk out, put that double-barrelled shotgun and fire two blasts outside the house." I promise you, whoever's coming in is not -- you don't need an AR-15. It's harder to aim, it's harder to use, and in fact you don't need 30 rounds to protect yourself.

Notice again, he’s talking about scaring someone away, not advising his wife to commit murder from the second floor. And he didn’t once mention hoping to have to “mop up” some perceived threatening person after he’s done with them (which can’t be said for some on this board).

As snopes points out:

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First, Biden was speaking favorably about the use of a shotgun for self-defense in comparison with the use of an AR-15. He was not promoting shotguns in a television commercial nor recommending their use on his own initiative. He was making a broader point about what he perceived as the limited justifications for owning and using an AR-15 rifle after having been asked about the issue of self-defense specifically.

…and frankly, he’s right. Two shotgun blasts are going to scare away pretty much anyone, perhaps even better than the pop-pop of an assault rifle. And if you were ever in the exceedingly unlikely situation of genuinely being in danger of your life at close quarters, the wider spread of a shotgun makes perfect aim less critical, as evidenced by the usual “fifteen shots were fired and three hit their target” reports common - typical, even - with, say, handguns.

Of course the bonus is, we could live without military weapons in the hands of cosplaying waa-hoos who are just itching to use their deadly fondle-toys. But those cosplaying was-hoos are going to everything they can to keep their deadly fondle-toys, including taking quotes wildly out of context.

There. Now that that’s cleared up, did you know CBS (actually, Paramount Plus) has the rights to Thursday Night Football these days?

Are the Chicago stats late, that we have hoist up this tired crap yet one more time?

Mama says, stupid is as stupid posts…

user ignored - click to show/hide this message

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g=

the other nice thing about randomly shooting the shotgun vs the AR15 is that the shot in the shotgun will disperse and have much shorter range than an AR15. the AR15 could go much further and hit someone.

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Skill without imagination is craftsmanship. Imagination without skill is Modern Art.

user ignored - click to show/hide this message

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Freya says, 'Hello from NOLA, baby!' (Laissez bon temps rouler!)

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DeusxMac

Quote
Smote

Quote
DeusxMac
An old gun-hugger meme (but that’s no real surprise.)

[www.snopes.com]

What's True

Biden did once say, "[If] you want to keep someone away from your house, just fire the shotgun through the door."


And that is still a phenomenally irresponsible thing for a president to say, under any context.

It’s telling that you will flood this forum with waves of arcane minutiae about ammunition types, gun calibers, and court cases about guns, but blatantly (self servingly) ignore pertinent contextual details about stories like this Biden quote.

Has nothing to do with caliber or weapon type. you NEVER fire a weapon unless you have a target in sight and know whatever is eyed the target is safe

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"No Comment"

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timg
the other nice thing about randomly shooting the shotgun vs the AR15 is that the shot in the shotgun will disperse and have much shorter range than an AR15. the AR15 could go much further and hit someone.

There is nothing remotely nice, or acceptable about randomly firing a weapon regardless of type. It is 100% irresponsible and dangerous to randomly fire a weapon.

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"No Comment"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/26/2023 06:43AM by Mr645.

No reason to discuss gun safety if 1/2 the country, including our President has no interest in gun safety

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"No Comment"

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timg
the other nice thing about randomly shooting the shotgun vs the AR15 is that the shot in the shotgun will disperse and have much shorter range than an AR15. the AR15 could go much further and hit someone.

Now this is the type of contribution to the discussion that one would expect a responsible gun owner to make.

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It is what it is.

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N-OS X-tasy!

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timg
the other nice thing about randomly shooting the shotgun vs the AR15 is that the shot in the shotgun will disperse and have much shorter range than an AR15. the AR15 could go much further and hit someone.

Now this is the type of contribution to the discussion that one would expect a responsible gun owner to make.

I resent that characterization. I am neither responsible nor a gun owner.

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Skill without imagination is craftsmanship. Imagination without skill is Modern Art.

Quote
Smote
That is a phenomenally irresponsible thing for a president to say.

2018

He was a private citizen, former Senator, former VP.

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San Antonio, TX (in the old city)


"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing." - Edmund Burke
“Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented." - Eli Weisel

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." - Theodore Roosevelt (1918)

"I don’t want to see religious bigotry in any form. It would disturb me if there was a wedding between the religious fundamentalists and the political right. The hard right has no interest in religion except to manipulate it." - Billy Graham 1981

"Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can't and won't compromise" - Barry Goldwater

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Rolando

Quote
Smote
That is a phenomenally irresponsible thing for a president to say.

2018

He was a private citizen, former Senator, former VP.

fair enough.

That is a phenomenally irresponsible thing for a former VP to say. Most be a hunting buddy of Dick Cheney.

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"Defending your own life when in immediate danger to me is a basic right of each person. " Lemon Drop 11/17/2023 03:10 pm

Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008) Private citizens have the right under the Second Amendment to possess an ordinary type of weapon and use it for lawful, historically established situations such as self-defense in a home, even when there is no relationship to a local militia.

"The conclusion is thus inescapable that the history, concept, and wording of the second amendment to the Constitution of the United States, as well as its interpretation by every major commentator and court in the first half-century after its ratification, indicates that what is protected is an individual right of a private citizen to own and carry firearms in a peaceful manner." Right to Keep and Bear Arms: Report of the Subcommittee on the Constitution of the Committee on the Judiciary, United States Senate, Ninety-seventh Congress, Second Session. U.S. Government Printing Office. 1982. Digitized September 30, 2008.

From the NYSRPA v Bruen "Today, we decline to adopt that two-part approach. . . . Despite the popularity of this two-step approach, it is one step too many. Step one of the predominant framework is broadly consistent with Heller, which demands a test rooted in the Second Amendment's text, as informed by history."

I think it’s beyond ironic that the gunners on this forum are lecturing us about gun safety in a country that has ~50,000 gun deaths each year, and they’re doing their darndest to keep it that way.

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pdq
I think it’s beyond ironic that the gunners on this forum are lecturing us about gun safety in a country that has ~50,000 gun deaths each year, and they’re doing their darndest to keep it that way.

You only just noticed our two NRA-stooges?

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pdq
I think it’s beyond ironic that the gunners on this forum are lecturing us about gun safety in a country that has ~50,000 gun deaths each year, and they’re doing their darndest to keep it that way.

In any normal world, we lean on experts to solve problems. In this case we should listen to experts on firearms and violence and mental health. But in the USA when it comes to gun violence, we're listening to clowns that have no clue about the subject.

"Pistol braces increase the caliber of a pistol"
"The AR-5 is a weapon of war"
"We need more comprehensive background checks, except for my son"
"300,000,000 Americans have died from gun violence"
"a 9mm bullet blows he lungs out of the body"
"I like it when kids run my hairy legs"

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"No Comment"

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Mr645

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pdq
I think it’s beyond ironic that the gunners on this forum are lecturing us about gun safety in a country that has ~50,000 gun deaths each year, and they’re doing their darndest to keep it that way.

… in the USA when it comes to gun violence, we're listening to clowns that have no clue about the subject.

No, we’ve never listened to you.

In other news, an interesting story from Britain:

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A meeting of the North Wales Police and Crime Panel heard the area had 37,684 firearms and shotguns linked to just 12,354 licences.

It means one person could have "a small arsenal" warned Flintshire councillor Chris Bithell.

Why yes, yes it could. What’s wrong with that (other than the obvious danger of a nutjob with an arsenal)?

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"The danger is break-ins and then these weapons get into the wrong hands."

Four hundred thousand guns stolen, every year, over on this side of the pond, from all those Responsible Gun Owners™ who always keep their guns secured.

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Gun owners must reapply for their licence every five years the panel meeting at Bodlondeb, Conwy, was also told on Tuesday.

… North Wales has 45 registered firearms dealers, the report also revealed, with each required to reapply for their licence every three years.

Won’t someone think about the hunters and target shooters?

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According to the British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC) over a million people a year participate in shooting, including stalking, shooting, hunting, clay shooting and target shooting.

But what if you don’t have a license?

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Provisions exist for those without a Firearm or Shotgun certificate to shoot under the supervision of a certificate holder.

Seems like a good idea to me.

But freedumb!

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The Human Freedom Index gives each country a score from 0 to 10, wherein a score of 10 represents the most freedom and 0 represents no freedom at all, in each of the 82 indicators.

…14. UK 8.75
15. US 8.73

You know where we do beat them? In gun deaths, by 45-fold, by homicide rate (over 4-fold), and suicide rate (over 2 fold).

That’s not fair- we’re completely different from them!



Yup- we’re gun crazy, and the lesser for it.

We don’t have to live like this. In fact, it’s damn crazy to live like this.

BTW, this is how those Responsible Gun Owners™ do it down in Texas.

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Early on Monday, an off-duty Texas highway patrol officer thought someone was trying to break into his apartment in Houston, according to authorities. He pulled his gun out, shot the person behind his shuttered door - and realized it was his neighbor, officials said.

Understandable. His neighbor was Black.

Yet another successful DGU. There are several more-or-less-identical shoot-first, ask-questions see-who-you’ve-shot later DGU events recounted at the link.

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pdq
BTW, this is how those Responsible Gun Owners™ do it down in Texas.

Quote

Early on Monday, an off-duty Texas highway patrol officer thought someone was trying to break into his apartment in Houston, according to authorities. He pulled his gun out, shot the person behind his shuttered door - and realized it was his neighbor, officials said.

Understandable. His neighbor was Black.

Yet another successful DGU. There are several more-or-less-identical shoot-first, ask-questions see-who-you’ve-shot later DGU events recounted at the link.

Just following President Biden's instructions.

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"No Comment"

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Mr645

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pdq
BTW, this is how those Responsible Gun Owners™ do it down in Texas.

Quote

Early on Monday, an off-duty Texas highway patrol officer thought someone was trying to break into his apartment in Houston, according to authorities. He pulled his gun out, shot the person behind his shuttered door - and realized it was his neighbor, officials said.

Understandable. His neighbor was Black.

Yet another successful DGU. There are several more-or-less-identical shoot-first, ask-questions see-who-you’ve-shot later DGU events recounted at the link.

Just following President Biden's instructions.

Close, but no cigar...

"Just following former VP Biden's scenario"

It wasn't even a call to action, if you read carefully.

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decay
It wasn't even a call to action, if you read carefully.

There’s the rub. There’ve been more than enough demonstrations that THAT never happens.