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kjI think she is more so sticking up for men, to some degree. She does that a lot, and I appreciate it, because almost nobody does. [/quote

Much in the same way Rush sticks up for the oppressed, rich, white male.

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billb
She was on one of those Good Morning shows yesterday morning and the interviewer was basically trying to blame her, too.

Even went to - If the nomination is lost by Hillary because of the delegate loss it would be her fault.

I couldn't believe they went there.

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kj
That's not true at all Lux. There is no similarity between her and Rush. kj.

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Jimmypoo
Both are absolutely enthralled with themselves, find no faults whatsoever in their own behavior and are, psychologically speaking, textbook definitions of sociopaths.


Those two, and the many like them, I would pay to see rounded up and required to fight to the death. The winner is then killed by the spectators.

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Jimmypoo

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billb
She was on one of those Good Morning shows yesterday morning and the interviewer was basically trying to blame her, too.

Even went to - If the nomination is lost by Hillary because of the delegate loss it would be her fault.

I couldn't believe they went there.

Which SHE are you talking about? Too many of them here.

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kj
>>>yes, she does help some people...people that have low enough self-esteem and psychological sophistication that her stuff works. For the rest of us, she's an annoying bully.

Aren't you some sort of counsellor yourself? Arrogance must run in the discipline. Listen, my wife is quite a fan of Laura, and she's fricken' brilliant. Brains down to the armpits. Low self-esteem and psychological sophistication my ass.

If you could be honest and say you don't like her values, I could respect that. But the rest is B.S., and you _should_ know better. Your books (2 of which I'm familiar with) are fine for you, but I don't relate well to them, at all. It's not because i'm not sophisticated, or too dull, it's because the values that underly the approaches are too different from mine. I could spend a paragraph ripping them to shreds, but I don't know why I would. I'm sure they're helpful to some people. If you want to discuss particulars about her approach or philosophy, be my guest, but just calling her a crackpot doesn't mean a dang thing to anyone who doesn't already agree. kj.

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kj
>>well, I don't know your wife, so I can't make statements about her. For all I know, she's a fan of John Gray too

No she's not. But honestly, some of what he said wasn't such a bad thing for people to hear at that time. When I was growing up, it was completely taboo to even hint that women and men were different in any way. The reason women weren't playing in the nba was that they had been taught they couldn't. Well, he used some humor to point out that men and women are not the same, and allowed people to acknowledge the diffs. So he wasn't all bad.

what frustrated me about Gray is that he passed himself off as a marriage counselor when he was not. It's the dumbing down of america. Now, John Gottman's concepts are not terribly complex, but he doesn't get the press. That is frustrating.

>>My opinion is that Laura S. doesn't have a lot of psychological sophistication.

Sophisticated doesn't always mean better. I get pretty weary of people who go through all kinds of "sophisticated" contortions to explain their problems. Most of the time, it's a lot simpler than people make it out to be. But give them an ear, and they'll explain themselves for the rest of their lives, without really getting anywhere. My background is psychology, and I have to remind myself there is a difference between what I find interesting (complex), and what is actually useful (simple).

I agree re: your assessment of sophistication. Perhaps I should use a different phrase....black and white? She just doesn't see much gray in a world full of it. It just comes off as simple to me. Yes, it speaks to some people, but I think many of those people could be better served in other ways.

>>>That doesn't impact the humanity of the people...but we do reserve the right to discern. I consider myself fairly well-read in some spiritual areas and clearly can observe when people aren't as "sophisticated"

You really have to spend a fair amount of time with people to know how sophisticated they are. Sometimes "simple" is what people choose after a lifetime of screwing around with all kinds of esoteric stuff. Plus, I've never put much stock in people's self-assessment of sophistication. Or anything, for that matter.

Actually, a well-trained ear can learn pretty much all you need to know about a person in about 10 minutes. There are really only a few different life scripts..the details are different for each person, but the core stuff doesn't vary that much. Anyway, that sophistication word I use doesn't accurately portray what I'm trying to express and I think 'black and white thinking" does it better....does that sound less bourgeois? ;)

>>>I'm glad Laura s. works for you guys....I don't know you well enough to determine what it is in you that attracts you to her style...i personally think she's a philistine and a bully...but who knows, that might not be accurate.....but it's what I think...so there you have it..

btw, sorry with the way I worded that...made it look like I was calling you a Philistine and a bully...not intended...

She certainly is only one of many who make sense, sometimes. Our values are similar to her's in some ways, but she's not Christian, and we are, so a lot of what she says is contrary to our values. She's not like our guru. I think her "bullying" can be construed otherwise. People call her wanting to get validation for the things they are wanting to do, despite the fact they know it's wrong. They call knowing what her values are, and if their actions aren't serving those values, they're going to hear about it. If she was working with people with diverse sets of values, she'd have to approach it differently.

I think the real question is whether or not either of you would actually *call* into the show...my guess is 'no'; it's fun to watch other people get beaten down by her, so long as it's not us....but then again, if I was approaching problems in the way many of her callers do, perhaps I'd deserve a little abuse

>>>Does she discuss her history of extra-marital affairs much on her show? (I honestly don't know).

I don't listen to her that much, but I know she has discussed both that and mistakes she's made parenting. Do you have to be perfect to have an opinion? Most drug counsellors have a past involving substance abuse. Does that make them hypocrites? When a smoker says smoking is bad for you, are they incorrect? Hypocrisy is an overrated and misused label. kj.