A woman will be denied free National Health Service treatment for breast cancer if she seeks
to improve her chances by paying privately for an additional drug. Colette Mills, a former
nurse, has been told that if she attempts to top up her treatment privately, she will have to
foot the entire £10,000 bill for her drugs and care. The bizarre threat stems from the refusal
by the government to let patients pay for additional drugs that are not prescribed on the NHS.

[www.timesonline.co.uk]

BUT, they won't provide the drug because it's too expensive. It's a HORRIBLE system.

What Hillarycare will look like.

From the article:

"Ministers say it is unfair on patients who cannot afford such top-up drugs and that it will create a two-tier NHS. It is thought thousands of patients suffer as a result of the policy."

The only problem is that there already is a two tier system. This policy only affects those in the middle. The wealthy could care less about this; they'll just go to a private clinic where they get anything they want.

Anyone who is favoring Hillary or Obama probably doesn't have an IQ high enough to
understand what Universal Health Care truly means, other than free free free.

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Comandanta_Blankenship
Anyone who is favoring Hillary or Obama probably doesn't have an IQ high enough to
understand what Universal Health Care truly means, other than free free free.

Didn't I just see Huckabee being interviewed, stating that we need national health care?

I don't think this is really going to fly as a partisan issue.

Anyways, aren't there a lot of incarnations a "universal health care:" can take, other than a government run, national health care system?

By the way, I'm not trying to suggest by any means that our government is not capable of coming up with the most god-awful, works for no-one system.

anyone who thinks we have "free market healthcare" doesn't know what a free market is

its disappointing that we need to get past the mindless drones chanting "free market fixes all!" before we can have a rational debate on fixing our healthcare system.

---

Okay, first off let me say that Shakeman is an idiot.

Then let me remind Shakeman and Freeradical that managed healthcare is managed healthcare -- whether the idiotic and life-threatening decisions are being made by government officials, or by cube-crawlers in an office at Kaiser or Blue Cross.

What we should all be working for is a single-payer system that does not suck as badly as what we have now. A system where cognizant physicians have their decisions reviewed by other physicians, and policies are not set by accountants who put a higher priority on share-holder value than the health and comfort of the patient.

A system in which the only patients who will be refused coverage are the ones who want to go to chiropractors and naturopaths.

Oh, and don't let us forget that Shakeman is an idiot.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2007 01:20AM by Smote.

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x-uri
Okay, first off let me say that Shakeman is an idiot.

But a pretty good troll.

Quote
x-uri
Okay, first off let me say that Shakeman is an idiot.

Then let me remind Shakeman and Freeradical that managed healthcare is managed healthcare -- whether the idiotic and life-threatening decisions are being made by government officials, or by cube-crawlers in an office at Kaiser or Blue Cross.

What we should all be working for is a single-payer system that does not suck as badly as what we have now. A system where cognizant physicians have their decisions reviewed by other physicians, and policies are not set by accountants who put a higher priority on share-holder value than the health and comfort of the patient.

A system in which the only patients who will be refused coverage are the ones who want to go to chiropractors and naturopaths.

Oh, and don't let us forget that Shakeman is an idiot.

Post reported.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2007 01:25AM by Smote.

Quote



What Hillarycare will look like.

hillarycare is much worse!

There will be Gatekeeper doctors that will have the say whether or not you get to see a doctor;
the fewer who see doctors, the more money will be lft for his kickback at the end of the year.
Anyone 55 or over is automatically denied seeing a doctor.

If you try to go around the system, and find a doctor on your own or pay for your own
treatment, it is an offense that will land you in prison.

Quote
freeradical

Quote
x-uri
Okay, first off let me say that Shakeman is an idiot.

Then let me remind Shakeman and Freeradical that managed healthcare is managed healthcare -- whether the idiotic and life-threatening decisions are being made by government officials, or by cube-crawlers in an office at Kaiser or Blue Cross.

What we should all be working for is a single-payer system that does not suck as badly as what we have now. A system where cognizant physicians have their decisions reviewed by other physicians, and policies are not set by accountants who put a higher priority on share-holder value than the health and comfort of the patient.

A system in which the only patients who will be refused coverage are the ones who want to go to chiropractors and naturopaths.

Oh, and don't let us forget that Shakeman is an idiot.

Post reported.

And we need to know that because . . .?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2007 01:21AM by Smote.

Quote
Gabacho
.
Anyone 55 or over is automatically denied seeing a doctor.

That sounds likely. Thank you for elevating this discussion.

---

I suffer from the same sensitivity that you do. A few nuggets of wisdom were shared with me and I'm "trying" to incorporate them into my life. First, remember that nobody can hurt your feelings unless you let them. You can always reject what is being forced on you emotionally.
Second, nothing changes unless you change it. If you don't want the behavior to be repeated then you need to take action. Otherwise the kid has learned that his behavior is the way to get things done, because everyone lets him get away with it.
In the meantime I sympathize because I've been there.
-beerman

I am very tired of name calling. That's why I'm here now instead of DM.

x-uri used to call me "Fredical" over at DM. What he means of course is that he thinks I'm a "dick" because he's in political disagreement with me.

Quote
freeradical
I am very tired of name calling. That's why I'm here now instead of DM.

x-uri used to call me "Fredical" over at DM. What he means of course is that he thinks I'm a "dick" because he's in political disagreement with me.

I totally agree. "No name calling" is not that hard to understand, for a participant or (hopefully) a moderator; but to make a point out of announcing that you've reported a post doesn't make you look special. Admit it- you're the one posting "flagged§" thousands of times a minute on craigslist, aren't you?
Plus, it then makes it hard for a mod to figure out exactly what to do about it. Typically there would have been some sort of response by now (I would guess all moderators get the message, and at least one is awake and posting actively at the moment) so I must conclude you didn't really report it. So you're basically just continuing the fighting at the same level . . .

Stop whining h'. Some of us have lives to live, and people to love. Even the Mods.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2007 01:30AM by Smote.

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Smote
Stop whining h'. Some of us have lives to live, and people to love. Even the Mods.

Are you done editing yet, or is this the final masterwork?

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h'
By the way, I'm not trying to suggest by any means that our government is not capable of coming up with the most god-awful, works for no-one system.

That's definitely possible, and almost assuredly any such system would likely be imperfect, but they'd have to work extra hard to come up with a more god-awful, works for no-one system like the corporate-run system we currently have.

Oh, and by the way, I completely disagree with x-uri. Shakeman is a moron, not an idiot.

---

"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan

Quote
freeradical
I am very tired of name calling. That's why I'm here now instead of DM.

x-uri used to call me "Fredical" over at DM. What he means of course is that he thinks I'm a "dick" because he's in political disagreement with me.

Well welcome here. Expect to continue being called a dick if thats what your posts indicate you are. They did at DM and I'd be surprised if they don't here.

---

"Who's more foolish - the fool or the fool that follows him?" - Obi Wan Kenobi

Is DM the new AS?

---

"Who's more foolish - the fool or the fool that follows him?" - Obi Wan Kenobi

Quote
RgrF
Is DM the new AS?

That must mean that the AS crowd is slipping into complacency.

---

"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan

National health care systems always ration care, even if they don't call it rationing.

So why is there such a fuss over this article?

Quote
Bill in NC
National health care systems always ration care, even if they don't call it rationing.

Just as non-nationalized corporate health care systems always ration care. No matter what system you have, there is always a need to keep to some kind of budget. Corporate health care systems by their nature (large overhead, profits, etc) have less of a budget for health care than a nationalized system. The efficiency with which they spend their health care dollars is variable, but has little to do whether the systems are nationalized or corporate.

---

"In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they would actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion." (1987) -- Carl Sagan

The government, essentially told her to "SHUT UP, and DIE; so WHY doesn't she do as the
Government dictates?? Just like the Horse, in "Animal Farm", that thought he was headed to
the "old horse pasture", when he was being sent to the "Knackers".

Quote
davester
Oh, and by the way, I completely disagree with x-uri. Shakeman is a moron, not an idiot.

Why wasn't Shakeman's Moroness a big deal 40 years ago?

Actually, he's being promoted. Maybe you missed the memo

[forums.macresource.com]

Come to think of it, RgF if he is moving from Moron to Idiot, does that mean he is an Imbecile, or did he drop 20+ IQ points in one go?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/17/2007 06:56PM by x-uri.

Shakeman earns the special exemption due to his blatant posting under several different handles. And all those old animated YAAMS GIFs that Keef and others did have forever immortalized the meme. I guess Shakey should be proud.

Anyway: take the phrase "UK government" and substitute with "big US HMO" and you'll have the same old story repeated dozens of times. I just read in the paper this weekend about Kaiser doing the exact same thing to a Bay Area woman with breast cancer.

The UK's system is not so great; other European countries do it better.

Quote
x-uri

Quote
davester
Oh, and by the way, I completely disagree with x-uri. Shakeman is a moron, not an idiot.

Why wasn't Shakeman's Moroness a big deal 40 years ago?

Actually, he's being promoted. Maybe you missed the memo

[forums.macresource.com]

Come to think of it, RgF if he is moving from Moron to Idiot, does that mean he is an Imbecile, or did he drop 20+ IQ points in one go?

I wasn't aware that blatantly offensive labels still carried real world equivalencies.

---

"Who's more foolish - the fool or the fool that follows him?" - Obi Wan Kenobi

Quote
RgrF

I wasn't aware that blatantly offensive labels still carried real world equivalencies.

Well if the assessment you posted on Dec. 07 was casual, rather than informed, I will withdraw my remarks regarding Shakeman and concede the point to davester. In my future correspondence with this forum, Shakeman will remain a "moron", until such time as an expert diagnosis can be obtained.

My favorite YAAMS

---

Comedy Central: Best news channel that isn't a news channel.

Fox News: Best comedy channel that isn't a comedy channel.

Quote
x-uri

Quote
RgrF

I wasn't aware that blatantly offensive labels still carried real world equivalencies.

Well if the assessment you posted on Dec. 07 was casual, rather than informed, I will withdraw my remarks regarding Shakeman and concede the point to davester. In my future correspondence with this forum, Shakeman will remain a "moron", until such time as an expert diagnosis can be obtained.

Seems I'm completely uninformed about almost everything since he's actually a moran.

---

"Who's more foolish - the fool or the fool that follows him?" - Obi Wan Kenobi