advertisement
Forums

 

AAPL stock: Click Here

You are currently viewing the 'Friendly' Political Ranting forum
From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: Refurbvirgin
Date: March 15, 2006 12:01PM
"Hathaway's just-released novel, SUMMER SNOW, approaches peace from this meditative perspective. It is set amidst the war on terrorism as an American warrior falls in love with a Sufi Muslim and learns from her an alternative to the military mentality.

While Special Forces battle al-Qaeda, the escalating violence threatens their future together and the lives of thousands in her country. To save them, she shows him an ancient transcendental way to bring peace to the collective consciousness and prevent terrorism. But can they make it work in time?

The book's wisdom figure is a Sufi crone, the warrior's lover's teacher, who has survived by outsmarting male political and religious hierarchies. "This bin Laden, this Bush, all these leading men, they have highjacked us all with their violence," she states. "They have turned the whole world into their suicide airplane. These men are too primitive to have such power. Too ignorant of the underlying reality. We must stop them. We must take the boys' toys away from them...these terrible weapons.""

[www.countercurrents.org]

I questioned the Green Party's inclusion of "feminism" in their points of agreement, and never got any satisfactory answer, and resolved to interpret it as "gender equality" but if I define "feminism" as the nurturing, compassionate, healing side of what it is to be human then I can accept this as a necessary alternative to war as a means of conflict resolution.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: March 15, 2006 03:34PM
And you have read this work of fiction and want to post a book review ? Go for it.

I assume the author included the regional restrictions on the 'lovers', inasumch as the female character would have been stoned to death by her brothers, and the male character would have been murdered by his lover's brothers as an act of faith ?

I so love how 'sweeping novels' fail to reflect the local social mores.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: Refurbvirgin
Date: March 16, 2006 12:31AM
As I understand the book, which interested me primarily because of the transformation evident in its author, rather than its content, it's a meditative allegory, not meant to portray real events, but to cause the reader to contemplate alternative realities. Like any work of art, it is what you, as an individual, perceive it to be. I haven't read the book, nor do I have time to, and only posted it because I thought it was curious that a Green Beret would make such a swing in consciousness.

Sufis have as much to do with the sort of Muslim behavior you correctly identify as do Quakers with the sort of "Kill 'em all and let God sort 'em out" Christianity exemplified by George Bush's behavior.

"The central concept in Sufism is love. Dervishes—the name given to initiates of sufi orders—believe that love is a projection of the essence of God to the universe.They believe that God desires to recognize beauty, and as if one looks at a mirror to see oneself, God looks at himself within the dynamics of nature. This is substantiated using the famous Hadith Qudsi (extra-Qur'anic utterance of God): "I was a hidden treasure, and I wanted to be known, so I created Creation." Since they believe that everything is a reflection of God, Sufis try to see the beauty inside the apparently ugly, and to open arms even to what is considered the most evil one. The Sufi conception of divine love is not restricted to what the term "love of God" implies, it also includes human loves with a perspective that views everything a manifestation of God."
[en.wikipedia.org]

It is as grievous an error to judge all Muslims by the actions of Osama bin Laden as it is to judge all Christians by the actions of Timothy McVeigh.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: cbelt3
Date: March 16, 2006 11:18AM
Thank you, that was a thoughtful response. One note:
"..a Green Beret would make such a swing in consciousness."

Never underestimate the human mind, heart, and soul. Many thoughtful people have killed in war and healed in peace. The 'warrior poet' model is still viable- who better to understand life than those on the cusp of taking or losing it ?

It's a classic assumption that many people make that a 'soldier' is some kind of murderous insapient robotic creature with no redeeming characteristics whatsoever. Misconceptions of this type do not benefit any of us.

Oh, and do note that Special Forces personnel are specifically selected and weeded out until the most intelligent, adaptable, and perseverent of them remain. The "Rambo" films were a cartoon, and not reflecting of reality. My uncle served in 'Nam. He was grievously wounded during Tet, recovered, was given an honorable discharge, and went on to get his PhD. He's one of the more thoughtful people I know.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: cassie
Date: March 16, 2006 12:27PM
While I safely sit here in college, my father is currently serving a second tour in Iraq. He is a career military man and has been in the US Army Special Forces for as long as I can remember.

I have often found that those who have never served in the defense of our country have a stereotypical view of the military and seem to always get it wrong about those in uniform and how our military works.

Ignorance and loathing is particularly true of the majority of the professors and instructors I have in school. While almost all have never done a thing in the defense of this country, they are quick to point out how bad our military is and, for that matter, how bad our country is.

I'm aware that many of these educators believe that I'm just as stupid and brain washed as those in uniform. Meanwhile I wonder if these elitists are just hiding behind that thought. I also question if they would ever have the courage to defend America for any reason.

I e-mailed my dad about this thread. The phrase "warrior indoctrination I got in the Special Forces", written by Hathaway, makes my him laugh.

That so called Special Forces "warrior" doctrine is nothing more than being trained to be the best and to accomplish the mission if called upon while at the same time hoping that it will never be necessary. I imagine Hathaway would have the reader assume it meant rape pillage and plunder.

As an Army brat, I have been brought up around the military and have a very good understanding of the "Honor, duty and country" exhibited by those that have and are serving. I've cried at the sides a close friends who's husband and/or father's wont be coming home. It makes me angry to think of inane haters at times like these.

I know few men that want to see peace more than my dad and those he works with. He has always taught us to pray for a peaceful solution and that fighting is the last resort.

That Hathaway, one out of thousands of past and current Special Forces members, has seen the "light" does not impress.

That is all,


cassie


(BTW, "Green Berets" don't call themselves "Green Berets".)
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: Refurbvirgin
Date: March 16, 2006 03:19PM
cassie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> While I safely sit here in college, my father is
> currently serving a second tour in Iraq. He is a
> career military man and has been in the US Army
> Special Forces for as long as I can remember.

How does he feel about the fact that Bush admits to your father's part in killing over 30,000 Iraqis for lies? There were NO WMD, NO Iraq/Al Qaeda or 9-11 connections, so the sacrifices your father and his friends made were for naught. They have only increased the number of people willing to give their lives to strike at us, and created more danger for us, not made us safer. Even our generals admit that for every terrorist they kill in Iraq they create three more.

> I have often found that those who have never
> served in the defense of our country have a
> stereotypical view of the military and seem to
> always get it wrong about those in uniform and how
> our military works.

I believe we need a strong military, and am grateful that people like your father are willing to stand up to defend us, but unfortunately our military hasn't been used to defend this country or its freedom since at least WW2. While I've never served in the military, and chose prison instead of killing for Nixon, I have served my country as volunteer firefighter/EMT, and Search & Rescue Hasty Team member. In that capacity I've saved some lives or helped to do so. As far as not understanding how our military works, I had 13 kids from my high school killed for Johnson & Nixon lies, and had a close friend, a highly decorated door-gunner, kill himself when he came back because he couldn't live with what the military ordered him to do. He was not alone in that act, and estimates range as high as three times the number killed in Vietnam.
[www.google.com]

> Ignorance and loathing is particularly true of the
> majority of the professors and instructors I have
> in school. While almost all have never done a
> thing in the defense of this country, they are
> quick to point out how bad our military is and,
> for that matter, how bad our country is.

You are aware that we put Saddam in power, that we overthrew democracy in Iran, Guatemala, and Chile, that we support dictatorships and authoritarian, anti-democratic regimes throughout the world, and that our war on Vietnam killed two million people?
Have you read Gen. Smedley Butler's little book called "War Is A Racket" or Frank Dorrell's "Addicted to War?" If you believe that men like your father have always fought for what is right and that represents the highest ideals we were taught our nation stands for then you are at least as ignorant as the teachers you demean.

> I'm aware that many of these educators believe
> that I'm just as stupid and brain washed as those
> in uniform. Meanwhile I wonder if these elitists
> are just hiding behind that thought. I also
> question if they would ever have the courage to
> defend America for any reason.

I refused to seek conscientious objector deferment, and student deferments (like Dick Cheney did five times) because I felt that if my country was attacked I would emotionally respond to defend it, and the fact that my parents could afford to send me school shouldn't gain me special protection. Cheney had no such reservations, nor did his boss, who jumped the line to get into a "champagne unit" of the Tejas air guard, taking the place of someone more qualified who was perhaps sent to fight the war the cowardly bullies running our country avoided so assiduously.

> I e-mailed my dad about this thread. The phrase
> "warrior indoctrination I got in the Special
> Forces", written by Hathaway, makes my him laugh.
>
> That so called Special Forces "warrior" doctrine
> is nothing more than being trained to be the best
> and to accomplish the mission if called upon while
> at the same time hoping that it will never be
> necessary. I imagine Hathaway would have the
> reader assume it meant rape pillage and plunder.

My friend, Dar Neese, was trained also to "accomplish the mission," and in his case that was successful when he killed beaucoup civilians, as we are doing in Iraq. I hope your father comes home safe and sound and without the nightmares Dar lived with, and which eventually took his life.

> As an Army brat, I have been brought up around the
> military and have a very good understanding of the
> "Honor, duty and country" exhibited by those that
> have and are serving. I've cried at the sides a
> close friends who's husband and/or father's wont
> be coming home. It makes me angry to think of
> inane haters at times like these.

There is no honor in fighting a war based on lies, and the duty of a soldier is expressed in his or her vows to defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign AND domestic. While your father may believe he is fighting for the freedom of the Iraqi people at home we are losing ours. The greatest enemies of our freedom are here, not in Iraq. I am doing everything I can, and admittedly that's not much, to bring any soldier who does not believe in this war home as soon as possible. If your father believes he is fighting a noble cause then by all means stay, but a recent survey of our troops showed over 60% of them want to come home NOW. If freedom means anything then those who do not wish to die for Bush's lies shouldn't have to lay down their lives.

> I know few men that want to see peace more than my
> dad and those he works with. He has always taught
> us to pray for a peaceful solution and that
> fighting is the last resort.

Waging preemptive war for peace is like raping for virginity. We HUNG Germans for preemptive war, calling it "the supreme crime." Human Rights Watch says China has a worse human rights record than Saddam did. Yes, he was a brutal dictator, who killed tens of thousands, but so were Pinochet and the Shah and military juntas we've installed throughout Latin America. We knew, for instance, that Saddam was using poison gas (we had the receipts) when Rumsfeld was photo'd shaking his hand in 1983, but because we were trying to sell him an oil pipeline we overlooked that little nastiness. During Gulf War 1 W's daddy told the Shia & Kurds to rise up against Saddam. They did and slaughtered thousands of Saddam's Sunni brethren. Then Bush 1 witheld support and stood back and watched as Saddam took revenge, using gunships we'd provided him in clear violation of the so-called "No-fly Zones." That's where all those mass graves came from. We could have stopped it but chose not to because we didn't want the Shiites to gain control and align Iraq with Iran. Guess what your dad and his friends have accomplished with all their brave fighting? Now Bush is going to use this as an excuse to nuke Iran, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people.

During the Iran/Iraq war Henry Kissinger was quoted as saying, when asked which side we favored (since we were selling arms to both). His response was "I hope they kill each other." That's why we're using illegal weapons like cluster bombs, fuel air bombs, phosphorous, napalm, and most insidiously, depleted uranium. We want to depopulate the area, genocidally, to gain control of the oil in the region. We don't give spit for the people there. Your father may, and may believe that he's helping them, and may well be in his own way, but that is not why our leaders sent him there. Many veterans come home with DU in their lungs and experience the same sort of elevated levels of cancer and birth defects the Iraqi people suffer. I pray your father is not one of them, because Bush is cutting veterans programs. As Kissinger also said:

"Military men are just dumb stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy.”

That's how elites like Bush & Cheney view your father and his brave friends.
I pray they all come home alive and are still brave enough to defend our freedoms from real threats.

These are some of the posters I make to encourage people to demand those unwilling to sacrifice their lives for Bush's lies be brought home NOW.

images removed

Btw - Hathaway didn't refer to himself as a Green Beret in that review.





Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 03/19/2006 01:16PM by mrp-admin.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: Refurbvirgin
Date: March 16, 2006 07:47PM
Dar was a highly decorated helicopter doorgunner, with his pic in Life magazine as the doorgunner with the most combat missions. When he returned he told me how he'd been ordered to kill anything that moved in "free-fire zones." One time his chopper popped up over a treeline and saw a man fleeing across a rice paddy with a pack-laden water buffalo. Dar opened up on him and blew man and beast apart. They landed, inspected the packs and found rice and kids toys. The man was old, and no danger to them.

This was the only incident he told me about, but he intimated there were many such occurences, and that these actions troubled him greatly. He lived fast and hard and I couldn't keep up with him. A couple years later I heard that he'd been waving a shotgun around at a family birthday party, when his sister confronted him saying "Can't you see all the pain you're causing people?" Dar's response was "I'll show you what real pain is," stuck the shotgun in his mouth and pulled the trigger.

I wasn't there and only heard this second hand from a mutual friend. I do know with certainty that he is dead because cowardly men who never went to war, like Richard Nixon and George Bush, send young men to do the dirty work of the elite who never get blood on their hands.

Already returning veterans from Iraq are killing themselves, and the Pentagram's response to PTSD is entirely inadequate. For veterans who have killed in the heat of battle where the choice is kill or be killed I believe there is forgiveness, but Bush's response has been to cut veterans benefits and medical care and for that there is no forgiveness.
[www.google.com]
[www.google.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/16/2006 11:34PM by Refurbvirgin.
Options:  Reply • Quote
Re: From Green Beret to Peace Activist
Posted by: Refurbvirgin
Date: March 16, 2006 11:32PM
The Bush dynasty has closer links to the bin Ladens than Saddam Hussein did.
[www.oilempire.us]
Options:  Reply • Quote
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.

Click here to login

Online Users

Guests: 127
Record Number of Users: 186 on February 20, 2020
Record Number of Guests: 5122 on October 03, 2020